My first kart/buggy build Ninja 250R motor

[bighead]

How did the box look? I was worried about it getting beat up for it weighed so much?

 

[Timtreo]

Hey bighead the box looked great, you packed everything real well with the foam. I am surprised you were able to get it all in there. Everything looks great. I wish I saved that foam now for the ninja parts I'm going to sell and ship.
What was your idea when you told me not to grind the rest of the metal off the bar yet?

I picked up the rest of the ninja, here is a few pics of the frame. The swing arm is all steel but I dont really know how I could use it. I'll be able to use the hydraulic brake caliper and disc, just got to extend the hose somehow or get a new longer one.

 

[bighead]

Not sure if you can do it. You can cut your kart frame off behind the seat. Then you could cut the swival point out of the bike frame and weld that to the kart behind your seat. Then cut the swingarm off about 4" long. Then weld your kart frame that you cut off to the swingarm. This giving you your swingarm mounting.

Just don't grind the bar smooth. You need to leave the ledge on both sides to stop the j-armes.

I see you got the airbox. Nice..

 

[Timtreo]

I got the frame stripped down tonight. I think I'm going to scratch that using the swing arm idea. I think Ide rather have several pivot points back there then just the one. I'll just put the swing arm on Ebay with the other parts I'm not going to use.
I think I could cut the frame (at the arrows) and then use the rest of it with some other fabrication to weld to the kart frame. Cutting it there would leave the aibox still mounted to the frame where it goes to hook back up nicely.
Still haven't figured it all out yet. It's been way too hot out in my little shop to do much and I can't really work out there at night when it cools down or my ahole neighbor would go bananas. Although I do enjoy having it out with him so maybe I should .

I killed another one of those freaky spiders that explode into a million little spiders when you smash it tonight (sorry if anyone is offended by killing spiders) It was crawling up my Magic Mesh (as seen on TV) screen in the shop. Torched it's but after I stomped out all the little ones. Should have gone and got the camera first but didn't want to let it get away in the shop. Something tells me I'll have another video opportunity...

 

[bighead]

I see your engine mounts down low on the frame so the bike swingarm idea would not work.

With that frame your going to have to hang the engine in the kart. And weld bars going from the karts main frame up to the bike frame. And or weld the frame to roll bar behind seat. I never did this type of work so not sure what your going to have to do. I was thinking the bike frame had full cage around engine you could just weld in. Not sure how your going to do it with the engine hanging like that.

Buy one of the bug spray bombs you set off overnight. It will kill all that stuff.

Is there a way to make the rear part of the frame into a rack? Or build rack off that? This may clean up the bike frame look back there. If anything I think you can cut that bike frame down to just everything you need. Cut everything else off and it would look good. Like cut that backbone out going up to the neck.

Can you post a pic of your whole exhaust system? You may have to have brake hose made.

 

[OzFab]

Seriously? You have to hang the engine? Dude, your workload just doubled

 

[Timtreo]

Yeah I know but I was never looking for a quick project anyway. I'm just going to take my time and make this thing really cool.
Here is a pic of the exhaust bighead. The motor is leaning back in the pic and the pipe can be turned to get it pointed up more. Actually I trhink I'm going to cut the header pipe (at the arrow) to shorten it a little. Anyone know if that would affect the flow and back pressure much if I cut it there? Thanks

 

[Timtreo]

I got the J arm bar cleaned up and tacked where I think it's going to go today. I had to cut the corners out of my frame to make them work with the bar because my frame is wider than an Oddyssey frame, I'll weld some bars back in at the corners where I cut it and add lots of braces to the front end. Also going to weld a piece of angle between/against the J arm bar and the top bar of my frame. And some 1" square tube from the back of the J bar angled down to the lower frame bar. It's definitely going to be a solid front end. I got that slight bend out of the bar also (I think) by heating it with a torch and stcking it in my truck hitch receptical and jumping on it . Hard to tell it was so slight to begin with.

Bighead, I tried to replicate the best I could off of this picture of yours to try to get the height of the J bar and J arm angles and all correct so the alignment/geometry would be right.

BTW - How do you post pics in a group so you can click on which ones you want to enlarge? Or should I just keep posting these giant pics?

Here is what I came up with. I decided not to extend the front of the frame out any more because there is going to be some major re-fab needed in the rear. So the front wheels will back a little further then they were. I'm going to have to get the rear axle back further somehow to get that motor and a big sprocket to work. So I I'll extend the rear a lillte instead of the front.
Let me know if you think this looks alright. When I go to make my top shock brackets, how level should the spindle tie rod arm be compared to the bottom of the frame? Should it be level like in my next pic or angled down more to be more angled like the steering rod tie rod points? Which would just swing the J arms down further.

 

[OzFab]

http://www.diygokarts.com/vb/showthread.php?t=737

Hmm, you have a real dilemma on your hands. The first thing to do is work out your ride height; that will determine the height your stub axles sit.

Your next problem is you have rear facing steering arms on the spindles but your pitman arm (on the bottom of the steering column) faces up, it needs to face down otherwise your steering will be reversed. The problem with that is there's a pesky floor in the way. I see some major front end fab work in your not too distant future...

 

[bighead]

http://www.diygokarts.com/vb/showthread.php?t=737

Hmm, you have a real dilemma on your hands. The first thing to do is work out your ride height; that will determine the height your stub axles sit.

Your next problem is you have rear facing steering arms on the spindles but your pitman arm (on the bottom of the steering column) faces up, it needs to face down otherwise your steering will be reversed. The problem with that is there's a pesky floor in the way. I see some major front end fab work in your not too distant future...

