Mini Buggy Build

[rgvkid]

Yes it is necessary to clean the steel before you weld or else you get to many impurities in the bead. I'd practice a bit more on scrap before you weld the frame. Just because it fills the hole doesn't mean its penetrating and or brittle. The bead can crack right through the center if it is too brittle.

Fill me in on you setup and settings? Maybe i can help you dial it in. Is that a 135 miller? Are you using Co2/argon, Co2, or flux core? What size wire? Get an 80 grit flap disk for a 4.5 grinder and sand the area you are going to weld together. Also bevel all the connecting edges at a 45 degree so the bead has an area to fall into.

Do it right the first time so you and family are safe and don't get hurt or have to do it over. I once saw a guy ride his homebuilt buggy with crappy welds and he took a small 2 ft. jump. When he landed, one of the center rails snapped and impaled the 13yr old kids leg in the passengers seat. They had to cut out the piece of tubing and he had to drive to the hospital with the tubing sticking out of his leg.

 

[rgvkid]

The yellow circles are bad connections "Dead Tubes". Dead tubes are not structurally sound.

I'd go with this route. you can put an x if you like on the drive side panels. Just use thinner walled tubing to lighten up the weight.

 

[HellSpawn]

Yes it is necessary to clean the steel before you weld or else you get to many impurities in the bead. I'd practice a bit more on scrap before you weld the frame. Just because it fills the hole doesn't mean its penetrating and or brittle. The bead can crack right through the center if it is too brittle.

Fill me in on you setup and settings? Maybe i can help you dial it in. Is that a 135 miller? Are you using Co2/argon, Co2, or flux core? What size wire? Get an 80 grit flap disk for a 4.5 grinder and sand the area you are going to weld together. Also bevel all the connecting edges at a 45 degree so the bead has an area to fall into.

Do it right the first time so you and family are safe and don't get hurt or have to do it over. I once saw a guy ride his homebuilt buggy with crappy welds and he took a small 2 ft. jump. When he landed, one of the center rails snapped and impaled the 13yr old kids leg in the passengers seat. They had to cut out the piece of tubing and he had to drive to the hospital with the tubing sticking out of his leg.

You keep going on based on what you read, I'll keep going on based on experience and practice.

 

[qcfc88]

You keep going on based on what you read, I'll keep going on based on experience and practice.

Hellspawn, the OP just got a welder for Christmas and doesn't have, I assume, the experience and practice you do.

I think the advice rgvkid is giving is spot on; it was the same advice I received when I began welding and it was very helpful.

 

[Doc Sprocket]

Hellspawn, the OP just got a welder for Christmas and doesn't have, I assume, the experience and practice you do.

I think the advice rgvkid is giving is spot on; it was the same advice I received when I began welding and it was very helpful.

It is very good advice. Here's some more advice- learn how to do things properly, the first time. With time and experience, you will then learn what you can safely "get away with".

Sure enough, I often do not follow all those steps when FCAW welding, but I can also recognize a good or bad weld WHILE doing it, and can take steps to rectify it. A beginner will probably not see it while doing it, maybe not even after. And if your life is potentially on the line, it's a stupid gamble.

 

[rgvkid]

You keep going on based on what you read, I'll keep going on based on experience and practice.

HUH? Umm Okay. Here are the last few adult sized Go karts I built. Should be enough practice to justify what im talking about.

 

[rgvkid]

Sorry for Hijacking Freyguy, But Homie was calling me out. Its all good though, Just trying to contribute to the site for I am grateful for all the tips I've learned and help thats been given to me on this forum.

 

[qcfc88]

Sorry for Hijacking Freyguy, But Homie was calling me out. Its all good though, Just trying to contribute to the site for I am grateful for all the tips I've learned and help thats been given to me on this forum.

Ditto, it's best to receive good advice, then you can do with it what you wish.

Great build so far, keep the updates coming!

