Do I really need this ugly "roll hoop"?

[BigWes]

I disagree with you on point number 7. Karts are not hard to flip. That is the biggest load of crap I have ever read. Actually the first one I ever flipped was a one wheel peel...the ****ed thing broke the throttle linkage or hung up or something, was years ago, I just remember it rolled over and slung me off...I was laying on the ground laughing when it looped back around and ran over me...I still thought it was funny even though it hurt...but anyway...

I'm not trying to effect your decision one way or another. Karts flip plenty easy enough.

 

[Dingocat]

Flipped mine twice, first time was from going around a cul de sac too fast, lukily landed on the grass in the middle and the second was from doing 180's on pavement. Fun, until I did that, then proceded to race my other kart while mine smoked the whole way.

---------- Post added at 09:30 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:29 PM ----------

Also got it up on two wheels, going around the yard, normal lap, idek why

 

[andrecht]

https://youtu.be/cexuUg5KXLY

 

[Hellion]

Hey now, the idea of the cage-over-engine was mentioned in order for you to sorta cut it down a bit, make it semi-cool and please your dad's safety concerns. Because otherwise, it sounds like you're stuck with it.

...I was laying on the ground laughing when it looped back around and ran over me...I still thought it was funny even though it hurt...but anyway...

That's a great story--kart had its revenge on you.
Reminds me of the tragic story of the USS Tang getting sunk by its own torpedo in WWII. They fired their last torp but it broached and curved into a circular run and then struck the side of the hull. KA-BOOM!

 

[JTSpeedDemon]

Ok, so karts can be flipped, I get it.
But wouldn't the hoop with a tank full of gas on it just raise the center of gravity anyway?
'Cause it's a sizeable tank, about a gallon or two.

 

[J.S.@SMS]

If you're worried about the center of gravity get an aftermarket tank, mount it between your legs (under the steering shaft), and use a pulse pump.

I'd do that, chop off the top pf the original hoop, and weld on a round hoop.

 

[JTSpeedDemon]

Eventually (if I remove the hoop) I plan to get a different gas tank and relocate it, maybe on the back of the original seat back. *shrug*
I would get a Honda gas tank from Surplus Center for $15.

 

[BigWes]

Yea...that's what I really want...a tank of gas sitting under my most favorite possession. Just sitting there waiting to catch fire and smoke my sausage...I don't think so...

I had a fuel tank access cover gasket on my other Harley start leaking after the dealer replaced the fuel tank...oh **** no...I won't be having a gas leak around my crotch...sorry aint happening...

 

[Hellion]

...a tank of gas sitting under my most favorite possession. Just sitting there waiting to catch fire and smoke my sausage...I don't think so...

I bet you ride around with a cigarette hangin' outta yer mouth too, right?
That might be cause for concern, but...

Old jeeps and old pickup trucks have the gas tank under the driver seat and behind it, respectively.

And motorcycles (Harleys!) have a tank of gas sittin' betwixt your legs, man! You better stay inside sitting on your comfy La-Z-boy and keep yourself safe!

No sense risking your fambly jewels with this trivial motorsport hobby, right? Just hand over all your toys to me and I am certain you will live to a ripe old age of 99. No doubt in my mind. And your Vienna sausage will be safe too.

 

[Dingocat]

Sid's signature would be strangly fitting now

---------- Post added at 12:52 AM ---------- Previous post was at 12:51 AM ----------

Besides, don't most race karts have tanks located under the steering wheel?

 

[Hellion]

Besides, don't most race karts have tanks located under the steering wheel?

Indeed they do. I suspect the drivers wear Nomex suits too but I am not certain. That's certainly an option.

In any event, I don't think the fuel tanks spontaneously combust for no reason.

 

[BigWes]

I bet you ride around with a cigarette hangin' outta yer mouth too, right?
That might be cause for concern, but...

Old jeeps and old pickup trucks have the gas tank under the driver seat and behind it, respectively.

And motorcycles (Harleys!) have a tank of gas sittin' betwixt your legs, man! You better stay inside sitting on your comfy La-Z-boy and keep yourself safe!

No sense risking your fambly jewels with this trivial motorsport hobby, right? Just hand over all your toys to me and I am certain you will live to a ripe old age of 99. No doubt in my mind. And your Vienna sausage will be safe too.

Don't smoke... thanks for your concern though... I quit almost 20 years ago... But I never rode my bike with a smoke hanging out my mouth. And I'll never stop riding my bikes either. Bikes tend to be self clearing... normally the rider doesn't stay on the bike when things go bad...just the way it happens. I've been riding since I was 5 years old. Started on minis. I know this to be true. Unfortunately if a car burns a person can't always get out. I've unfortunately seen the aftermath of this and it wasn't good. I would hate to get tangled up on a cart. Can it happen? I don't know. Before my accident the other day I would have told you an exhaust stinger hanging out the back would be perfectly safe. Now I have second thoughts.

