To speed or not to speed.....this is my first build

[Half-breeder]

Basically... an engine needs more top end(high rpm oomf). Most engines have a torque curve apexing in the lower/middle to middle. A cam can help allow a transfer of torque peak to a higher rpm but at a sacrifice of lowend torque.

i personally have a kart setup 'like' yours n I do 50mph... trust me... 10-11hp w/ a TAV2 geared at 50mph is awesome! When I say 10-11hp... I'm talkin a modified clone or gx200. LOTS of easy to come by mods!

I can somewhat keepup w/afew ricer cars... until 50mph... but I get there sooner!

 

[rmm727]

KartInfo by kartcalc.net:

[FONT="Verdana"]
[B][U]KART[/U][/B]
[INDENT][I]RW diameter[/I]: [B] 27.94 cm | 11 in[/B]
[I]Total weight[/I]: [B] 150 kg | 330.69 lbs[/B]
[/INDENT]
[B][U]ENGINE[/U][/B]
[INDENT][I]Original HP[/I]: [B] 6[/B]
[I]Asummed HP[/I]: [B] ~6.67[/B]
[I]Torque[/I]: [B] 11.87 Nm | 8.75 ft lbf[/B]
[I]RPM[/I]: [B] 5000[/B]
[/INDENT]
[B][U]TRANSMISSION[/U][/B]
[INDENT][I]Final ratio[/I]: [B] 4:1[/B]
[I]TC type[/I]: [B]  series 30 6" driven[/B]
[I]Lowest ratio[/I]: [B] 10.8:1[/B]
[I]Highest ratio[/I]: [B] 3.6:1[/B]
[/INDENT]
[B][U]PERFORMANCE[/U][/B]
[INDENT][I]Max Wheel Torque[/I]: [B] 128.2 Nm | 94.56 ft lbf[/B]
[I]Min Wheel Torque[/I]: [B] 42.73 Nm | 31.52 ft lbf[/B]
[I]Acceleration[/I]: [B] 3.47 m/s² | 11.39 ft/s²[/B]
[I]Top Speed[/I]: [B] 73.15 km/h | 45.45 mph[/B]
[/INDENT]
[/FONT]

'sid

This is probably a bit vague but can you put a value on an acceleration rate the "feels" like the kart is pulling or that puts you back in your seat?

 

[itsid]

Sid, I'm curious to the math (mainly the assumed values) for the 12 hp - 60 mph 'rule'. Care to elaborate? I feel it may be a bit too generalizing.

Nope it's not too generalizing
It's simple math really..
simplified (to top speed reached & level asphalt road) but still valid.

the base formula is this:
Pm = m * g * sin(alpha) * v + m * g * Cr * cos(alpha) * v + Ca * m * a * v + 0.5 * Da * Cw * A * v³

simplified to this:
Pm = m * g * Cr * v + 0.5 * Da * Cw * A * v³
(again alpha = 0° & a = 0)

m is the mass of the vehicle incl the driver,
g gravitational constant
Cr rolling coefficient of a tyre
Da airdensity
Cw wind coefficient -(typical race kart values used)
A frontal Area of the vehicle -(typical race kart values used)
and finally v the velocity
All values are strictly metric of course
and as a result
we get
150 kg * 9.81 m/s² * 0.02 * 27.778 m/s + 0.5 * 1.2 kg/m³ * 0.7 * 0.9 m² * (27.778 m/s)³
= 8919.553 W
8.9 kW roughly or 12.13 HP.

This is probably a bit vague but can you put a value on an acceleration rate the "feels" like the kart is pulling or that puts you back in your seat?

Well, the acceleration value indeed is vague..
it's the theoretical maximum acceleration possible.

it's based on the engine torque at max rpm
Since I cannot just go ahead and 'guess' a torque curve, that is the only value I can calculate, that times the gear ratio allows me to calculate wheel torque, max wheel torque and weight let's me calculate acceleration.. that's all there is to it.
Since there is friction, inertia and engine lag the real world value is lower;
then again max torque is PRIOR max rpm, thus higher than the known value I calculate with... so that should be at least within reach (it's not spot on of course)
For now basically all calculations are based on above formula and what we know about gear ratios anyways.


