Help with predator 224

[aust9002]

I decided if I can hit 60 Ill take it all the way apart and give the whole frame a paint job

 

[aust9002]

Does it come with a stock carb? If so I have this that I bought awhile back that i can use for throttle linkage how does it come with everything but a flywheel? Lol

 

[panchothedog]

Hey BSR. That's a good one about the water. Ask any Grandma, they'll tell you Grandpa needs to drink more water. But you know how the old saying goes. You can lead the horse to water, but you can't make him drink. Never realized they were talking about us old men.
Sorry for highjacking your thread. It was just too tempting.

 

[BrownStainRacing]

Does it come with a stock carb? If so I have this that I bought awhile back that i can use for throttle linkage how does it come with everything but a flywheel? LolView attachment 142451View attachment 142452

Yes, lapp the flywheel.

It says it comes with the "how-r-ya" stock carb. I think thats what the pred 224 came with. It's nothing special.

Overly rich carbs will wash the rings when trying to break in a new engines. It takes forever to get the rings seated, if at all.

I find an old stock lean carb does pretty good when breaking in.

You got magnetic oil drain plugs???

 

[BrownStainRacing]

@aust9002

When I get mine in, I'm tear it down and check clearances and see what I'm need to it up to 9.8-10:1 CR with a stock style rod.

If it's like the pred 224, it's gonna need a .005" longer rod, and pred 212 hemi flat top piston.

Probably have to watch head gasket thickness and open up the chamber a lil to keep CR down.

I don't want to do that block clearance crap again with the billet rod, man what a PITA that was.

I'm waiting on a guy that has a a 196 he needs a refresh done on, before I can order more parts.

I know I need more gaskets, coils, drain plugs, pistons.

Here's those magnetic drain plugs.

Dover Power is 1 of my favorite suppliers.

You want a great carb, give Jerry a call. You'll be putting that nibbi up on the self,

He makes some nasty bored Stock Appearing carbs.

Magnetic Oil Drain Plugs (2 Pack) Small Block & Big Block

www.doverpoweronlinestore.com

 

[BrownStainRacing]

I'm conflicted.

Did the Predator MAX PERFORMANCE gas tank add 50hp or take away 50hp ????

She's back running, new tank, carb, gaskets, fuel line, airfilter and oil change.

 

[aust9002]

I'm conflicted.

Did the Predator MAX PERFORMANCE gas tank add 50hp or take away 50hp ????

She's back running, new tank, carb, gaskets, fuel line, airfilter and oil change.

View attachment 142453

It hurts my eyes lol maybe +10hp at least, I will deffinetly order some magnetic drain plugs, ill just run that stock carb for breakin then monday when I swap everything over Ill change out the carb too

 

[BrownStainRacing]

It hurts my eyes lol maybe +10hp at least, I will deffinetly order some magnetic drain plugs, ill just run that stock carb for breakin then monday when I swap everything over Ill change out the carb too

Get you some extra gaskets.

Jerry is the only 1 I know of that has the .012" thick x 70mm head gaskets.

If this Ducar is like the pred, then it's gonna need .024" thick gasket to get that .030" piston to head clearance. And that should make it around 9.1:1CR with the stock rod and dished piston.

Of coarse, I'm jus assuming, won't know til I get it apart.

 

[aust9002]

Get you some extra gaskets.

Jerry is the only 1 I know of that has the .012" thick x 70mm head gaskets.

If this Ducar is like the pred, then it's gonna need .024" thick gasket to get that .030" piston to head clearance. And that should make it around 9.1:1CR with the stock rod and dished piston.

Of coarse, I'm jus assuming, won't know til I get it apart.

I got lots of gaskets ill have to measure them when I get home because they are all different thicknesses, at that compression ratio would 93 octane be good or do I need to run higher?

 

[aust9002]

So as long as I run a .03 headgasket i should be fineee lol

 

[BrownStainRacing]

I got lots of gaskets ill have to measure them when I get home because they are all different thicknesses, at that compression ratio would 93 octane be good or do I need to run higher?

You will be fine with 87 octane at 9:1.

I'll run 10.5:1 on 87 octane....with the right cam and ignition timing.

Always measure the piston to deck, then pick a gasket that will give you CLOSEST to .030" piston to head clearance.