 

[mrfreyguy]

Although its a little more work, id calculate geometry with unequal length a-arms, giving you a great camber change throughout articulation. Another thing is, if using long travel shocks, point the insides of the tops of the shocks together in the front, rather than straight up like all of these other idiots, giving you less bind on the shocks and potential for more travel, seems to be something youre going for with such long arms, good choice, same length arms we ran on the baja. also, design of your uprights, joice of tie rod ends, steering rack, alignment of kingpin and pivoting point of tie rod and a-arms will all factor into ruling out bumpsteer, if not taken into consideration and too short of tie rods are used, youll have bumpsteer. if you would wish, you can check out the sae baja cars in my albums, i think theyll help you out a little and if you need any help with suspension and or steering geometry, or really any of the engineering or design,d let me know, it is my specialty, as you may see from my engineering and fabrication on the cars. i have a few suggestions when it comes to your cage and chassis, but ill keep them to myself unless you want some hints haha. have fun with it and keep us posted!

oh and another thing, what are you planning on running as far as transmission, chaincase, clutch, cv axles, cv joints and outer hubs? i could help you get a hella amount of travel if you'd like, squeezed 28" of travel front and rear our of our baja with 19" of ground clearance and cv axle angularity to an amazing minimum, in only a 60" overall vehicle width.

Thanks for all the info! Ill keep everything in mind when im building the a-arms etc. Im using the bikes transmission and running 02' subaru impreza outback front axles and cv's. Id love to have alot of travel but I dont know how much they will take.

Good start on ya frame , hers a little info ya can check on if interested , .
On my Off-Road kart I`ll soon be putting together I`m going full independent suspension , on the rear I`m gonna be using a set of drivers side CV axles out of a 92-98 VW Jetta , I have a 1984 Yamaha TT600 single cylinder 4 stroke , 4 valve engine I`m gonna use on it ( tons of torque ! )

Sounds like its gonna be awsome. Cant wait to see it done.

Yes it is necessary to clean the steel before you weld or else you get to many impurities in the bead. I'd practice a bit more on scrap before you weld the frame. Just because it fills the hole doesn't mean its penetrating and or brittle. The bead can crack right through the center if it is too brittle.

Fill me in on you setup and settings? Maybe i can help you dial it in. Is that a 135 miller? Are you using Co2/argon, Co2, or flux core? What size wire? Get an 80 grit flap disk for a 4.5 grinder and sand the area you are going to weld together. Also bevel all the connecting edges at a 45 degree so the bead has an area to fall into.

Do it right the first time so you and family are safe and don't get hurt or have to do it over. I once saw a guy ride his homebuilt buggy with crappy welds and he took a small 2 ft. jump. When he landed, one of the center rails snapped and impaled the 13yr old kids leg in the passengers seat. They had to cut out the piece of tubing and he had to drive to the hospital with the tubing sticking out of his leg.

Welder is a MillerMatic 211 w/ autoset. Im using a co2/argon mixture with .30 wire until I buy a 10lb spool of .35 wire. Im going to get a grinder once I get the money to get a decent one . Ill make sure tto clean up everything once I do my final welds. I didnt think that it was neccicary to do so for the tack welds. Ill bevel therest of the edges. Even though Ill be doing all the driving in the buggy I really dont want any tube-through-leg-accidents so ill take all the precautions. Safety first!

The yellow circles are bad connections "Dead Tubes". Dead tubes are not structurally sound.

I'd go with this route. you can put an x if you like on the drive side panels. Just use thinner walled tubing to lighten up the weight.

Thanks for doing this for me again!!! I really appreciate all the help you've given me on this so far .

Hellspawn, the OP just got a welder for Christmas and doesn't have, I assume, the experience and practice you do.

I think the advice rgvkid is giving is spot on; it was the same advice I received when I began welding and it was very helpful.

Ive been welding for some time now so I dont have the multi year experiance that some of you do, but I do have some , I was just fortunate enough to finaly get a welder of my own at home and not have to use my schools anymore . Thanks again for all the advice!

It is very good advice. Here's some more advice- learn how to do things properly, the first time. With time and experience, you will then learn what you can safely "get away with".

Sure enough, I often do not follow all those steps when FCAW welding, but I can also recognize a good or bad weld WHILE doing it, and can take steps to rectify it. A beginner will probably not see it while doing it, maybe not even after. And if your life is potentially on the line, it's a stupid gamble.