Thats a complete ody front end. He has the steering wheel on the steering shaft on wrong. He can flip the pitman arm around for the wheel is splined.

He has every single part to a stock odyssey front suspension from wheels to wheel. I hoping it will easy install. Do you see any other problems. This is a first I seen ody front suspension on kart.

 

[bighead]

Not sure I understand your question. So I will post some pics of my Ody's

I can take some mesurements off my frames so you can locate the steering column in the right place. I can measure from my main bar to the bolt mounts on the column.

Once you have the column mounted in the right spot and pitman arm below the floor it should bolt right up. It has to. Just make sure you have it centered. and fix those tierods before you use them for mockup. They come stock with 4 threads showing on one side. And 6 threads showing on the other side. How ever you make the cross member for the steering column it needs to be solid. Lots of force at that point. Notice pics above on the red buggy on how he made his crossmember.

Watch for clearance on tierods to frame. With the stiff Ody shocks you should have no problems. With softer shocks you will. Ody's only have about 3" up travel in the front end.

As you can see in the first pic. The steering shaft is well below the floor. This is why I sent you that front skid pan. Also in the 1st pic the steering wheel is not on. So they shaft has slid down some. Keep that in mind. It can only go in one place though once the wheel is on.

Don't make it to long. Long karts look dumb IMO. Also you can grind some metal off the ody steering stops to get better turning radius. Just do not take off to much or the tierod ends will hit the wheels. Ody's have bad turning radius stock. first thing I do is grind the stops back some.

Also not a steering guy but I think you can mess around with ride height some with this frontend. When the j-amrs cycle they do not change camber angles or what ever you call it. You can spin them 360 around and the wheel will be straight and level. Only problem is shock and clearance for tierods. I could be wrong though. I would try to go just how honda had it using the honda shocks or shocks the same lenth. A little bit is not a whole lot though with out tierods mods and the angle the rods push. Again I stand to be corrected.

Make sure your shock angle is close to the original angle on the ody. I would think that would matter a lot.

If you put that skid pan on you can just mush and bash over stuff ody style.

 

[bighead]

You can play with ride height like my racer is set up. This way you can adjust at later dates for level ride height or what ever. My yellow cars crossmember is made just like the red buggy I posted on 1st page. Looks like some 1x3 ??? square tubing with the column mounted on the front side leeting it hang over the crossmember. That looks easy enough huh?

Also how my shocks are mounted on my blue car.

I can take better detailed pics of my yellow cars cross member if you like? Or any other measurments. Did those shocks have the bushings in them?

I think hanging that engine may not be that bad. Weld the bottom part into the rear part. Weld the top part to a cross bar behind the seat. Then clean all the stuff you do not need off. Going to have to fab whole rear section out of good steel.

PS I sent you extra set of spindle spacers. Only one per side. I sent you four. Don't let that fool you.

The ody's are close to 500lbs without rider and no fuel. You may be able to use lighter shock. The stock Ody shocks are super stiff as you can see.

 

[Timtreo]

Thanks again bighead for the great pics, I can see from your blue car the J arms should be angled down more then where I have it in my pic. Good to know they can swing as far or short whithout affecting the camber or whatever. That should make it easy for me because I think I might be able to just weld a top shock bracket right to my top frame bar with a support bar underneath to the bottom frame bar. There were no bushings or bolts with the shocks. And yeah I already thought about grinding some off the spindle stops to get better turning radius, thanks for confirming that. I did also figure out there were extra bearing bushings.
If you could get me a measurement from the back of the main J arm bar back to the point where the steering column goes through the cross member and a measument of the difference in height from the bottom of the main J arm bar to the top of the steering crossmember that would be great.

Yeah the bike frame might not be that bad. I just want to get the front done to figure out what the height is going to be up there and then start messing with the rear. Thanks again.

 

[OzFab]

Thats a complete ody front end. He has the steering wheel on the steering shaft on wrong. He can flip the pitman arm around for the wheel is splined.

I understand that, what I'm saying is he can't flip it without cutting a hole in the floor & having the steering below the floor.

I'm not criticising, just pointing out the obvious

 

[Timtreo]

Thanks fabroman, that was the plan.

 

[bighead]

Don't pay to much attension to the yellow and blue car. Those are wider J-arms than stock (aftermarket) I would follow the shock angle on the stoxk ody's.

I will get the measurements later.

 

[bighead]

I understand that, what I'm saying is he can't flip it without cutting a hole in the floor & having the steering below the floor.

I'm not criticising, just pointing out the obvious

He needs to make a crossmember to bolt the column to. Once he has the column mounted the shaft and pitman extend below the floor.

Also I bumped my head on how he can mount the engine? With a rear swing arm it's going to be really hard like you said. The whole engine and frame must be on swingarm. So welding to behind seat can't happen. What would you do?

 

[bighead]

Any mouting spots on your engine to make mounts like this?

 

[Timtreo]

Not really I guess I could make something like that, I bought the bike frame to use it though... Is that motor mounted on the front or rear of that thing, maybe he just doesn't have the one drive axle in if it's the rear.
Let me know when you get those measurements and I'll start working on the cross member today. Thanks

 

[bighead]

Not really I guess I could make something like that, I bought the bike frame to use it though... Is that motor mounted on the front or rear of that thing, maybe he just doesn't have the one drive axle in if it's the rear.
Let me know when you get those measurements and I'll start working on the cross member today. Thanks

I do not have any bare frames for I just cleaned my yard and scraped them. I do have my cars but they have that plastic tub in the way.

I am not sure how I am going to measure now. Maybe under the ody but that skid pan is in the way. I will got look at my blue buggy again though. BRB.