MIG or TIG?

[devino246]

If I could buy bottles for 60 bucks I'd buy a hundred of them and sell them for twice as much in my area.

Same here, just to fill my short bottle is 35 bucks

The little 20 cu/ft bottles? Were $60 at Harbor Freight. Looks like they're up to $85 now. AirGas is closer to $70, last time I checked.

 

[Mango Matto]

I thought you were talking about the big bottles. I think ours are like 250 cubic feet...

 

[Nodroz]

Hey man, i fab and weld alot of stuff for a living. Mig with the gas setup is the fastest and easiest to learn, get yourself a good lincoln, miller or hobart 200 amp welder. Well worth the money and will more than likely be all you need for any welding jobs. Tig is great also but more expensive and alot more learning to do to get good with it. i use my 205 amp gas mig welder all the time and i weld everything i need to with it. Good luck

Thanks for your reply. Looks like almost everybody suggest to weld MIG to me. I forgot TIG and I'm looking only at MIG machines right now.

That's very true, I agree entirely but, Alex, do you plan on using it every day for the next 15 years? I was only trying to save you some money by suggesting a cheaper machine.

I only paid around $300 including shipping for my 130A chinese welder about 3 years ago. The only problem I've had with it was the gears in the feed motor stripped coz my mate put too much pressure on it & you've seen the things I've done with it.

At the end of the day, it's your choice which depends on what you want it to do & how much you're willing to spend on it. We can only offer our opinions...

Man, you're right. Why would I buy such a professional machine if I am not entirely sure how long I will use it. I won't use it everyday for 15 years.

I am looking for some cheaper models now. Thanks.

 

[Jonester 123]

Thanks for your reply. Looks like almost everybody suggest to weld MIG to me. I forgot TIG and I'm looking only at MIG machines right now.

Check out www.eastwood.com website, they have some great prices for mig welders. Good luck Around five hundred dollars will get you a nice entry level mig welder with gas hookup.

Man, you're right. Why would I buy such a professional machine if I am not entirely sure how long I will use it. I won't use it everyday for 15 years.

I am looking for some cheaper models now. Thanks.

As the old saying goes, you get what you pay for. There is a reason why good welders cost around four hundred dollars and higher for good quality machines

 

[Nodroz]

I've checked out the website to know how many it would costs to ship to Belgium. I hope to get a reply soon!

(http://www.eastwood.com/mig-welders-175-amp-mig-welder-w-spool-gun.html)
Thanks for your replies and ideas so far. Tomorrow I am going to a smaller shop. He says he h as great prices and great machines for me, that would be perfect to use in my hobby.

For the moment, I am still looking for some good welders wich will be sufficient enough to finish my gokart and maybe later some other small jobs.

 

[Nodroz]

Ok,

I went to the local shop. Since I know the dude very well, he rent me one of his DC Stick welders to see the difference with what I have right now.

This modern stick welder does indeed a much better job than my old stick welder. The electrode doesn't stick to the iron that much and the welder itself it REALLY lightweight. Just amazing...

However, I still need to remove the slack off the weld and welding gaps is still really hard to do.
You can get a REALLY decent stick welder for just below €400. Yet, I decided not to take such one for now. I would like clean, and fast welds, which can be done by the MIG welding technique.

I'll go to another shop aswell, this weekend. I would love to check out some other brands aswell. Keep you updated!

 

[machinist@large]

Ok,

I went to the local shop. Since I know the dude very well, he rent me one of his DC Stick welders to see the difference with what I have right now.

This modern stick welder does indeed a much better job than my old stick welder. The electrode doesn't stick to the iron that much and the welder itself it REALLY lightweight. Just amazing...

However, I still need to remove the slack off the weld and welding gaps is still really hard to do.
You can get a REALLY decent stick welder for just below €400. Yet, I decided not to take such one for now. I would like clean, and fast welds, which can be done by the MIG welding technique.

I'll go to another shop aswell, this weekend. I would love to check out some other brands aswell. Keep you updated!

For most go kart work, a small mig welder should be more than adequate; that being said, if you know how to stick weld, I'd say keep a new stick machine in the back of your mind for a future purchase/ upgrade. With the proper electrodes and a matching power source you can cover a whole lot of ground that a comparably priced mig will choke on, or not be able to touch at all.

