Konykart - building kit of go-kart

[Konykart]

If I may keep this simple...... IF you build something in the style of this kart........"THEY WILL COME"....... Sorry but tradition usually wins out and THIS style cart is strong and could cost you a 1/4 of what you have there. Yes, coming up with original stuff is often fun,but, often wadded up and tossed into the trash can below the engineering/drafting desk, in favor of simplicity and tradition!!! Let's hit the trails boys!!!! Oh wait, I need to remove a stupid OIL SENSOR today.....

BTW, I did like that LIFAN motorcycle/scooter motor on your prototype, sounded cool!! IDEAS are a good thing and people should listen closely. Without an engine and tires, my Kart probably weighs 50 lbs.! NOW? Maybe 150 lbs. WE must keep them light so they can do their thing and be fun!! I repaired a friend's go kart and it was heavy as a tank, it's was more like a big heavy turtle and now sits deep in the junk yard.

Even if you just build a sweet go-kart frame minus the wheels and engine, it could sell like hots cakes if the style dictates it's self as awesomeness............ BTW, I'm off to look for a new go kart frame to customize again..... Isn't boredom great!!!!!! NO OFFENSE, but ERECTOR SETS died out in the mid 70's. BUT, then again I don't think you are building or engineering for folks in America. I"M GLAD those are ONLY bolted together prototypes and if I could afford only one I would, just to keep in a display case!!! BTW, this kart? 17 bolts!!

BOLTS>>

(2) holding front spindles
(3) holding steering wheel
(4)rear axle bearing holders both sides
(4) holding the seat
(4) holding engine and jackshaft plate

You're Welcome, Scott

Whats the price for it? How many sets did you make? Only one for you? It looks nice. But i do not think too small price. How you can shipp it to europe? I think it is not real to have it here. But nice.

 

[itsid]

Yes sure. It is better.
My preliminary prototype Vision Konykart V4 is here.
But here I am thinking about electric motor 5 kw. New generation. But the price will be too big. About 3000 dollars. It is not good for me. I want easy kart kit. Max 1000 dollars.
But I do not have plan to make this vision V4. Better is Renault mini electric car.
https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=733742773500479&id=669602993247791

And again I have to disagree with you

THAT kart is really nice IMHO.
I like the design (not so much the colours or that silly car seat but the rest is indeed nice)
That is something that'd be perfect to lasercut and square up on the sheet metal brake
in two parts (upper and lower frame individually welded )
a package just as big as the upper frame to hold all the parts (incl wheels)
then maybe even bolt the two parts together.

And while the electric motor drives the costs up for sure, the actual frame itself would be cheaper than the one you got, especially if you design and layout your cuts correctly
(so that cutouts of the larger frame make parts for the lower one to save as much material as possible)

And while there's still a lot to fix in that design it's a nice starting point.. MUCH MUCH nicer IMHO than the v3.
reminds me of a gremlin...

'sid

PS Konykart and green... you're really trying to get into trouble with that name and now color similarity, don't you?

 

[mckutzy]

Everybody prefer welding. Ok i am thinking about partly welded. See Konykart - V2 there is and it is very good for stable. Big welded frame is not as nice for people from small house. But this solution you can get under bed for example in kid room in flat not in house.
In usa is too much place but not in europe. Here do not have everybody garage..

You write something about sell better.. - low price or better welded design? What do you mean? 1000 dollars are much for you?

For us Canadians, we would have to pay +30%, then the same for shipping on your USD price, +duties and taxes...

There was a kart kit shown here a little while ago, I think it was KartFab with GPS(I'm guessing it was them folks), they had it as a weld together and partly completed kits, similar price, but it worked out to just under $1500 CAD without a motor... Obviously Canada might not be you target market, but the shipping to NAmerica is still steep...

 

[Konykart]

And again I have to disagree with you

THAT kart is really nice IMHO.
I like the design (not so much the colours or that silly car seat but the rest is indeed nice)
That is something that'd be perfect to lasercut and square up on the sheet metal brake
in two parts (upper and lower frame individually welded )
a package just as big as the upper frame to hold all the parts (incl wheels)
then maybe even bolt the two parts together.