Ya id agree with you on doing it right the first time. I dont really want to gamble with my life cause I sure got alot of it left so ill make sure to do things right the first time. I can recognize a bad weld. You should see some of the welds that kids make in shop class

Sorry for Hijacking Freyguy, But Homie was calling me out. Its all good though, Just trying to contribute to the site for I am grateful for all the tips I've learned and help thats been given to me on this forum.

No problem man! I also appreciate the help that all you guys give me on my builds!

Ditto, it's best to receive good advice, then you can do with it what you wish.

Great build so far, keep the updates coming!

Thanks! I was going to do some more cutting and welding this weekend but I have a state tourny so I dont know if ill get anything done. Ill try to update soon!

 

[rgvkid]

No Problem Frey. Stay with the .030. The .35 is not necessary and will blow through the thinner walled tubing if your heat is too high. Plus it will leave a bigger bead and will under cut or bite into the edges of the bead if it is set to high.

Practice Trigger Welding on some scrap first to get the feel of the welder and to dial it in. Basically, hold the trigger for a couple seconds then move about a 1/4 inch and do the same. So on and so on. Once you get that down and familiar with the welder then try constant half moons or full circles. You'll get less slag if you drag the bead rather then push the bead. With 1/8 walled tubing, dragging the bead is fine and will penetrate into the beveled groove. Pushing the bead will penetrate deeper and or blow through the seam. Pushing the bead is good for thicker material.

Keep your gas between 10-15psi depending on if there is a draft or not.
Make sure the tip of the gun is always clean inside the nozzle. It will build up with slag and you have to clean it out often. Pick up the jar of wax that you dip the nozzle in, It keeps the slag out of the nozzle. Also pick up a can of anti spatter spray, It helps keep the surrounding material clean. You can use Pam cooking oil also but it sprays on pretty heavy so you'll have to wipe it down beforehand.

Keep an extra set of tips around just in case you touch the tip and it welds itself shut.

You don't need an expensive Grinder. You can get 2 for the price of 1 at Harbor freight. I had a dewalt that only lasted a year when some of my Harbor freights have been going on for over 1.5 years now. get the more expensive harbor freight 4.5 grinder, the cheaper ones don't last as long. Get 2 or 3 grinders that way you can have 1 with a cut off wheel, 1 with a 80 grit flap disk, and 1 with a grinding wheel. This way you don't have to stop and change the wheel all the time. Thats a pain in the Booty!

Remember, when welding, take your time, go as slow as possible, Don't weld all the seams until the piece you are building is completed. Tack everything first. as impatient as it can be, It can take a month to build and tack together an entire cage and only a day to weld it all up when completed. The cage will shrink and distort when you weld it together so you have to make sure you tack everything in place Good. If you weld it up as you go along it may tweak and become caddywompus leaving you with off dimensions.

On square tubing its best to tack the corners, and try to keep your 45 degrees as tight as possible.

Are you running the welder on 110 or 220? Some of the newer welders have a regulator that you can switch to run on either or.

Hope this helps.

Oh yah, Use good wire, not cheap stuff. It does make a difference. Lincoln L-56 and Pinnacle are good. Don't use Harbor Freight wire or Radnor. Radnor sucks. I use Pinnacle myself and or L-56 if i run out of teh 10lb spool and have to run to Home depot to pick up the L-56.

Good luck man. Keep the pics coming.

 

[HellSpawn]

I didn't mean to cause a stir, but I'm just saying, With decent wire and perfect welder settings, surface rust is not an issue. If the metal has been previously beveled in the joint areas correctly, it'll penetrate just fine, even with a slight surface rust.

I also enjoy the fact that I don't go through grinding disks so quickly nowadays.

 

[redsox985]

Wire wheels are cheap and do a great job. I would knock off any rust as to remove as many impurities from the weld as possible.

 

[mrfreyguy]

Thanks for the welding tips rgv! I cut some more steel for the frame today but had to leave for a super bowl party so I couldnt tack them on. Glad to be making some forward progress lol. Ill hopefully weld the pieces on tomorrow night. Redsock i have a wire wheel for my drill that ill probably use from now on so thanks for reminding me.

Pieces I cut

Where they go

 

[rgvkid]

Looking forward to seeing it come together.

