MIG or TIG?

[devino246]

This welding machine is just the basic line...

Also please mind that it is €1000 for a 10l filled gas bottle, and automatic darkening helmet en wire to weld. The machine alone costs about €750 but since I need all the other stuff, it's better to take the all in one formula.

PS. Could you give me any website where you can buy these $400 good welders perfect for home use?

$350 https://m.northerntool.com/northern...+Flux-Cored,+Model#+K2185-1&productName=false

$500 https://m.northerntool.com/northern...r+-+115+Volt,+Model#+500559&productName=false

$420 http://m.lowes.com/product?langId=-...0051&productId=1082349&store=0437&view=detail

Good SMAW welders are even cheaper.

 

[Nodroz]

If I were to buy one from the US, it would need to be 220V, 50Hz. How many Hz does a normal net in the US have? I asume it was around 60?

 

[fourtogo]

Gas Tig Mig Stick . They all have a purpose, I have a lincoln Ideal Arc 300. It's big it's old runs on 220 and 60amp breaker. A Tig machine will let you do more Steel/ Stainless Steel / Alum / TI / Brass / Cast Alum. As with all welding practice practice well help make good welder.

 

[Nodroz]

Alright, so,
After a LOT of debating and considering various welding machines I'm still not totally sure about it yet.

My parents and others told me not to buy the expensive €1000 welder from Contimac because I won't be using the welder enough. It'll just be used in my hobby, and to spend €1000 is a bit overkill.

Meanwhile, I found something else, the Cebora EVO 160. The only disadvantage I can think of is that you cannot disconnect the torch cable. Is this really a necessity? It's also 3m long, I assume this would be plenty for my puposes.

It costs €650 including a 10L gas bottle and some basic tools to get your started (like wire and anti-splatter spray, etc...). I'll just need to get a helmet, wich costs €79.

I've read a lot of reviews about this machine and it seems to be perfect for my pupose. What do guys think about it?

Btw, a friend from my parents, who owns a TIG welder is passing by next week to show me a small demo of what TIG can do. I'll be able to try it out aswell. Just to experience how TIG welds... I don't think I'm going to buy one since it's even more expensive...

 

[falcon52]

I would personally suggest mig. I can tig and mig and mig is easier, consumables are cheaper, and way easier to weld when things are anything less than a perfect fit. Tig welding looks really nice, but you almost have to have a tubing notcher to make a perfect fit. Otherwise, you won't be able to weld any kid of gap with the tig. Unless you plan on welding a lt of aluminum or weird metals, the mig would be fine.

 

[Nodroz]

I would personally suggest mig. I can tig and mig and mig is easier, consumables are cheaper, and way easier to weld when things are anything less than a perfect fit. Tig welding looks really nice, but you almost have to have a tubing notcher to make a perfect fit. Otherwise, you won't be able to weld any kid of gap with the tig. Unless you plan on welding a lt of aluminum or weird metals, the mig would be fine.

Ok, thanks.

How about the cable for the MIG? Is it important that you can disconnect it? The welder I'm looking at right now has a solid cable. Would it cause and problems?

 

[Doc Sprocket]

I'm not sure I understand. If it were to fail, you have to be able to replace it!

That said, do not confuse this with the fact that on a wirefeed welder (MIG) the cable normally stays attached to the unit at all times, and it only meant to be removed if it being replaced.

 

[falcon52]

Are you talking about the cable for the plug 110/220 plug in?

 

[DaiSan76]

Are you talking about the cable for the plug 110/220 plug in?

He is probably talking about a multi-process welder.

 

[Doc Sprocket]

Y'all missed this-

The only disadvantage I can think of is that you cannot disconnect the torch cable. Is this really a necessity?

This is not like a stick welder where you just attach the cables when you're going to weld, or add on when they are not long enough. 3M is about standard. Mine is 10 feet, which works out to about 3M.

 

[OzFab]

I think I know what you're on about; a machine that gives you tha ability to detatch the whole torch assembly with the twist of a knob. Believe me, it can actually make things more difficult; if it's not lined up perfectly, nothing will work.

 

[Doc Sprocket]

Sure... But with a spool of wire in the machine, and 10 feet of it running up the liner to the gun, why would you even want to detach it? Dunno about you, but I'm not willing to lose 10' of wire every time... As it is I get annoyed that when my spool runs out, the last 10' are waste...