And while the electric motor drives the costs up for sure, the actual frame itself would be cheaper than the one you got, especially if you design and layout your cuts correctly
(so that cutouts of the larger frame make parts for the lower one to save as much material as possible)

And while there's still a lot to fix in that design it's a nice starting point.. MUCH MUCH nicer IMHO than the v3.
reminds me of a gremlin...

'sid

PS Konykart and green... you're really trying to get into trouble with that name and now color similarity, don't you?

Why do you think trouble with the name? I do not understand. do you know simular or same name? i have never see this name.
Thanks

 

[itsid]

Why do you think trouble with the name? I do not understand. do you know simular or same name? i have never see this name.
Thanks

So you're saying Tony kart doesn't ring a bell...
never heard that name before...
never seen tonykart.com as a website suggestion when you first checked your google page rank three years ago...?
aha.. well kinda proves my point in a way.

Anyways.. to get you up to speed:
Tony kart is one of the more important names in kart racing.
whenever you see a green race kart.. it's more than likely a Tony kart!
Whenever you have a kart part (no matter what part) chances are it's OTK labelled and manufactured by Tony

One letter off.... just saying...

'sid

 

[itsid]

CTD is Canadian tire dollar.. Canadian tire dollar is the unofficial business currency of Canada

Don't get confused by this Tomas;
he's trying to make fun of you.

Just ignore this crap, don't worry you will not miss any usefull info if you do

'sid

PS he's now gone for a while

 

[Konykart]

So you're saying Tony kart doesn't ring a bell...
never heard that name before...
never seen tonykart.com as a website suggestion when you first checked your google page rank three years ago...?
aha.. well kinda proves my point in a way.

Anyways.. to get you up to speed:
Tony kart is one of the more important names in kart racing.
whenever you see a green race kart.. it's more than likely a Tony kart!
Whenever you have a kart part (no matter what part) chances are it's OTK labelled and manufactured by Tony

One letter off.... just saying...

'sid

Yes sure. Tony Kart I know. but this is karting racing connected with green color.
My name is little different but I do not want to have simular name. It is from my surname. My idea is Yard Kart and no karting racing as Tony. I hope it will be ok. if not i will have to speak with Tony about my name. Now the name is only Hobby name. But when I will want to sell it, I will have to have company with name. Maybe I will change the name. But now nobody told me about problem with this name. I have my own domain. it was free. But i did not check patents of names. In the czech republic is possible to have this name company. Maybe. i will see in the future. If I will release V3 kart. Now I do not know. :-(
I think you dislike me. You are seeking mistakes on me.

---------- Post added at 07:39 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:35 PM ----------

Don't get confused by this Tomas;
he's trying to make fun of you.

Just ignore this crap, don't worry you will not miss any usefull info if you do

'sid

I see. Here is writing lot of joke men. I am only discussion about it. No problem. I am only discussion about price, idea etc. If I will give it to somebody, must be officialy and legaly payed befor shipping I am not badman. I have my aim. But I like your regulary opinion.

 

[itsid]

I see. Here is writing lot of joke men. I am only discussion about it. No problem. I am only discussion about price, idea etc. If I will give it to somebody, must be officialy and legaly payed befor shipping I am not badman. I have my aim. But I like your regulary opinion.

Yepp, I gave him a time out and removed that annyoing part of the conversation already.

As much as I dislike the v3 kart you are offering on your website,
as much you deserve to be treated with respect and decency around here.

You are trying to earn an honest living,
and we are trying to point out our concerns for you to maybe improve your product,
or at least know the troubles you may be facing when you actually sell some kits.

THAT'S what this topic is about.. and it's surely not to make fun of the new user from half way across the globe.
(for them.. I'm much closer )

Again, my comments are harshly worded for sure,
but I want you to know that it's against the kart, not you!

You said you're friends with Josef.. ask him about the number of bolts.

He cut the partscount for the original Mendel (almost) in half back in the days... by improving stability and accuracy as well as printsize.

When it comes to efficiency, he's surely the goto guy!

