Car engine in a go kart
- Thread starter KlaudioP
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jandj
Active member
Bottom line is it doesn't matter what your IQ
is, or how book smart you are.
Some of the best designs in race car history resulted from chalk lines on a garage floor.
The caveat is that they were natural born builders.
I don't get the feeling that this is a project from the next AJ Watson or Colin Chapman.
It seems like a cobbled together deathmobile and that worries me.
Please, slow down and do some research.
We may pick at you but we don't want to see you hurt.
is, or how book smart you are.
Some of the best designs in race car history resulted from chalk lines on a garage floor.
The caveat is that they were natural born builders.
I don't get the feeling that this is a project from the next AJ Watson or Colin Chapman.
It seems like a cobbled together deathmobile and that worries me.
Please, slow down and do some research.
We may pick at you but we don't want to see you hurt.
2SlickNick
American Minibikes @ FB
I don't think I can read this anymore... :shrugs:
ML-TOYS
New member
5 pages not one pic ? Or age answered
I understand where you are coming from but the thing is rarely no one has done this, no one has posted any methods of how to do this and I want to try first hand if it is possible or not because that is just what kind of person I am. I have an engineers helping me, the money is there and right now I have the time. Don't worry the engineer promised he will test the kart and assess it before I am allowed anywhere near it because if something goes wrong the school and any companies helping me could get sued for millions because it is their responsibility to make the go kart as safe as possible. I think I can do it, I've done the research and I still think I can do it.
---------- Post added at 09:55 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:53 PM ----------
btw I am going to be 17 years old soon and I am going into my first year of a-levels
---------- Post added at 10:14 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:55 PM ----------
The picture should come up, the chassis is an lrg racing chassis with all the stiffening beams but we plan to make it bigger and much stronger than it is now. It used to have a rotax max engine in before I bought it but it wasn't used that much. I reconditioned the rear brake caliper myself and i am getting my front brake calipers from a superbike such as an r1 or a cbr 1000 rr etc. I will be running vented and grooved super kart front discs. Currently the chassis has a 40mm rear axle but may not need it if I use the rx8 engine however there is a small chance that I will use a r1 big bang engine but priority will be given to the rx8 option.I might invest in some carbon fiber steering rods to make it a tad lighter. Carbon kevlar seat cost a lot but came with it. We will be putting a four point harness on the seat. As I said before we will be incorporating some kind of parachute for safety reasons.
I have ordered new hubs for the front, front brakes, front stubs,front discs, front wheels, tyre seem to be not that bad.
---------- Post added at 09:55 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:53 PM ----------
btw I am going to be 17 years old soon and I am going into my first year of a-levels
---------- Post added at 10:14 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:55 PM ----------
The picture should come up, the chassis is an lrg racing chassis with all the stiffening beams but we plan to make it bigger and much stronger than it is now. It used to have a rotax max engine in before I bought it but it wasn't used that much. I reconditioned the rear brake caliper myself and i am getting my front brake calipers from a superbike such as an r1 or a cbr 1000 rr etc. I will be running vented and grooved super kart front discs. Currently the chassis has a 40mm rear axle but may not need it if I use the rx8 engine however there is a small chance that I will use a r1 big bang engine but priority will be given to the rx8 option.I might invest in some carbon fiber steering rods to make it a tad lighter. Carbon kevlar seat cost a lot but came with it. We will be putting a four point harness on the seat. As I said before we will be incorporating some kind of parachute for safety reasons.
crazykart
Crazy member
Pics, designs, anything at all besides talk or I call 
I personally think that sid was being very very nice to your side with his math.
Idk maybe if you strapped a rocket or two to it to achieve a final top speed of over 200 mph...
Yes the car might have a top speed of 150mph, but the car also has some aerodynamics working in its favor. On top of that, you do realize that once you reach a certain speed the air itself is whats going to cause you to not be able to accelerate anymore (as sid also pointed out in his gracious math).
That's where the doubling of the power needed from the engine comes in.
Do some research, and answer me this: What cars, that use just engines, have ever broken the 200 mph mark? Now how much was the rwhp if each vehicle? We're any under 300 rwhp???
Yes, you're going to argue weight, weight weight weight, but weight is not going to make that huge of a difference. There is so much more that goes into making something fast than just weight and hp. On top of that, since it is going to be extremely light, maybe you should think about at which point it's going to stop being a ground based vehicle, and start flying. You're talking about this "kart" being so Uber light, but yet still rigid and safe, and you give us this example of weight that is tiny to say the least. So with this teeny tiny bit of weight that the kart is, answer me this: Will it have a body, or just frame and roll bar? Because with what you're saying I don't see a body being possible, and it being made safe enough to hit 200 mph. Without a properly designed body, do you think it will generate enough down force to keep it being a ground based vehicle, and not start to "fly" the second the air goes to lift it?
I'm also not trying to attack you, but I know the UK has a very good school system, and to say that you're at the top of your class in one of their best schools when you fail to use punctuation through 90% of what you say... well it's quite unbelievable to say the least. It's given me a headache trying to make heads or tails of what you've been saying. So please put that brain to use and punctuate. Also it would be nice if you could paragraph seperate as well.