I hope you can find something that will satisfy you over there; here in the States, I could have you test drive a good handful of machines in just a couple of hours, all in your 400 Euro price range. I guess we're spoiled over here; when I saw the prices on the web site you linked for us, I had to do a double take; (they want how much for THAT?!?!)

I wish you good luck on the hunt; please keep us in the loop on how it goes!!!!!

 

[Nodroz]

Thanks for the reply, machinist@large, it's really helpful to me! The weekend is close and I'm going to look out for some other shops and gain some more information and prices.

Meanwhile, I found this on the web: http://www.openbare-verkopen.be/kavel/half-automaat-cerdi

Looks quite big, I know, but the price is really nice.
If the price stays so low, why shouldn't I buy it? It's a really profesional welder and that for half the price I need to pay for half the power.

Will I be able to run a water cooled welder without the cooling?

 

[machinist@large]

Thanks for the reply, machinist@large, it's really helpful to me! The weekend is close and I'm going to look out for some other shops and gain some more information and prices.

Meanwhile, I found this on the web: http://www.openbare-verkopen.be/kavel/half-automaat-cerdi

Looks quite big, I know, but the price is really nice.
If the price stays so low, why shouldn't I buy it? It's a really profesional welder and that for half the price I need to pay for half the power.

Will I be able to run a water cooled welder without the cooling?

It has a tank on the back; that's fairly typical for a self contained unit, but I would double check it to be sure. The ad doesn't give me enough information to be positively certain. If the cooling system is self contained, then you would be alright on that count; my next question is does it need single phase or 3 phase for the electrical supply.

Over here in the States, if you get much over 250~300 amps output voltage, they require 3 phase to run; single phase won't work. Again, the sales posting doesn't seem to list power requirements, so I just don't know. If you intend to get it, please make sure you have the required power supply at the location you intend to use it in.

 

[crazyman]

If you can afford it, both MIG and TIG.

 

[Nodroz]

Thanks once again, machinist@large! I've learned quite a bit again.

I get 3 phase in my house, but I don't have any sockets for 3phase...

Daily, I'm crawling the internet for 2nd hand welding machines and other useful stuff. Today I found some good stuff!

http://www.2dehands.be/bouw/gereeds...fautomaat-cebora-190a-138527568.html?bewaar=1

190A, 3 phase and from Cebora. I've searched about that brand and it looks pretty good. The only problem is that I'll need installed a whole 3 phase system to my garage and make a socket there. Would this be expensive to do? Can't I just run the 3phase welder on single phase. The only problem that could raise is that I won't be able to weld in higher amps ranges. Or will there be other problems?

EDIT: Nevermind the text above. I just asked my dad and apperently we get three phase in the garage already! We just need to get a socket a short cable to run from the socket to the divider (that how you call it?)

Although, I would like to know answer out of curisity if you could run a 3phase welder on a monophase?

@Crazyman, I can't afford it, unfortunately.

 

[machinist@large]

Thanks once again, machinist@large! I've learned quite a bit again.

I get 3 phase in my house, but I don't have any sockets for 3phase...

Daily, I'm crawling the internet for 2nd hand welding machines and other useful stuff. Today I found some good stuff!

http://www.2dehands.be/bouw/gereeds...fautomaat-cebora-190a-138527568.html?bewaar=1

190A, 3 phase and from Cebora. I've searched about that brand and it looks pretty good. The only problem is that I'll need installed a whole 3 phase system to my garage and make a socket there. Would this be expensive to do? Can't I just run the 3phase welder on single phase. The only problem that could raise is that I won't be able to weld in higher amps ranges. Or will there be other problems?

EDIT: Nevermind the text above. I just asked my dad and apperently we get three phase in the garage already! We just need to get a socket a short cable to run from the socket to the divider (that how you call it?)

Although, I would like to know answer out of curisity if you could run a 3phase welder on a monophase?

@Crazyman, I can't afford it, unfortunately.

If you already have 3 phase power available, then you're almost home, so to speak!!!

As for your last question, there are ways to generate 3 phase power using a single phase source, but they are not cheap; especially for a welding application. Lets face it; welding is a power hog compared to most other application for electrical power.