I bet he has some ideas what you can do to improve your kart.
I have no idea if he knows anything about karts I admit,
but some general ideas about what you can improve he'll surely have.
So if he's indeed your friend.. BRAVO.. he will be a great help!

'sid

 

[Konykart]

Yepp, I gave him a time out and removed that annyoing part of the conversation already.

As much as I dislike the v3 kart you are offering on your website,
as much you deserve to be treated with respect and decency around here.

You are trying to earn an honest living,
and we are trying to point out our concerns for you to maybe improve your product,
or at least know the troubles you may be facing when you actually sell some kits.

THAT'S what this topic is about.. and it's surely not to make fun of the new user from half way across the globe.
(for them.. I'm much closer )

Again, my comments are harshly worded for sure,
but I want you to know that it's against the kart, not you!

You said you're friends with Josef.. ask him about the number of bolts.

He cut the partscount for the original Mendel (almost) in half back in the days... by improving stability and accuracy as well as printsize.

When it comes to efficiency, he's surely the goto guy!

I bet he has some ideas what you can do to improve your kart.
I have no idea if he knows anything about karts I admit,
but some general ideas about what you can improve he'll surely have.
So if he's indeed your friend.. BRAVO.. he will be a great help!

'sid

,,friend,, he is in contact but not big friend. But he is open to discussion about DIY everything on some real actions.
I am checking developing of his product.

You disliked my V3 kart :-( I see.
But for example 3D printers - You can buy completly professionly 3D printer or 3D printer kit. Some people buy kit and some people final product. it depands on people. My way is first as kit. I am not big with my product but I am only playing with this as child. Lot of people like playing. I know your opinion. Welding of frame maybe will be.

 

[Konykart]

What is your opinion on Konykart V2? This is final product as prototype - no for sell.
Do you like it? How much money should you pay for it if it be for sell? Only for my information.
https://www.konykart.com/v2
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pT1KmlxKcs4

 

[Konykart]

,,friend,, he is in contact but not big friend. But he is open to discussion about DIY everything on some real actions.
I am checking developing of his product.

You disliked my V3 kart :-( I see.
But for example 3D printers - You can buy completly professionly 3D printer or 3D printer kit. Some people buy kit and some people final product. it depands on people. My way is first as kit. I am not big with my product but I am only playing with this as child. Lot of people like playing. I know your opinion. Welding of frame maybe will be.

Here are all 3D printed parts. Only helping parts.

 

[itsid]

,,friend,, he is in contact but not big friend. But he is open to discussion about DIY everything on some real actions.
I am checking developing of his product.

You disliked my V3 kart :-( I see.
But for example 3D printers - You can buy completly professionly 3D printer or 3D printer kit. Some people buy kit and some people final product. it depands on people. My way is first as kit. I am not big with my product but I am only playing with this as child. Lot of people like playing. I know your opinion. Welding of frame maybe will be.

Well.. I have a handfull of 3d printers myself.. 2 I made on my own,
2 are of Josef's design (the original Prusa Mendel and a chinese off brand prusa i3)
and the original RepRap Darwin which is more or less just a non functional relic by now. (big a a fridge)

So kits.. I'm familiar with them, 3d printer kits even more than most I'd say

And I agree a good kit is a nice thing.
I'm not against making a kit kart at all.
I'm against adding 12500 bolts when all you need is maybe 50.
I'm against using a bracket and four bolts when the same can be achieved with two 4cm long weld beads which are much more reliable and user friendly in the end.

I don't know how many bolts you have in v3 exactly.. but far too many for sure,
you ship them with the kit?
you need to buy them (wholesale of course.. but still they're rather expensive I assume)
Or you let the customer buy them on their own (which will raise the building costs by at least 200 € per kart for the customer.)

let's stick with the 3d printers since you started that..
Allow me to tell you about the history of 3d printers as I witnessed it:
########
My original Darwin had
60+ printed parts and several hundred nuts and bolts
it was a real pain to assemble big and heavy it's printing quality was *MEH* and all in all apart from some enthusiast like myself.. not many have been in use.

then came the Mendel iteration..
much smaller footprint, much fewer parts by same printsize and
finally rerap slowly took off.