The more data you guys are willing to share with me using the calculator, the closer the values get to real world values;
but that takes time

'sid

 

[Badot]

Perhaps I'm being a bit picky, but I'm getting 26.82m/s for velocity at 60mph which would be closer to 8.1kw/10.9hp. I never realized race karts were about as draggy as motorcycles though.

Also, I'm curious if you take an estimated rotational inertia of the tires into account for peak acceleration? And just to be clear, I'm not trying to be an @$$, I'm just a bit of a physics nerd and genuinely interested in this stuff


Back on topic though, 3.47m/s^2 is probably a little less than your average fwd car will pull.

 

[itsid]

Perhaps I'm being a bit picky, but I'm getting 26.82m/s for velocity at 60mph which would be closer to 8.1kw/10.9hp. I never realized race karts were about as draggy as motorcycles though.

Also, I'm curious if you take an estimated rotational inertia of the tires into account for peak acceleration? And just to be clear, I'm not trying to be an @$$, I'm just a bit of a physics nerd and genuinely interested in this stuff


Back on topic though, 3.47m/s^2 is probably a little less than your average fwd car will pull.

Could be 26.8 m/s.. Since I'm a metric boy I choose to tach 100km/h which is the nicer number..
divided by 3.6 it's 27.7p
Oh and 100km/h is why you list 0-60mph (since it's at least close to real world 1-100 km/h)

and yes race karts themselves are pretty slick, but the driver adds a HUGE amount of drag.
typically 0.63 - 0.65 is taken for a proper modern day race kart chassis incl driver (enduros less) .. I took 0.7 since that should cover yard karts older bumper/fender styles etc. pretty good..

Yes, for acceleration I take accelerative resistance into account, which with it's corresponding coefficient (Ca in the formula above) is about inertia.
But the coefficient is made up since it's impossible to dial in perfectly for any of us.
I talked about it in the motor essence thread
I can do better now, but that's part of my behind the scenes magic, so I won't tell you the details I'm afraid

Back on topic though, 3.47m/s^2 is probably a little less than your average fwd car will pull.

hehe.. 1.5 metric tons of mass.. require 100++ horses or something to just overcome accelerative resistance at that acceleration

'sid

 

[adsum]

All of this math ....


Okay, So I've owned the Kart for a solid 48 hours and I've made my decision.....
I've decided NOT to try and fabricate a GixxerKart out of it. Mainly for two reason's.
1.) It's not safe
2.) This Kart would NEVER be able to handle that sort of power without completely changing the entire kart. (basically something I had figured, but assumed wouldn't be too difficult.)

So onto the build.....

 

[adsum]

Step 1.)
I'd like to first remove the governor just to see what performance increase I get from it.

Step2.) Replace the brake cable that snapped when I attempted to adjust the brakes. I managed to rig up a temporary setup with an old bike cable I had laying around, but it's not a safe permanent fix.
Does anyone have a link to a video or step by step to removing the governor on the 6.5 Tecumseh power sports?

 

[Half-breeder]

Not that there is anything wrong w/ your 6.5 Tecumseh power sport.... (yet)... but IMO Id drop a bill into gettin a HF212 for upgrading. There are SSSoooo many mods/vids/tutorials/charts/experiences/etc for the positive bout it, vs the Tecumseh ps.

 

[Badot]

Mine didn't come with the governor, but came with a pretty haphazardly made throttle linkage that I redid...

I connected my throttle arm to the governor arm with 1/16" steel wire, and connected the governor arm to the carb butterfly using heavy fishing line through a hole drilled as far from the pivot as possible. If you use this method, make sure you leave a little slack so the butterfly can close back up.

This is the simplest method I could think of and works fine for me, but there are surely better (more mechanically sound) methods if you don't mind a little fabricating. Also worth noting, you may want to look into a stronger spring to close the carb butterfly as the stock ones are rather weak.

 

[Young One With A Manco]

Um... You know your motor will blow up without a governor if you don't change anything?

Are you just kinda thinking "I'll use it until it blows up and by a 6.5 212 HF"? Because with that mindset you could just do it now and get some good money for the tecumseh as it sits!!!

