Cheap Chinese TC? / A lesson in rushing purchases.

[Squiddy202]

Take a picture of the parts you currently have and post the picture. If you have parts coming to you now, get pictures when they get there.
Don't buy anything right now. Since it can be ridden right now, don't take anything apart. Get those measurements. Count those teeth.
Be patient.

I plan on doing so. I learned my lesson $60 later about that...

He wants gear ratios and to go faster than 14mph that his current setup provides……

CVT vs Centrifugal Clutch

I was recently debating changing the gearing on my kart. Someone mentioned using a CVT and it seemed like a good idea. I have ~7hp, and I can only do like 14 on a 200lb kart. I really only want to get up to around 25mph. Can you even really (easily ish) convert from centrifugal to torque...

www.diygokarts.com

This thread is just a rehash of his old one. This forum gave me autism. Anyway put pictures first and maybe 1/3 of the currently active members here would have said, oh yeah I remember that kart. Didn’t we get it fixed? Another third would have remembered the VW bus next to the kart. Lol

Nothing has changed, those are the photos from the last thread.

EDIT: anyway, the parts manual I shared in post #88 (hopefully) shows us that a TC can go there.

Pretty much, now I'm just trying to figure out how to deal with this. I thought dead threads are supposed to stay dead so I made a new one. I couldn't take pictures yet but I will this afternoon. Now, at this point I am just trying to figure out how to make what is coming fit the best and get a CVT on this kart for minimal price.

Options:
1. 5/8" jackshaft and bearings/vevor (Amazon) CVT. Issues: very in depth and more likely to have unforeseen costs, also need a new belt.
2. Longer 3/4" jackshaft with GPS CVT. Issues: gotta order a new part, change the jackshaft. Bearings seem good as it would be same diameter.
3. Amazon kit with plate: Issues: gotta remove axle and move sprocket over if possible, which is yet more work. Makes it less stock. Edit: Least possible unforeseen costs.

What would you guys recommend? I gotta learn towards option 2.
Prices work out to be relatively similar, more new pictures to come at ~3:30 est. Get ready for a major photo dump, I'm sparing no angles to prevent an even lighter wallet.

 

[Squiddy202]

Also, I need to get a picture but I think my jackshaft is weird because of the way the keyway works. I don't think it goes all the way through. It almost seems like there is a plate that prevents the CVT/Pulley from going too far on. I might pull it just for pictures. Anyone know how you prevent pulleys from rubbing against housings of jackshafts? This one is like fully enclosed.

Edit:
Thanks Hellion, according to that diagram it looks like it is just the bearing I was looking at.

Edit 2:
If anyone happens to have old Murray part diagrams and can find a 680222 jackshaft that would be great. I am trying on Google but am having no luck. If I can find the length of that I should know what I need. I would still check.

 

[Thepartsguy]

Options:
3. Amazon kit with plate: Issues: gotta remove axle and move sprocket over if possible, which is yet more work. Makes it less stock. Edit: Least possible unforeseen costs.

For a cvt with backing plate ya I was looking at your pictures again and the whole entire axle would need removed so you can put the axle sprocket on the other side of the kart.

One option is to just get a 3/4 c-sprocket and change the gear on the stock setup?

You can pull the whole axle out and move the axle sprocket like you said.

Last option is to make your v-belt clutch system into your own home made CVT drive. As you measured it might mean buying a longer jack shaft.

Everyone on here knows you buy a cheap $20 3 pack of belts and keep one on the buggy as a spare. The belt shreds and you have to leave the kart on the side of the road cause you don’t have a spare to limp home with. Or you could push it…

I say stop buying stuff. If you have a 3/4 driven cvt pulley ordered do not do anything else until you receive it. Then you can see if it is gonna fit your jackshaft or if you need a longer one.

 

[Sparkwizard]

What would you guys recommend?

See post #98, again.

 

[Squiddy202]

See post #98, again.