Then Josef came along, took the Mendel removed some more printed parts and a good number of nuts and bolts.
redesigned most for easier assembly and/or shorter print time etc.
and finally printer assembly was doable within less than two hours (Darwin took 8 plus 3 for initial setup)

He made it possible for even untrained "users" to just buy a kit off ebay or so and build, setup and start printing in less than a day of work.
THAT made it fun for almost everyone.

And that was key.. as little partcount as possible (also to decrease printtime.. since back then printing a whole set took days!)
as easy assembly as possible (installing & adjusting the tension of the Z-belt on Darwin alone took an hour easily!)

Few parts.. good parts.. ease of assembly!

That's why Josef is kind of the HERO of the RepRap project (apart from Adrian and nophead and so on of course... different story!)
But without Josefs improvements it wouldn't be possible for me to buy a kit for a friend (as his first printer) and just let him assemble it on his own without worries.

#### 3d printer history over

And the same will hold true for your kart;
that one needs an enthusiast to assemble, someone that's willing to plow through tons of nuts and bolts and washers.

A dad that wants a nice sturdy kart for his kid, sees it and turns around and buys a cheaper assembled kart from china.
just because that not only is visually less appealing (really that car seat is UGLY a certain "NONO" on a go kart!)

it's also intimidating by just the number of bolts.

There is one kart (not exactly a kit.. but can be seen as one)
a georgeous beautiful racing kart...
very simple design four tubes and just a handfull of custom (welded!) parts..
the rest: nuts and bolts!

Black Hawks poison arrow:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=56t1EsLTxeY

THAT is great engineering, good design and would make an ideal kit kart.

replicate something like that and you will have troubles fullfilling the orders.
here's it's complete chassis parts:

(sorry it's small ... the only disassembled pic I got I'm afraid)
and yes, it fits in a very small box

yours.. well... I doubt you manage to sell ten kits in total.

So yeah, I know which one Josef would prefere
And me.. I'd love to lay my hands on a blackhawk poison arrow *drool*

'sid

 

[Konykart]

yes, I agree with you. I have plan to do easy kit. But I do not have too much bolts - only about 300 PCS. I will do some welded parts and then screw it. You are speaking about new generation of V3 kart. Now I have to make current V3 with bolts and calculate final price for me. Then I will see. But Each change and each welding and TIME for engineering design will make higher price for me. It is development to future. I have to introduce current final product. Then I will use time for revision etc.
If you understand me. each welding jig and each comlicated solution is more expansive to me NOW for prototype. If we will speak about serias and about more sets and kits - I can change it. I have to finish project. One way is to sell current V3 and secound way is finish everything and totaly finish my start-up project. I spend a lot of working hours and lots money from me

 

[mckutzy]

Jigs can be made out wood, for the initial start.. But for the type of fixtures could be made out of scrap... A little thinking... It can be easy...

 

[sefishy]

you should really consider moving the axle to on top the frame. lowering your center of gravity and swapping to a lower seat would really help this kart be a bit less prone to roll overs. Even if you dont like the new lower seat yourself you have to think of the masses when selling the kit.

On another note can you figure out a single speed or automatic setup? removing two peddles and linkages for those who arnt interested can also save you a bit of money

 

[Kansaskart]

Yeah it would take me about 7654 beers to put that together. However, i do think the final product looks kinda neat and I like the big seat. Also, Id assume other parts of the world probably dont have access or the prices, not to mention the same ideas or experiences.

As far as 3d printers still wanting one. To me building one is a waste of time as it would be like building a metal lathe. Its what youre gonna do with it afterwards that counts I think its a fad that will go away. I dont know any machinist, except Dave Gingery, that built his own lathe lol.Just imo.

Of course, I did start down the lathe path years ago. At least I still got the charcoal furnace. Im good too, my lathe looks just like a grizzly 12x36 lol.

 

[Kansaskart]

That arrow kart is NICE. I miss my macs, my dart with twin mc101AA's and a model j dart with a 91b. Yeah you dont know the meaning of fun trying to push start a twin engine direct drive kart. I cant imagine todays crowd trying that lol.

 

[KingCobra]

Wow! Those are all great ideas!!