I would love for this idea to actually become a reality, but I don't see anything more here than someone blowing smoke up our bums. Not one shred of anything...
I personally think that sid was being very very nice to your side with his math.
Idk maybe if you strapped a rocket or two to it to achieve a final top speed of over 200 mph...
Yes the car might have a top speed of 150mph, but the car also has some aerodynamics working in its favor. On top of that, you do realize that once you reach a certain speed the air itself is whats going to cause you to not be able to accelerate anymore (as sid also pointed out in his gracious math).
That's where the doubling of the power needed from the engine comes in.
Do some research, and answer me this: What cars, that use just engines, have ever broken the 200 mph mark? Now how much was the rwhp if each vehicle? We're any under 300 rwhp???
Yes, you're going to argue weight, weight weight weight, but weight is not going to make that huge of a difference. There is so much more that goes into making something fast than just weight and hp. On top of that, since it is going to be extremely light, maybe you should think about at which point it's going to stop being a ground based vehicle, and start flying. You're talking about this "kart" being so Uber light, but yet still rigid and safe, and you give us this example of weight that is tiny to say the least. So with this teeny tiny bit of weight that the kart is, answer me this: Will it have a body, or just frame and roll bar? Because with what you're saying I don't see a body being possible, and it being made safe enough to hit 200 mph. Without a properly designed body, do you think it will generate enough down force to keep it being a ground based vehicle, and not start to "fly" the second the air goes to lift it?
I'm also not trying to attack you, but I know the UK has a very good school system, and to say that you're at the top of your class in one of their best schools when you fail to use punctuation through 90% of what you say... well it's quite unbelievable to say the least. It's given me a headache trying to make heads or tails of what you've been saying. So please put that brain to use and punctuate. Also it would be nice if you could paragraph seperate as well.
I would love for this idea to actually become a reality, but I don't see anything more here than someone blowing smoke up our bums. Not one shred of anything...
machinist@large
Active member
Zero pictures yet. Based on your last edit, you're going to hack up an existing racing kart as your starting point. Some of the things you're worried about (carbon steering rods?!?!?) are the last things you should be focused on.
Go back and actually read thru and understand the forces and loadings that 'Sid calculated for that dream run, and throw this critical item into the mix.
Is this thing going to be able to protect you if, for what ever reason, you encounter a solid, unmoving object at whatever pipedream speed you claim you're shooting for. 'Sids' number crunching was the theoretical best case, and most likely didn't include all the real world addition's that you're going to need for safety so this thing is probably going to weigh at least half again, if not more than you dream it will.
And since the valve timing for a rotary engine is fixed by its port location's, any changes to increase power output will be costly, and/or require expertise to perform...
If I was you, I'd save the money and put it towards my college tuition fund; you'ed bet better off in the long run.
ML-TOYS
New member
Hmmmmmmmm
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ML-TOYS
New member
So klaud, how fast have you ever gone ?
I really think you will need this seat for the bricks you will be ejecting from your @$$
I really think you will need this seat for the bricks you will be ejecting from your @$$
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ML-TOYS
New member
Heres a preview of what a 200mph crash looks like. This was a lambo btw.
Now i'm starting to enjoy myself
Now i'm starting to enjoy myself
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machinist@large
Active member
I'm trying to come up with a serious response, but I just can't keep a straight face......
mckutzy
Well-known member
I believe that was a Lamborghini of the carbonaceous verity...... Interesting to see a complete meltdown of such a viehicle... A sad sight but what a scene...
Poboy kartman
Senior Moments Member
GOOD POINTS! Let's just take a look at Don Garlitt's Top Fuel Dragster:
Not an experimental machine, but an NHRA approved design used by most of the crowd. Big Daddy was no 17 year old wannabe, but a seasoned veteran of topping 300 mph with some of the top people in there field behind him....
Now the incident I am referring to happened before mid-track....sooooo....I'm guesstimating somewhere in the 200 mph range....I'm also not sure, but I think they have at least a quarter million in those vehicles and probably closer to a half.....Yet....his car got airborne, flipped 180° and he slid down the track backwards....(parachute didn't do much good then)....
machinist@large
Active member
I know that they do a complete engine rebuild in the pits between run's (nitro methane fuel being force fed to the engine with the super charger set up for in exes of 60 PSI of boost kind of make's that a requirement).Somewhere several year's ago I read that just the cost for each run for the rotating assembly was pushing ~$10,000.00 a pass???? Or is CRS catching up with me?
Don't answer that Doug, for you it was just a rhetorical question.....
ML-TOYS
New member
I personally 30 years ago blew up my friends 1970 nova when i buried the speedometer past the 120 mark. That was scary but the mazda that we put a 455ci in was the scariest. The driver and passenger seats were in the back seat area. I was the passenger and hit the kill switch when it started shaking at roughly 120. So until you experience something like that in a car you have no idea what your up against.