Yes, I see that and like I said in #102 and an earlier one I can't until ~3:30 est. This is not a how to do it question CURRENTLY. We will come to that but right now I want to see my general options and figure out which makes the most sense. I will not buy anything yet. I just want to know what I should research and learn the execution for. If you think it is a good idea to POSSIBLY use a plate system I can start looking into them and see what would fit/the work involved. My posts may seem like a weird order but they are me trying to respond/progress through this as quickly as possible while also being in school for 7 hours and only being able to respond in cross-periods/homeroom. I am going to get you those pictures soon. You gotta understand that most of my day I am just going off of Google, memory, and what is on my phone. I want to know stuff like which would SEEM like the least work. I want to know what others did in their situations. I know nothing is definite until the pics. I am just trying to keep responding and the ball moving. All this is pretty much hypothetical until this afternoon. If you want just wait until I send pics.

 

[Squiddy202]

For a cvt with backing plate ya I was looking at your pictures again and the whole entire axle would need removed so you can put the axle sprocket on the other side of the kart.

One option is to just get a 3/4 c-sprocket and change the gear on the stock setup?

You can pull the whole axle out and move the axle sprocket like you said.

Last option is to make your v-belt clutch system into your own home made CVT drive. As you measured it might mean buying a longer jack shaft.

Everyone on here knows you buy a cheap $20 3 pack of belts and keep one on the buggy as a spare. The belt shreds and you have to leave the kart on the side of the road cause you don’t have a spare to limp home with. Or you could push it…

I say stop buying stuff. If you have a 3/4 driven cvt pulley ordered do not do anything else until you receive it. Then you can see if it is gonna fit your jackshaft or if you need a longer one.

When you say get a 3/4" c sprocket, would that be for the drive or the jackshaft? I really want to do a CVT if you are just talking about changing the jack gearing. They give high accel and speed. When you say homemade CVT drive, what do you mean. I definitely do not have the skills/time/willpower/resources to fabricate one. If you add up the price of custom metal parts it would be pretty hard. I don't know what you are imagining tbh.

Edit:
If it is anywhere close to a standard CVT Pulley thickness it isn't working. Using the cheap Amazon 30 series thickness that had a 5/8 instead of a 3/4 I measured like 2 1/2" if I am correct. The distance from jackshaft housing to tip of threaded sections was the exact same. There was literally no room to add a bolt. I will check but am going on the assumption it won't for now. I know it seems I am rushing, and quite frankly I am. I am super excited to get this thing running again and pissed at myself for the mistakes. I just want to finish this damn thing. I am going to not rush purchases but the more info I can get before I am ready to make purchases and waiting for responses the better. At the end of the day, the nature of forums are slow and I want to expedite this project. I have a bad habit of hitting a hard step and stalling.

 

[Sparkwizard]

If you need to study and learn how to perform certain operations, here are two suggestions. You will PROBABLY choose to do one or the other of these things.
1. How to remove and replace the jackshaft on your kart.
2. Learn how to remove the axle and relocate the axle sprocket. See if there is room to move the sprocket over there where the disc brake is already mounted.

 

[Thepartsguy]

When you say homemade CVT drive, what do you mean. I definitely do not have the skills/time/willpower/resources to fabricate one.

I meant homemade drive system. You’re adapting an eBay CVT to a gokart jackshaft. Factory’s set up karts that way but your kart might not have had the system from the factory.

Next we look at the picture of your kart. Is that a thick c-sprocket or a big stack of washers? If that’s a thick stack of washers under that nut just take them out and maybe a CVT driven would fit your jackshaft?

If you can get a 3/4 driver pulley on the engine and a 3/4 driven pulley on the jackshaft with both of the cvt pulleys lined up so the belt doesn‘t shred that is the best bang for your buck.

It really comes down to if your jackshaft is long enough to accept the 3/4 driven. If it’s not I don’t think you’ll be able to do much until you buy one that is.

 

[Squiddy202]

I meant homemade drive system. You’re adapting an eBay CVT to a gokart jackshaft. Factory’s set up karts that way but your kart might not have had the system from the factory.

Next we look at the picture of your kart. Is that a thick c-sprocket or a big stack of washers? If that’s a thick stack of washers under that nut just take them out and maybe a CVT driven would fit your jackshaft?