An X or single triangulation would work much better in this area. If you use an X you could even go as low as 1in.sq x.065-.075 walled tubing. I would get another stick of 14gauge 1 inch tubing, preferably round but square is fine if you don't have the budget, for the cross gussets, or triangulation to keep the weight down. if you completely use 1/8 walled it is going to weigh a ton. The main focus in building cages is to have the heavier walled in structural areas and lighter in cross bracing to keep it all together and from shifting if rolled or hit.

 

[mrfreyguy]

Looking forward to seeing it come together.

An X or single triangulation would work much better in this area. If you use an X you could even go as low as 1in.sq x.065-.075 walled tubing. I would get another stick of 14gauge 1 inch tubing, preferably round but square is fine if you don't have the budget, for the cross gussets, or triangulation to keep the weight down. if you completely use 1/8 walled it is going to weigh a ton. The main focus in building cages is to have the heavier walled in structural areas and lighter in cross bracing to keep it all together and from shifting if rolled or hit.

Ill probably triangulate it right there. Ill pick up some 1 * .75 inch tube for bracing when I get some more money. Do you think 1 * .110 tubing would look good and be sutable for the roll cage? I havn't been able to weld due to the negative tempatures here so hopefully Ill get that going soon. Ill hopefully welding tomorrow night or the next when it warms up

 

[rgvkid]

Yah the 1"x.110 will be good with the right gusseting and cross bracing. Just make sure you tack it all together before you weld all the seams. This way it'll be easier to make changes if you need to add, remove, and or relocate any tubing. Plus it will tweak less when you start welding everything together.

Negative temperatures!!! Yikes!!!. I can't stand the cold. Its about 60 degrees here in LA and thats freezing in our terms. I can't even imagine what it would be like to be negative. Stay warm Buddy!

 

[Lynx_Genisys]

is it done yet??? lol..

jk jk jk

i hate waiting.. of course, i imagine you're more anxious to see this built than i am.. haha

still watching and waiting!!!

and as for temps. hats mainly my problem too.. we're sitting at -32 degrees.. of course thats celcius, but meh..

winter sucks.. I dont know why i was born in this climate.. i cant stand the cold!!!

 

[mrfreyguy]

Yah the 1"x.110 will be good with the right gusseting and cross bracing. Just make sure you tack it all together before you weld all the seams. This way it'll be easier to make changes if you need to add, remove, and or relocate any tubing. Plus it will tweak less when you start welding everything together.

Negative temperatures!!! Yikes!!!. I can't stand the cold. Its about 60 degrees here in LA and thats freezing in our terms. I can't even imagine what it would be like to be negative. Stay warm Buddy!

Ill keep that all in mind when I start the cage. I just hop the 1 in tubing dosent look weird with the 1.125 in square.
Negative tempatures are just... . I guess once you live in them for a while though they dont really bother you. I really wish it was 60* right now but it will be a couple of months before that happens lol.

is it done yet??? lol..

jk jk jk

i hate waiting.. of course, i imagine you're more anxious to see this built than i am.. haha

still watching and waiting!!!

and as for temps. hats mainly my problem too.. we're sitting at -32 degrees.. of course thats celcius, but meh..

winter sucks.. I dont know why i was born in this climate.. i cant stand the cold!!!

Low temps suck lol. I think im gonna insulate my garage
Believe me I cant wait to finish this. Ive been rendering something like this for about 2 years and ive finaly got to it so its going to get done soon All my friends who dont know about mechanichs give me crap all the time about finishing my projects. I cant wait to see their faces when this gets finished. I had practice today so I couldnt weld but guess what ?! high of 34 tomorrow so Im going to get as much as I can done after my sections tourny. Hopefully a big update tomorrow

 

[rgvkid]

It will look fine. Alot of sand cars and prerunners that use 1.75 tubing for their cages use 1in. for triangulation all the time. You could even go with 3/4 round x .075 or .090.

 

[mrfreyguy]

I got a good amount of stuff done in the hour I had tonight. Started welding some stuff as you can see in the pics. Everything is fitting togeather nicely and looking good so far. Ill hopefully be welding some more togeather tomorrow. Let me know what ya think?