Help with predator 224

[aust9002]

Alright lol, 10 tooth main sprocket, 60 tooth axle sprocket, 19 inch tires, I weigh right at 200 cart is probably another 150-250 same setup would get me 50mph on the predator

 

[BrownStainRacing]

Alright lol, 10 tooth main sprocket, 60 tooth axle sprocket, 19 inch tires, I weigh right at 200 cart is probably another 150-250 same setup would get me 50mph on the predator

That's alot of mph loss.

I'd say it's the belt or something is binding.

My grandsons buggy weighs more, with 6.66 gear and a whole lot less engine, with 19" tires. He's 140# and hits 38 mph at 4900 rpm, but that with a gutless pred 212 non hemi.

With that rpm spike and no more mph, sounds like the belt.

I'm not too familiar with the juggernaut. But I cant see it being too much for that engine.

 

[aust9002]

That's alot of mph loss.

I'd say it's the belt or something is binding.

My grandsons buggy weighs more, with 6.66 gear and a whole lot less engine, with 19" tires. He's 140# and hits 38 mph at 4900 rpm, but that with a gutless pred 212 non hemi.

With that rpm spike and no more mph, sounds like the belt.

I'm not too familiar with the juggernaut. But I cant see it being too much for that engine.

Dang you're up late tonight haha, yeah im taking that newish kevlar $25 belt off and throwing a new one of my cheap chinese ones on there lol i had a 3 pack but have 1 left but Ill throw it on there tomorrow and test again those cheap ones got me up to 50mph before lol

 

[aust9002]

Should I swap to a 12 tooth? I have a 9, 10, 12

 

[BrownStainRacing]

Dang you're up late tonight haha, yeah im taking that newish kevlar $25 belt off and throwing a new one of my cheap chinese ones on there lol i had a 3 pack but have 1 left but Ill throw it on there tomorrow and test again those cheap ones got me up to 50mph before lol

Yea, I was up and down last night.

Hold off on you gear change for now, til you get your belt squared away.

I'll set up GR (gear ratio) for people with stock motors for the trails.
We got 3 or 4 straight flat areas that are 350-380ft.
I use my weight, 200#, then calculate for their weight, it USUALLY works, those big uns running small tires takes me some time,
Or three brothers sharing the same ride, I'll gear for the heaviest rider so they all can have fun.
They will have the same speed, but the heavy one can get up the big hills too.

But what I'm looking for is the max rpm right before I have to grab the brakes, or slow down, 350-380ft.
This way gives me plenty of power for the uphill, switch back, old logging trails.

Big low rpm torq engines, modifieds, 380ft is way too short. So I'll put em on the hard road.

I live on a 5 mile dead end road, no stop signs, but only got a 600 ft flat level straight run, everything else is curvy and up hill.

I'll gear modifieds for that max rpm right before the end of the 600ft, and that leaves plenty of power for the trails and hill climbing.

If we had less hills and more straights, then the gear would be different.

I'd say 5500 is max rpm for that engine, you can try for more, but it won't have any more power.

When you are playing with GR, change it till you see a 200-300 rpm drop, at what ever distance you have, then go back up to the next gear.

This will always keep the engine in the powerband for your weight and distance.

Let mph be, where ever it lands.

 

[aust9002]

Sorry I didnt post yesterday had a super busy day at work but heres the videos I got last night she revved to 5900rpm last night but got me back up to 48mph

manco with ducar 224 45mph

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[BrownStainRacing]

Sorry I didnt post yesterday had a super busy day at work but heres the videos I got last night she revved to 5900rpm last night but got me back up to 48mph

manco with ducar 224 45mph

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youtube.com

Sweet!!!!
What did you change???

I got mine on the test stand, ran it about 20 mins up and down throttle, 2500-4500 rpm.

 

[aust9002]

Sweet!!!!
What did you change???

I got mine on the test stand, ran it about 20 mins up and down throttle, 2500-4500 rpm.