If you can get a 3/4 driver pulley on the engine and a 3/4 driven pulley on the jackshaft with both of the cvt pulleys lined up so the belt doesn‘t shred that is the best bang for your buck.

It really comes down to if your jackshaft is long enough to accept the 3/4 driven. If it’s not I don’t think you’ll be able to do much until you buy one that is.

View attachment 160306

Crap I didn’t think of that! Is it ok if the pulley overhangs onto the threaded section as long as the bolt can go all the way on? Yes, it is a fat stack of washers. Man pictures are great! Still more to come.

 

[Sparkwizard]

PLEASE stop asking questions until you post pictures of what parts you actually have and pictures of your kart. Nobody can answer you with any accuracy. STOP and go get the measurements we asked for. Thank you.

 

[Hellion]

I agree with this guy

You keep promising photos but never deliver. This rambling talk, post after post, is not helping but it is s t r e t c h i n g out the thread. We got 6 pages of (mostly) I double-dog-dare you to post 10 new photos of the stuff we need to see instead of replying with more words.

Nah man I wish. My Amazon one was just the pulleys and a belt.

Now that we are re-acquainted with your kart, I think that's what you need, finally. It will fit the illustration in post #88 which is a 30 series without backing plate, aka "pulleys and a belt." The part numbers are:

Driver, Torque Converter 680167
Driven, Torque Converter 680166
Belt size to be determined

Don't reply to this thread, below my post, unless it's nothing but photos.

 

[Sparkwizard]

Crap I didn’t think of that! Is it ok if the pulley overhangs onto the threaded section as long as the bolt can go all the way on? Yes, it is a fat stack of washers. Man pictures are great! Still more to come.

There should not be a bolt in the jackshaft. The ends are threaded. Every time you ask your questions, you force people to give factual answers that
do not apply to your situation!

 

[Sparkwizard]

I think I am reaching my max patience limit. Good look to all of you!

 

[Thepartsguy]

We are just getting things on track I thought???

Crap I didn’t think of that! Is it ok if the pulley overhangs onto the threaded section as long as the bolt can go all the way on? Yes, it is a fat stack of washers. Man pictures are great! Still more to come.

Back to what we were saying. Remove the nut on each side of this jackshaft. And REMOVE ALL WASHERS USED AS SPACERS and the mower style pulley on there now.

Without the giant stack of washers I bet the jackshaft is long enough to accommodate the cvt driven pulley.

I have to keep re-reading this is at school and you don’t have all day to mess with it?

Next time you get your hands on it start tearing down the jackshaft in order to find out if your jackshaft is long enough to accommodate the CVT driven I bet it is as mine had a jackshaft long enough to support a CVT.


I don’t need anymore pictures to help you with the drive system what do you want to do with it? I took the CVT off and moved the sprocket to the other side of the kart. That was talked about earlier in this thread. If it’s long enough to support the 3/4 CVT without all the spacer washers great!

 

[Squiddy202]

I agree with this guy

You keep promising photos but never deliver. This rambling talk, post after post, is not helping but it is s t r e t c h i n g out the thread. We got 6 pages of (mostly) I double-dog-dare you to post 10 new photos of the stuff we need to see instead of replying with more words.



Now that we are re-acquainted with your kart, I think that's what you need, finally. It will fit the illustration in post #88 which is a 30 series without backing plate, aka "pulleys and a belt." The part numbers are:

Driver, Torque Converter 680167
Driven, Torque Converter 680166
Belt size to be determined

Don't reply to this thread, below my post, unless it's nothing but photos.

Alright.

Slots that allow me to move engine.
Random pic that might help.
Axle on side with brake rotor.
Random Pic that might help.
Washer stack.
Sprocket on axle.

We are just getting things on track I thought???

I don’t need anymore pictures to help you with the drive system what do you want to do with it? I took the CVT off and moved the sprocket to the other side of the kart. That was talked about earlier in this thread. If it’s long enough to support the 3/4 CVT without all the spacer washers great!