Poboy kartman
Senior Moments Member
Somewhere several year's ago I read that just the cost for each run for the rotating assembly was pushing ~$10,000.00 a pass???? Or is CRS catching up with me?
Don't answer that Doug, for you it was just a rhetorical question.....
Pat....there's an old saying in the drag racing scene: "You can make a small fortune doing it...as long as you have a large one to spend....."
I'm not sure it's ten grand a run....but yeah complete teardown after each run and a couple of grand in parts....(some can be reused some not....but the track is not where they decide that)....
You may be right on that, though, IDK....but Top Fuel is no Poboy game!!!!
machinist@large
Active member
My first motorcycle was a 1977 Honda 750cc Super Sport, with an aftermarket Windjammer III fairing. I got a real crash course in abject terror when I went for a speed run on a nice flat empty road.
Somewhere north of 120, the tach is climbing fast, but the speedometer (driven off of the front wheel), suddenly started dropping fast. That's when I realized that I could turn the handlebars without any effort, because the fairing had turned into a wing.....
That bike was for sale really quickly. The only funny part was when the next owner gave me the fairing and mounting frame a couple of weeks later.... Apparently he had to change his underwear too.....
crazykart
Crazy member
Right around 130 in my first T/A is when I crapped my pants. Nice flat freshly paved road. Cruising along, trying to see what I could top it out at with the new engine in it (383 stroker took me 2 winters to build). Felt a shake from the front end, then I just started to feel like I was leaning back on my seat. Pulled the e-brake and felt the front end slam back down (actually ended up bending the outer tie rods). Another second I would have probably been flying, then flipping, then dead.
The point of us all telling you this is for you to realize that this is not a game. We can tell, from experience, the you have no clue what you're trying to get into, or even hiw to achieve it (let alone safely achieve it!)
You will kill yourself.
Even with just talk you have demonstrated numerous flaws in your "plan".
Still have provided not one shred of anything as far as a "plan" besides talk of a pubescent teen that thinks they know it all. What you're saying isn't crazy, it's ignorant. You are ignoring all facts, and thinking you can overcome them.
Have you ever went 150 mph? No better yet, have you ever yourself driven 150 mph???
Have you ever driven 100 mph???
Well in a kart 50 seems like 100, 100 seems like death.
Stick to dreaming because that's the only place where this could live for you, in a dream.
The point of us all telling you this is for you to realize that this is not a game. We can tell, from experience, the you have no clue what you're trying to get into, or even hiw to achieve it (let alone safely achieve it!)
You will kill yourself.
Even with just talk you have demonstrated numerous flaws in your "plan".
Still have provided not one shred of anything as far as a "plan" besides talk of a pubescent teen that thinks they know it all. What you're saying isn't crazy, it's ignorant. You are ignoring all facts, and thinking you can overcome them.
Have you ever went 150 mph? No better yet, have you ever yourself driven 150 mph???
Have you ever driven 100 mph???
Well in a kart 50 seems like 100, 100 seems like death.
Stick to dreaming because that's the only place where this could live for you, in a dream.
I'm terribly sorry.Sid, you just fried my 52 IQ brain.
I'll simplify it since even Klaudios 137 IQ *cough* (sorry, got smoke into my eyes) brain isn't capable of wrapping his head around my math...
in very basic terms, NO vehicle with a dynamic air index (let me call it that) of 0.53 kg/m can move 201 mph with less than 520 hp!
A more detailed explanation (with additional math I'm afraid)
[feel free to skip]
That index is a simplification or air density (assumed the summerday average around my altitude above sealevel [1.2kg/m³ ]) the aerodynamic coefficient and the frontal area of a gokart with a radiator; that results in 0.53 kg/m!
Let me try to explain why the RX8 can reach 150mph...
A well designed (aerodynamically not aesthetically) car will have a MUCH lower coefficient and a larger frontal area.
so the numbers will be very different from the ones on a kart.
I'm not eager to search for the numbers, but I think it'll be somewhere around 0.3 kg/m
Now, the absolute worst part: the SPEED
as you can see in my calculation it's cubed...
and that exponential growth will kill the claim.
150mph are almost exactly 67m/s
cubed: 300763
201mph are 90 m/s
cubed: 729000
(see how big that difference is in fact?)
So, even the bad air index of 0.53 would push the kart to 150mph (159.4 kW needed)
the RX is heavier, yes, but it compensates for that with a much better aerodynamic coefficient.
and frankly.. weight at that kind of speeds isn't too important at all..
Klaudio, it seems like you do not know better, which is okay'ish
well, it would be if you're 13 or 14 maybe... but at the age you claim to have reached, you should have heard that in your physics class already.
Or... you do not comprehend the issue you'll be facing.
at which point another number you claimed must be made up; you know which one, right?!
'sid
machinist@large
Active member
So, Alex, was I too hard on him? I mean, just from what I learned in industrial pneumatics, I could (loosely) follow your math, and I almost flunked math and geometry in school. So what part of it do you think he's totally failed to understand (other than all of it)?????
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