 

[Badot]

Valves should float just a bit over 3600 so unless it's horrendously overgeared it's unlikely to be an issue.

In my area, if a Tecumseh 200cc or smaller isn't attached to something it would take either an incredibly long time or incredibly low asking price to sell. They're like the mega bloks of the engine world.

 

[itsid]

since when do you blow up an engine by removing the governor?
removing the governor reduces the engines lifespan (measured in hours, it's roughly the same measured in combustion cycles )
without high flow airfilter and exhaust it shouldn't cause any issue,
high flow filters tend to be a little less effective thus may decrease lifespan of the engine a tiny bit...
but as long as you do NOT upgrade valve springs to get rid of the valve float @ ~5000-5500 rpm without getting a billet con rod and flywheel you will not blow up an engine because of a removed governor.

At least I never heard of such mishap..

Even without billet parts and heavy valve springs such failure is a possibility (a likely one to be honest) but not a certainty

'sid

 

[adsum]

i personally have a kart setup 'like' yours n I do 50mph... trust me... 10-11hp w/ a TAV2 geared at 50mph is awesome! When I say 10-11hp... I'm talkin a modified clone or gx200. LOTS of easy to come by mods!

I can somewhat keepup w/afew ricer cars... until 50mph... but I get there sooner!

Tell me more about your kart....
Would a modified Predator 212 be sufficient to reach these speeds?. Not knowing much about the Tav 2 to begin with I'm curious to know what I would need in order to swap the TC from my current motor to the next one.
As of right now I'm maxing out at 30mph with the Tecumseh. Ideally, I'd like to reach 50mph and set that as my first accomplishment.

 

[Half-breeder]

Tell me more about your kart....
Would a modified Predator 212 be sufficient to reach these speeds?.

Id have to say yes. It would have to be modified for higher RPM(5k)... but in all theory 'yes'... mine does.

This is the post I put up of my GX200(+/- same as HF212).

Not knowing much about the Tav 2 to begin with I'm curious to know what I would need in order to swap the TC from my current motor to the next one.

Remove the driver(the pulley on the engine shaft), and youll see 4 bolts holding the JS plate to the block. From there youll want to probably do maintenance to the TC... Part 1...
Part 2...

After cleaning the TC...(and after you get and break-in the HF212) there are some places that will need to be ground on the TC and the engine. Ill make a vid tomorrow of what and where needs to be ground down in order to 'fit' properly(or you can try n find one on YTube).

As of right now I'm maxing out at 30mph with the Tecumseh. Ideally, I'd like to reach 50mph and set that as my first accomplishment.

I understand... but remember, the more you learn, the better youll be able to trouble shoot issue(most all 'karts' have 'issues'), and reaching 45+mph is reaching the 'limits' of the longevity of an engine... so keep that in mind if/when something breaks.

When gearing for desired speed, in your case, dont count the +10% gearing that the TAV2 has(only TC... that I know of... that has a final gear ratio of .9:1). IMO the Overdrive only works when geared to 6:1 or lower.

(sorry if already said)... what size wheels you plannin on runnin and the total weight, and I/we(Sid) can give a mathematical guesstimation of what youll need to do to attain the 50mph mark(it IS an accomplishment w/ a TAV2 to get there btw).

 

[adsum]

Id have to say yes. It would have to be modified for higher RPM(5k)... but in all theory 'yes'... mine does.

This is the post I put up of my GX200(+/- same as HF212)


Remove the driver(the pulley on the engine shaft), and youll see 4 bolts holding the JS plate to the block. From there youll want to probably do maintenance to the TC...


After cleaning the TC...(and after you get and break-in the HF212) there are some places that will need to be ground on the TC and the engine. Ill make a vid tomorrow of what and where needs to be ground down in order to 'fit' properly(or you can try n find one on YTube)


I understand... but remember, the more you learn, the better youll be able to trouble shoot issue(most all 'karts' have 'issues'), and reaching 45+mph is reaching the 'limits' of the longevity of an engine... so keep that in mind if/when something breaks.