I thought so too, and I couldn’t find a way to get the bolt off unless my dad has a chain wrench but I found this:

The nut, NOT Bolt, sorry spark was a typo, is thinner than the washer stack. If the driven can rest on the threaded area then based on previous measurements with a difference of 0 it should fit with margin.

Now for some apologies!
Sorry spark for prolonging pictures.
Sorry Hellion for not having enough content for 10. This is literally all I can see that you need.
Sorry everyone for think of this forum in the wrong light. I failed to realize the importance of pictures and was super excited to get my kart working. Forums are slower than other forms of communication in nature and are not just words. I failed to realize that. I was annoying everyone with a lack of pictures. Most of the time I was writing at school and failing to remember to check. Now I hope you all can forgive me and allow me to prove I do in fact have a camera and willpower.

Edit:
Thanks to a very keen eye from ThatPartsGuy I am going to hopefully not buy more parts. I think this was all pretty much decided in post #108 as to what I was going to do. I do still agree I did not send nearly enough pics. I couldn’t pull the stack off because of the geometry and my lack of chain wrench.

 

[Squiddy202]

There should not be a bolt in the jackshaft. The ends are threaded. Every time you ask your questions, you force people to give factual answers that
do not apply to your situation!

sorry, typo. I get nut and bolt mixed up sometimes. Please see other post for apology and pictures.

 

[Squiddy202]

Yes, I see that and like I said in #102 and an earlier one I can't until ~3:30 est. This is not a how to do it question CURRENTLY. We will come to that but right now I want to see my general options and figure out which makes the most sense. I will not buy anything yet. I just want to know what I should research and learn the execution for. If you think it is a good idea to POSSIBLY use a plate system I can start looking into them and see what would fit/the work involved. My posts may seem like a weird order but they are me trying to respond/progress through this as quickly as possible while also being in school for 7 hours and only being able to respond in cross-periods/homeroom. I am going to get you those pictures soon. You gotta understand that most of my day I am just going off of Google, memory, and what is on my phone. I want to know stuff like which would SEEM like the least work. I want to know what others did in their situations. I know nothing is definite until the pics. I am just trying to keep responding and the ball moving. All this is pretty much hypothetical until this afternoon. If you want just wait until I send pics.

This message was quite frankly unneeded and a bit rude due to its fundamental flaw in how a forum works. I apologize for this as well.

 

[Thepartsguy]

Everyone on here is just a little unsure everything is going to work together.

From the experience I have on my karts jackshaft very similar to the one in question and your measurements I believe we can say there is a very good chance the 3/4 CVT driven pulley WILL fit his jackshaft once he removes a giant stack of washers.

Once you has the driven on the jackshaft and the chain connecting the c-sprocket to the axle sprocket your good to go. Start getting the driver and engine installed so you can fit a belt.

 

[Squiddy202]

Everyone on here is just a little unsure everything is going to work together.

From the experience I have on my karts jackshaft very similar to the one in question and your measurements I believe we can say there is a very good chance the 3/4 CVT driven pulley WILL fit his jackshaft once he removes a giant stack of washers.

Once you has the driven on the jackshaft and the chain connecting the c-sprocket to the axle sprocket your good to go. Start getting the driver and engine installed so you can fit a belt.

Engine is already on, I measured using the shafts as their center is the center of the CVT pulley eventually. Based off that and my 1” of clearance I can say that my belt from the kit will fit. It is coming on Wednesday. What makes a c sprocket a c sprocket?

 

[Squiddy202]

Alright so I figured it out. After finally getting my dad’s sears air compressor to not blow the 15 amp breaker I took an impact to it.
Given this picture, I have enough room now that the washer stack is off the completely thread the nut on even with a CVT. The CVT might fit all the way on but I don’t know, is it ok if part of it is around the threaded part of the jackshaft that is narrower? Would that sacrifice too much strength? If it would be ok then I think this will finally work.

Edit:
How do I remove/slide over a jackshaft? Is a hammer my best bet?

Edit 2:
For the good of the many I have a 10t - 60t chain sprockets. The clutch was a 3.5” pulley to an 8” on the jackshaft.