 

[mckutzy]

I think they mean if one was wanting to install a spool gun for aluminum, or just a different(tweco miller euro lincon style)/longer gun assembly, you could not, its most likely a proprietary model to that machines company.
And here in N,America is 60Hz, and is important for these types of machines, it will destroy the transformer quickly if not right away.

 

[Nodroz]

Alright. This machine is going to be imported from the Netherlands. It's 2 hours away from me, but if the shippinh costs are okay, I'll let it deliver here. I'll call them tomorrow to get more information about the shipping.
Also, in case my parents agree, I might have a visit in that shop. They say that you can weld with every machine they sell before you buy it. So you can try it several machines before buying!

Thanks for the replies! I really appriciate it!
I'll keep you updated!

Btw, Toystory and Fabroman were right. I was talking about the whole torch assembly cable.

 

[Doc Sprocket]

Hey- you're welcome. I think it's cool that they let you have a go at a demo model before purchasing. Good customer service. All the good welding shops let you do that, but- model for model, they tend to be more expensive. Call it added value, I guess. Either way, let us know how it goes!

 

[Nodroz]

Hmm, just checked out the specifications of that Cebora welding machine.
Everything looks good, except for the duty cycle.

120A -- 20%
70A -- 60%
55A -- 100%

I can imagine, that when I'm welding like 3mm or even 6mm (the maximum) with this machine, I can only weld at 140A like 1 minute, out of 10 minutes?
I can imagine that when I weld at full power, 160A, the machine will go in safety mode every 30 seconds?

Am I seeing this right?

 

[devino246]

Hmm, just checked out the specifications of that Cebora welding machine.
Everything looks good, except for the duty cycle.

120A -- 20%
70A -- 60%
55A -- 100%

I can imagine, that when I'm welding like 3mm or even 6mm (the maximum) with this machine, I can only weld at 140A like 1 minute, out of 10 minutes?
I can imagine that when I weld at full power, 160A, the machine will go in safety mode every 30 seconds?

Am I seeing this right?

Duty cycle is generally a VERY conservative estimate.

 

[fowler]

I think they mean if one was wanting to install a spool gun for aluminum.

where did this come from? iv seen it in a few places
what type of ally do u guys weld that requires a spool gun?

we used to fit a teflon lineing and straight argon gas then u are good to go

the duty cycle is important to keep in mind but exeding by a little isnt the end of the world

and think in a gokart hobby when will u be welding 3mm for a long period of time
maybe a few time though the entire build

 

[Nodroz]

You're right Fowler. Thanks.

I went to another shop today, once again! Yeap, another one! AGAIN!

Anyhow, so they offered me this welding machine:
http://www.weco.it/files/download/CATALOGHI/INGLESE/(19) DISCOVERY 161MF ENG.pdf

It welds MIG, TIG and works with electrodes, all this for quite a smooth price of €1300!
The MIG torch with 3M cable and the TIG gun with 4M cable is included in this price. I just have to get a automatic darkening helmet en a bottle of gas. In total, I guess the price will be around €1500. I know this is a lot, but I can weld everything. I can even use my old electrodes I'm using right now with my old welder.

Although, I read something about the TIG, that you have to scratch it each time to get the spark. Just wondering, is the TIG on this machine good enough? The guy said you can't weld ALU with the TIG? Also, why would you need a TIG if you have a MIG that can do everything?

When I told my brother about the Cebora MIG machine, he asked if I could ask INOX and ALU, I said I could, if I change the machine and get some ALU wire. I don't know about inox though. I told him that's it's quite a bit of work to get the machine set up for ALU, whilst you can easily change from Steel to ALU with TIG just by changing the settings and getting a new rod. That's true, right?

My brother then convinced me to look out for a TIG machine, so I could easily weld ALU and Inox aswell. He wants me to make a table out of inox or alu for him, as he's going to help me paying the machine.

What do you guys think about it? Sorry for the many change of plans and stuff. I just really don't know what to do yet...
I'm still looking at that cheaper MIG welder though... pfft I don't know what to do.

 

[Nodroz]

Wait... I just got in contact with somebody else. He told me that a normal TIG won't be able to weld alu. You'll need one with AC/DC current, which is very expensive. Please disregard this in my post above... Sorry.

But I do have a question,
I was wondering if the TIG of that multi-functional machine is the same TIG as a normal one? I heard the guy saying that you first had to scratch the metal and then you'll get your spark. But, if you scratch your metal, you're damaging your tip?

Regards,
Nodroz