When gearing for desired speed, in your case, dont count the +10% gearing that the TAV2 has(only TC... that I know of... that has a final gear ratio of .9:1). IMO the Overdrive only works when geared to 6:1 or lower.

(sorry if already said)... what size wheels you plannin on runnin and the total weight, and I/we(Sid) can give a mathematical guesstimation of what youll need to do to attain the 50mph mark(it IS an accomplishment w/ a TAV2 to get there btw).

That's a sick kart! You should download the "Speed" app on your phone(if you have a smartphone) and check and see how fast it actually goes!

I figured I start my TC cleaning process after I start to reassemble the Predator engine onto the kart. I just purchased the #60363 (Hemi) last night. I'm now sort of stuck on which cam,jet kit,piston,con rod, exhaust, and valves/valve springs to order to be able to reach these speeds. I literally want to build the entire motor. I want to maximize higher RPM's while not losing all my torque completely on the low end. The money is practically burning a hole in my pocket! Any suggestions/guidance?

I've seen a few different cams on some of the websites I've re-posted but I was unsure which cam would provide me the power that I'm looking for. Same goes for the valve/valve springs combination. I was leaning towards the 18lb springs but I'm practically clueless.
That would be awesome! I'm still a ways away from actually mounting it onto the kart. My plan is to buy all the parts I need and assemble the Predator on my work bench. Once complete, remove the TC and old Tecumseh motor and begin my fitment of my new engine.

I'm sort of aware of the headaches I'll have in the future with this kart. Since I decided to build the entire motor from the ground up I know somewhere in the near future I'm going to be throwing tools.
The thing is, when it comes to hobbies, I become "hyper-focused" on completing or solving the issue. Especially when it comes to something like a kart or dirtbike. It must be a branch off of my addictive personality

I didn't even know that the TAV2 had +10% gearing. What exactly does that mean? I need to learn more about the TC's in general. As you can tell, I have a lot to learn!

I plan on running these 11.5x7.10 Dunlop slicks that came already installed on the kart. They only have about 25%-30% life left on the indicators so I figured I'd wear them down some more then look to replace them.

 

[Half-breeder]

That's a sick kart! You should download the "Speed" app on your phone(if you have a smartphone) and check and see how fast it actually goes!

Info is uploaded (Lo-T2)... just not tested... yet(Im afraid of driving w/ my phone in my pocket nowadays... atleast till they finish paving the road).

I figured I start my TC cleaning process after I start to reassemble the Predator engine onto the kart. I just purchased the #60363 (Hemi) last night. I'm now sort of stuck on which cam,jet kit,piston,con rod, exhaust, and valves/valve springs to order to be able to reach these speeds. I literally want to build the entire motor. I want to maximize higher RPM's while not losing all my torque completely on the low end. The money is practically burning a hole in my pocket! Any suggestions/guidance?

Sounds like a good plan... mainly cause I havent taken the vid of the areas youll need to grind down on the block/TC plate back, before being able to fit the TAV on it... yet.

Jetting, I did mine at 36 bore. IMO for engine longevity, I wouldnt do valves/springs... The higher the RPM the shorter the life. The "racing" engines that are pulling 16hp+(big bored) at 9+k(18+lbs springs) RPM's from a 212 clone, usually have a life span of afew hours(20-40) before rebuilding is needed/recommended... if they havnt already blownup... 'literally'. I wouldnt do anything more due to that if you make TOO much hp, youll need to upgrade to a 40 series TC.

I 'would' remove governor, get a billit conrod, a flattop piston, n a billit case/block cover(the plate you removed to get to the innards of the engine). A highflow intake(talk to Jim bout that) and a header(lil cigar muffler if your mindful of noise). Those mods themselves will bring the hp up to about +/-10hp. If you have the ability to, I also milled .020 off the head for more compression. If I knew anything bout the cams available Id recommend one... I plan on getting one day aswell as the 8* timing key.

I'm still a ways away from actually mounting it onto the kart. My plan is to buy all the parts I need and assemble the Predator on my work bench. Once complete, remove the TC and old Tecumseh motor and begin my fitment of my new engine.