As for the welder itself, maybe some machines can be converted; it would all come down to how the actual unit was designed and built. At the very least, it would be a case by case question, not a general rule.

Hope this helps!!

 

[DaiSan76]

TIG is a wonderful process for building parts. It doesn't work that great once the project is all together and you are adding in all the bits and pieces. Especially my machine that has a foot pedal, working underneath the kart adding bracing yesterday was a heck of a mission.

 

[machinist@large]

TIG is a wonderful process for building parts. It doesn't work that great once the project is all together and you are adding in all the bits and pieces. Especially my machine that has a foot pedal, working underneath the kart adding bracing yesterday was a heck of a mission.

I've got all three types of welder; bought at different times for different projects over the last 25 years. The only 2 that I bought new were the Miller 225 ac Thunderbolt buzz box and the Lincoln 135 mig welder (120 volt). I also have a used Miller Dial Arc 250 AC/DC stick machine that's the heavy artillery for stick work on farm equipment, and a Hobart stick/ tig machine that predates Miller buying Hobart by at least 15 years.

Not one of them can do everything; and totaling up the purchase prices for them all, I'm still ahead compared to any of the "ALL IN ONE" machines I've looked at over the years.....

 

[soggycrashed]

If you want the best weld, I would use a stick welder. Otherwise, go with the MIG. I've noticed they're cheaper, and remember, a cleaner weld doesn't mean a stronger weld!

 

[Nodroz]

Thanks once again.

I'm back from a local shop who is handling in welders. They have quite a big assortiment! Anyhow, the cheapest welder they have is a 160A MIG welder, for €900! (Without auto darkening helmet and gas bottles but with the nanometer, 15kg of wire, torch, etc).
(link: http://www.vdwlastechniek.be/content/160tla-250tla)

If I have to buy the helmet and various other stuff, I'll be totally grounded.
For now, the best deal for a new welder is the one for €1000, including everything. (Helmet, gas bottles, everything you need to get started right away.)

I'm still looking at 2nd hand welder, but I don't quite thrust to buy a used one. You never know how soon it will brake and how expensive these parts can be. Also, where to repair? That's a bit my problem with used welders...

The shopkeeper also said me that if I buy a cheap welder, and when I stop welding after 2 years from now, I won't be able to sell that welder for much either, since people know it'll brake soon and that it's hard to get parts.
When I buy that welder from Contimac for €1000 all inclusive, I will be able to sell it for much more since that's a well known Belgian brand...

Still thinking... I have time, I've got exams this week and next week. After this, I'll be looking into this realle closely since Christmas is approaching very fast

 

[soggycrashed]

Darn, we have $400 MIG welders in America. They're not as good quality and are a bit harder to learn to weld on, but worth the $600 savings.

 

[Nodroz]

Darn, we have $400 MIG welders in America. They're not as good quality and are a bit harder to learn to weld on, but worth the $600 savings.

€1000 is $1309.., please mind that it is €1000 exlucuding taxes.

People who buy this without a company will have to pay around €1200 which is close to $1600.

Luckily I can get rid of the taxes as my brother will buy the machine with his company.

Btw, I've updated the post above with a link to the welding machine of €900.
The €1000 all inclusive welding machine is located here:
http://www.contimac.be/nl/product/4122321967358/mig-mag/mig-mag/mig-mag-171-basicline

 

[devino246]

Darn, we have $400 MIG welders in America. They're not as good quality and are a bit harder to learn to weld on, but worth the $600 savings.

$400 can buy a more than capable brand name machine that'll weld smooth as can be and last forever in a home setting. Anything much more expensive is getting into the professional realm and is overkill for most hobbyists.

 

[Nodroz]

$400 can buy a more than capable brand name machine that'll weld smooth as can be and last forever in a home setting. Anything much more expensive is getting into the professional realm and is overkill for most hobbyists.

This welding machine is just the basic line...

Also please mind that it is €1000 for a 10l filled gas bottle, and automatic darkening helmet en wire to weld. The machine alone costs about €750 but since I need all the other stuff, it's better to take the all in one formula.

PS. Could you give me any website where you can buy these $400 good welders perfect for home use?