By all means .030" is not written in stone, but I've blowed more engines up when I got under that .030" number.

One bad calculation, and at the right moment, when you don't expect it, those tires come off the ground, rpm goes from 6000 to 9000 jus for a split second, and that piston smacks the head. Well, trust me....it's gonna be a bad day.

I've wrecked engines at .022", they wasn't cheap.
Lesson learned.
Keep the build safe jus incase that unexpected moment happens, and it will,......eventually.

Oh yea.... NICE riding area you got there.
Level and flat, jus the way I like my women.

Not really, they usally unconscious and lumpy,

 

[aust9002]

Hah your old lady is gonna beat your a$$ lol idk about flat, also how would one go about measuring those clearances? I have a set of feeler gauges and calipers and thats about it lol

 

[aust9002]

What coils do you use? Im using a pauls kart coil

 

[BrownStainRacing]

Hah your old lady is gonna beat your a$$ lol idk about flat, also how would one go about measuring those clearances? I have a set of feeler gauges and calipers and thats about it lol

Feelers gauges or calipers will work, that's what I use.

Keep the side cover on and bolted down.
Pop the head off.
Bring piston to TDC.
Use feeler gauges to find piston to deck height.
Measure at 3 o'clock and 9 o'clock. This is above the wrist pin and the piston does not rock here.

Post in thread 'Measuring deck height' https://www.diygokarts.com/community/threads/measuring-deck-height.47553/post-596541

I use Dover Power performance coils
.
Me and a buddy checked stock coils with his dial back timing light, and non resistor plugs, pvl flywheel and a arc flywheel, while engines were running, and you could clearing see the stock coils start pulling timing out (retard) as the rpm climbed higher. Some started retarding at 4k, some 4500, and some didn't start til around 4800, but they ALL would retard the timing. At 6k, there was as much as 8* retard when using a stock coil.

So if you got your timing at 32* and using a stock coil, you will have only 24* at 6k. Make sense ????

We checked 3 Dover Power coils and only seen 2* retard at 6k. Steady climbing to 7k and still only 2* retard.

I'll never use any other coil on a performance build.

Performance Coil

www.doverpoweronlinestore.com

Paul knows his stuff, I'm sure he has checked his coils.

There's only 1 way to know for sure, gotta see it with your own eyes to believe it.

 

[BrownStainRacing]

Surprise, surprise, Surprise 🫢

 

[BrownStainRacing]

Looks like they went from $285 to $238.

Sweet, extra $ for more parts.

 

[aust9002]

Surprise, surprise, Surprise 🫢

View attachment 142459View attachment 142460View attachment 142461

Niceeeee hopefully mine comes in today thats a clean lookin little motor I can wait to see if the one I ordered from arc will be any different. More money= more parts= mo powaaa. I might order one of those coils too not too expensive

 

[BrownStainRacing]

Niceeeee hopefully mine comes in today thats a clean lookin little motor I can wait to see if the one I ordered from arc will be any different. More money= more parts= mo powaaa. I might order one of those coils too not too expensive

It should be the exact same from ARC.

The throttle kit kinda pi$$es me off.
Since I asked if it was a direct bolt on kit.
I quess I should have asked the right question, "is it a COMPLETE bolt on kit", .
since it didn't come with the throttle linkage to throttle shaft rod.

I mean c'mon, it's a $1.10 part. I would have ordered 1 if I was told.
I'm sure I got 1 somewhere, but that's not the point.

Racing Cams and Parts | Ducar OEM Throttle Linkage Rod | CL-1230 | DynoCams

This is the stock replacement throttle linkage rod for 196cc OHV clone engines. It is used to connect the throttle arm to the throttle shaft. | CL-1230

www.dynocams.com

I'm not ready to do anything soon with the engine.
I'll start a teardown, inspect, check clearances thread when I start on it.

 

[aust9002]

I have lots extra lol

 

[BrownStainRacing]

I have lots extra lolView attachment 142466

It's funny how we collect to most useless parts........then when we need 1, it CANT BE FOUND.

I checked the piston to deck on this 1, it's .002"-.0025". So a .027" thick head gasket will be safe.

I recommend, you check yours and also check the gasket to make sure it right.

I got alot checked out today in it, if you need any thing, jus yell.

I should have time tomorrow to start that thread.