I would also recommend you dont forget to get a set of gaskets and 2 quarts of 'breakin' oil... good quality. I used "AMS oil".

If you are gonna do it 'that' way, if your not already gonna do it this way, I personally would install the parts before breaking in the engine... for acouple reasons. 1 The rings will set w/ the flattop piston. 2 You dont have to buy new rings.

I'm sort of aware of the headaches I'll have in the future with this kart. Since I decided to build the entire motor from the ground up I know somewhere in the near future I'm going to be throwing tools.
The thing is, when it comes to hobbies, I become "hyper-focused" on completing or solving the issue. Especially when it comes to something like a kart or dirtbike. It must be a branch off of my addictive personality

I too am 'that' way darn ADHD. Just keep inmind throughout the project... you are making a toy that WILL kill you at the speeds we are gonna travel... at the least, mame/handicap/deform... EVERYTIME you find yourself getting that 'hurry up' feeling, remind yourself of what will happen if 1 bolt is loose n falls off... then ensure(by design) that everything'll work as planned... run mental, 'what if' scenarios... and ALWAYS start off slow for new builds and test on terrain that you know(bumps/dips/cracks/ruts...).

I didn't even know that the TAV2 had +10% gearing. What exactly does that mean? I need to learn more about the TC's in general. As you can tell, I have a lot to learn!

+10% means that whatever the calculated topspeed acquired buy ratios... add 10% to that calculation... but IMO 'that' +10% is only relevant to engines that can achieve the torque at the required RPM.

I plan on running these 11.5x7.10 Dunlop slicks that came already installed on the kart. They only have about 25%-30% life left on the indicators so I figured I'd wear them down some more then look to replace them.

Good plan however... dont expect to get anywhere very fast on grass...lol

 

[adsum]

I would also recommend you dont forget to get a set of gaskets and 2 quarts of 'breakin' oil... good quality. I used "AMS oil".

Do you have a link you could share where I could purchase some breakin oil? Any recommendations on a quality assembly oil/lube?

If you are gonna do it 'that' way, if your not already gonna do it this way, I personally would install the parts before breaking in the engine... for acouple reasons. 1 The rings will set w/ the flattop piston. 2 You dont have to buy new rings.

That's sort of my plan. I didn't see the point in breaking in the new engine then having to drain all of the fluids and remove the motor from the kart just to modify it. I'd prefer to build the engine first, then fit it onto the kart.

I too am 'that' way darn ADHD. Just keep inmind throughout the project... you are making a toy that WILL kill you at the speeds we are gonna travel... at the least, mame/handicap/deform... EVERYTIME you find yourself getting that 'hurry up' feeling, remind yourself of what will happen if 1 bolt is loose n falls off... then ensure(by design) that everything'll work as planned... run mental, 'what if' scenarios... and ALWAYS start off slow for new builds and test on terrain that you know(bumps/dips/cracks/ruts...).

You're right, I tend to get a little ancy. "Patience is a virtue".... but it's more like "patience is safety rule #1!" haha.

Good plan however... dont expect to get anywhere very fast on grass...lol

I attempted riding it on the grass ONCE. Lets just say "pushing" a kart uphill is NEVER fun!

Info is uploaded (Lo-T2)... just not tested... yet(Im afraid of driving w/ my phone in my pocket nowadays... atleast till they finish paving the road).

I'm lucky enough to live on a paved road with a park and ride parking lot right down the street. So it gives me plenty of pavement to test on. I'm eager to see your results.

Sounds like a good plan... mainly cause I havent taken the vid of the areas youll need to grind down on the block/TC plate back, before being able to fit the TAV on it... yet.

Whenever you get around to it, I'd appreciate any help/video's you have to offer .

Jetting, I did mine at 36 bore. IMO for engine longevity, I wouldnt do valves/springs... The higher the RPM the shorter the life. The "racing" engines that are pulling 16hp+(big bored) at 9+k(18+lbs springs) RPM's from a 212 clone, usually have a life span of afew hours(20-40) before rebuilding is needed/recommended... if they havnt already blownup... 'literally'. I wouldnt do anything more due to that if you make TOO much hp, youll need to upgrade to a 40 series TC.