Just threw that new cheap chinese belt on there

 

[aust9002]

Ill get a better video tomorrow during the day so you can actually see and ill get one of the juggy and driven engaging

 

[aust9002]

Now the next thing, should I swap to the yellow spring in the driven or maybe swap to the 12 tooth? according to my calculations 48 is still slow for 5900rpm

 

[BrownStainRacing]

Now the next thing, should I swap to the yellow spring in the driven or maybe swap to the 12 tooth? according to my calculations 48 is still slow for 5900rpm

Try the 12t before the yellow spring, the 11t would be my next choice, but work with what you got.

The yellow driven spring is for heavy riders with under powered engines trying to pull with not enough gear.

You can move the red spring to another hole.

We had to move the red spring clockwise (least resistant hole) for my sons mini bike, because it was holding low too long in the middle hole.
We still gotta drop gear for him, its got way too much coming outta the the hole.

Test 1 thing at a time, and take your time testing, get good accurate tests before any more changing.

I've been backwards so many times, being in a hurry.

In other words, "I've was so far behind,..... I thought I was winning" !!!!!

 

[BrownStainRacing]

@aust9002

Heres the magnetic oil drain plugs outta the Ducar 224 only after an hr of run time, 2500-4500 rpm, no load.

You can see all the metal coming outta of new engines during the break in period.

Did you get those yet????

 

[aust9002]

No i completely forgot to order those will order them tonight

 

[aust9002]

Alrighty here we finally go took me forever to render this video and get it posted my bad, looks to me like the driven isnt fully engaging?

 

[aust9002]

Ducar 224cc (stock)
Arc billet flywheel 6619
NIBBI 26mm Carburetor PE26FL:
Main jet #135
Idle jet #35
Aftermarket exhaust
GPS Billet Valve cover
Juggernaut driver
6" stock driven(Red spring center spot)
10 tooth sprocket
60 tooth axle sprocket
#420 chain
Manco Force-Five Chassis
19" rear utv tire 6 ply

 

[panchothedog]

The faster you go, the deeper the belt is going down into the driven. Like it is supposed to. Is that what you ment when you said not fully engaging?
Shakey video, and I didn't sit and watch the whole 8minutes. Stayed with it until you got up to 44 mph. Looks like everything is working fine. Sounds like your engine is out of breath. ( can't rev any higher ). How fast are you expecting
with basically a stock engine. Carb and pipe is all you have done. Put a RVL
muffler on it and you might even pick up a half a mph. You also won't make quite so much noise. If you want more speed put on a 12 tooth sprocket. If that doesn't work, then it's time to make modifications for more horsepower, and at a higher RPM. If it were mine, I would be quite pleased with 48 mph from a almost box stock small block.

 

[aust9002]

I reckon a 12tooth at 5800rpm should get me around 58mph with a 20% drivetrain loss if thats such a thing on karts (10 tooth 5800rpm= 60.91mph x 20%= 12. 60-12= 48mph)

 

[BrownStainRacing]

48 on that frame is kinda scary to me, .

It does sound like it's outta breath, you can hear it come on strong then kinda jus goes flat, and you're waiting on mph to go up.

Looks like the belt is at top of the driver, but not at bottom of driven.
I'm not sure, but maybe that's how the juggernaut works. ????

Keep testing, you will get it.

Did you figure out what rpm the kart starts to pull, stall or belt engagement????

My grandson buggy has 3100 stall and there's black marks all over my concrete pad, basically stock 196 with governor.

The stall speed does effect the high side with a regular 30 series driver.

I've dropped 400 rpm stall and lost 600 rpm on the high side.

 

[BrownStainRacing]

He's gotta a pretty good hole shot from a 4600 rpm gov'd turd motor, .

He helped me put this 196 together and pulled his 212 off for some testing.

He gets it to 35 mph in 350ft, I can only get it to 29,

I guess "old fat papaw" is jus too slow..

 

[aust9002]

thats what im thinking the driven isnt fully engaged or open so i might lessen the spring pressure it starts to grab around 2700-2900