Basically what I'm looking for is a kart that puts you back into the seat with the capability of burning a little rubber if I want. It's tough because I teeter between "race" engine and reliability. I wouldn't want to be pouring money into the kart every season or sooner so maybe holding off on the valves and spring might be the option I need to choose.

I 'would' remove governor, get a billit conrod, a flattop piston, n a billit case/block cover(the plate you removed to get to the innards of the engine). A highflow intake(talk to Jim bout that) and a header(lil cigar muffler if your mindful of noise). Those mods themselves will bring the hp up to about +/-10hp. If you have the ability to, I also milled .020 off the head for more compression. If I knew anything bout the cams available Id recommend one... I plan on getting one day aswell as the 8* timing key.

Without milling the head, I'd be forced to go with the Standard piston right?http://www.doverpoweronlinestore.com/catalog/item/8251221/8971838.htm
*If* I decided to mill off .20 would this be the piston I would need? http://www.doverpoweronlinestore.com/catalog/item/8251221/8973239.htm
I see it doesn't include the wrist pin for the con rod and advises you to use the standard or stock rings. Am I understanding that correctly?
Maybe someone can chime in on which cam would be sufficient?
Side note: With these mods would I wouldn't need a fuel pump correct? If i decided to move the fuel tank to a different location lower than than the carb thats when I would need to add a fuel pump, right?
I've unboxed the engine, set up my work space and have begun removing the parts I plan to replace. I think my first project will be removing the governor once I've ordered the con rod and piston set up. Is there any reason to replace the crankshaft or will the stock one suffice? In order to remove the plastic governor gear, I need to remove the crank, con rod and piston, right? I'm going to have to find a tutorial or video on youtube that can walk me through it. It doesn't seem too difficult. Would you recommend removing the "low oil" sensor located inside the case? What type/size threaded bolt would I need to plug that hole up? The exhaust was removed as well as the stock air cleaner. *cough* Jim *cough* How about that high flow intake!
As you can see from the last photo, the stock paper gasket for the case cover is completely trashed. Do they make a gasket that isn't paper maybe something like a metal crush gasket that I could use to replace this one?

 

[Half-breeder]

Do you have a link you could share where I could purchase some breakin oil? Any recommendations on a quality assembly oil/lube?

AMS 0w40 is what I used... but then again I work next to the local dealer...

I'm lucky enough to live on a paved road with a park and ride parking lot right down the street. So it gives me plenty of pavement to test on. I'm eager to see your results.

Probably not as eager as I am for the city to finish the pavement!!!

Whenever you get around to it, I'd appreciate any help/video's you have to offer .

Well YTube is full of helpful (aswell as harmful) info out there... but read the comment below to see the credibility of the vid. If the info is BS, 9/10 times someone will call em out on it.

Without milling the head, I'd be forced to go with the Standard piston right?http://www.doverpoweronlinestore.com/catalog/item/8251221/8971838.htm
*If* I decided to mill off .20 would this be the piston I would need? http://www.doverpoweronlinestore.com/catalog/item/8251221/8973239.htm
I see it doesn't include the wrist pin for the con rod and advises you to use the standard or stock rings. Am I understanding that correctly?

Milling the head has lil to do w/ the piston... so... no. Milling the head is the removing of the surface of the head where the head touches the top of the cylinder.

Asfar as what I was speaking of you getting... would be this. Standard bore... just w/ a flattop(instead of the 'dished top' you currently have in there).

Side note: With these mods would I wouldn't need a fuel pump correct? If i decided to move the fuel tank to a different location lower than than the carb thats when I would need to add a fuel pump, right?

Yes, youre correct.

I've unboxed the engine, set up my work space and have begun removing the parts I plan to replace. I think my first project will be removing the governor once I've ordered the con rod and piston set up. Is there any reason to replace the crankshaft or will the stock one suffice? In order to remove the plastic governor gear, I need to remove the crank, con rod and piston, right? I'm going to have to find a tutorial or video on youtube that can walk me through it. It doesn't seem too difficult.

There are acouple different ways of removing the governor (and the innards should be removed yes... seeing as that your replacing the piston) plz dont remove the governor like some of the vids will show, punching a hole in the block, from the back. Take the time to remove the ring/clamp, washer, gear.

Would you recommend removing the "low oil" sensor located inside the case? What type/size threaded bolt would I need to plug that hole up?

Yes. The billit rod probably wont fit unless you do remove it. I simply pulled the wire through and used a short phillips head screw (screwed in from the outside) to plug the wire hole.

As you can see from the last photo, the stock paper gasket for the case cover is completely trashed. Do they make a gasket that isn't paper maybe something like a metal crush gasket that I could use to replace this one?

There is a thin rubber like one made... but unless the cover is warped... the paper ones work well enough. Just use black silicon on it n there should be no issues.

When calling those guys w/ your order... be sure to ask ANY size n fitting questions... ensure they know your buying for a HF212 and 'not' a gx200. Not sure if there is an internal size difference... but there are 'other' slight things that dont "EXACTLY" fit from a clone to a original.

 

[adsum]

AMS 0w40 is what I used... but then again I work next to the local dealer...

I think I'll order 2 quarts just to be safe.

Probably not as eager as I am for the city to finish the pavement!!!

I couldn't even imagine....

Well YTube is full of helpful (aswell as harmful) info out there... but read the comment below to see the credibility of the vid. If the info is BS, 9/10 times someone will call em out on it.

I'm usually pretty skeptical about Youtube video's. I tend to fact check anything I see just because I don't trust people blindly.

Milling the head has lil to do w/ the piston... so... no. Milling the head is the removing of the surface of the head where the head touches the top of the cylinder.

Remember when I said that sometimes my brain tends to turns off ....yeah....I KNEW that! I was just not thinking in that last post. Milling the head basically removes a few hundredth/thousandths or less of an inch off the head in order to make an even mating surface from the head to the block itself.

Asfar as what I was speaking of you getting... would be this. Standard bore... just w/ a flattop(instead of the 'dished top' you currently have in there).

That's what I thought, just wanted to check.
UPDATE I pulled apart the rest of the motor today and surprisingly found that IT already had a flattop piston!! . I was pretty confident that when I searched the stock # online that this motor was going to come with a dish piston rather than the flat top! I'm not sure what I'll do now since I won't be needing to order the new piston after all.

There are acouple different ways of removing the governor (and the innards should be removed yes... seeing as that your replacing the piston) plz dont remove the governor like some of the vids will show, punching a hole in the block, from the back. Take the time to remove the ring/clamp, washer, gear.

I'm a firm believer in "Do it once, do it right!". Anytime you half a** something, it usually comes full circle to bite you.

Yes. The billit rod probably wont fit unless you do remove it. I simply pulled the wire through and used a short phillips head screw (screwed in from the outside) to plug the wire hole.

I started loosening everything up. I'll need to find a short bolt to thread into the case to cap off the hole. I'll remove the yellow wire going to the kill switch and that should complete that.

There is a thin rubber like one made... but unless the cover is warped... the paper ones work well enough. Just use black silicon on it n there should be no issues.

I guess my issue with the paper gaskets are if I need to pull apart the motor again after reassembly, that gasket will be trashed. at least with a rubber gasket I have a chance to be able to reuse it if it's not too trashed. . Now I just need to figure out which gasket kit to order(not sure which motor I have now) . I'd like to just get an entire set to have on hand. I'll be needing a new head gasket, cover gasket and exhaust gasket.

When calling those guys w/ your order... be sure to ask ANY size n fitting questions... ensure they know your buying for a HF212 and 'not' a gx200. Not sure if there is an internal size difference... but there are 'other' slight things that dont "EXACTLY" fit from a clone to a original.

Tried calling today but they were probably closed. It's like they don't even care that some of us do our wrench turning on the weekends!

Thank you everyone for all your help so far. You guys have been my guiding eyes in this build so far and I truly do appreciate it!

 

[Half-breeder]

GOOD deal on the stock flattop... they must have slightly changed the design this yr. In that case... you can drop the $ on a pulse pump (if youre plannin on moving the tank lower than the carb)... n if you n Jim aint talked... you can get a billit intake... IMO.