I'm not a couch jockey and never will be. I live dangerous and always have. I just don't like getting burned. Plus I am getting old. I still have a lotta crazy stuff left to do yet. I haven't jumped out of a plane yet...

 

[bthompson224]

Ok, so karts can be flipped, I get it.
But wouldn't the hoop with a tank full of gas on it just raise the center of gravity anyway?
'Cause it's a sizeable tank, about a gallon or two.

I don't think the 6-10 lbs sitting a few inches higher is going to make any measurable difference in the height of the CG. If you are driving that close to the edge, you will eventually flip it anyway. If it really bugs you, it appears you could lower the tank, **** you could cut a section out of the uprights on the loop and lower the whole top part. As far as a tank between your legs, if you flip it you're probably going to get gas on you somewhere. Deciding between my head and my b***s isn't really much of a choice.

 

[JTSpeedDemon]

To clarify, I don't intend to necessarily put the gas tank between my legs.
Maybe next to the engine behind me or on a bracket on the original backrest.
I don't really want a tank of gas between my legs either if I can avoid it, but I also don't want it behind my head.
And Hellion, kart drivers don't wear nomex suits. I read it in a book written by pro kart drivers, and kart suits have to meet abrasion resistance standards, and nomex isn't used BECAUSE it has no abrasion resistance.
It might be different for superkarts, IDK.

 

[Hellion]

...And Hellion, kart drivers don't wear nomex suits. I read it in a book written by pro kart drivers...

They could wear Nomex. Who's gonna stop them?

I've worn Nomex or Nomex-blend or clothing items with fire resistant materials. Never noticed it was particularly fragile. Your mileage may vary. But calm yourself down, I ain't making blanket statements written in stone...

But this fear of spontaneous gas tank combustion is just irrational. It's a might bit safer though, marginally, having a remote gas tank located far away from that spark plug, hot exhaust pipe and the engine heat. Right?

But those kart racers have that tank located right over their balls, man and wear no Nomex. That's livin' dangerously!

 

[JTSpeedDemon]

They could wear Nomex. Who's gonna stop them?

I've worn Nomex or Nomex-blend or clothing items with fire resistant materials. Never noticed it was particularly fragile. Your mileage may vary. But calm yourself down, I ain't making blanket statements written in stone...

But this fear of spontaneous gas tank combustion is just irrational. It's a might bit safer though, marginally, having a remote gas tank located far away from that spark plug, hot exhaust pipe and the engine heat. Right?

But those kart racers have that tank located right over their balls, man and wear no Nomex. That's livin' dangerously!

I wasn't trying to give you a violent shock of reality, just putting in my 2c as politely as I can.
Hope it didn't sound like a jerk statement.
But yeah, a layer of nomex doesn't sound like a bad idea to me, it's just that's what the book said.

 

[Hellion]

So... back on topic. Are you gonna remove the roll hoop or what?
The suspense is killing me!

Post pics if and when you do.

 

[Dingocat]

Still on topic lol. Gotta move the tank with the hoop off.

 

[Hellion]

...
7. And karts are very hard to flip anyway

Actually they are hard to flip (unless you're a madman like BigWus ). KARTS, like what you have. Low slung, low to the ground and low ground clearance.

Provided you are tooling around on level surfaces as well, and of course, trying not to flip it by contact with an immovable object....

In a sharp turn on flat, hard packed dirt, your tires are going to lose adhesion long before there's a danger of flipping. Similarly on pavement. You're gonna have a hard time inducing a flip before your tires finally break free and skid on the tarmac. You're gonna be drifting in turns at the extreme, not flipping over.


However, the buggies have largely taken over the hobby. They still call these 'go karts' but they have full suspension, high ground clearance, larger balloon tires and integrated roll cages--e.g. the whole frame built up around a (usually) two seat 'cockpit' with headrests and seatbelts. Some of them have a ridiculous cargo shelf in the back adding more weight...

All that weight high up equals a high C.O.G.; it's like they designed them to roll over.

 

[itsid]

​

race karts can be flipped with just driver's incompetence..
they do lift the inner rear wheel in corners to not understeer...
and if you're untrained enough
your weight is likely enough to exaggerate that into a flip

yard karts are different bred (narrower /narrower wheels) they usually indeed just loose traction in a similar corner..
BUT some people mount the widest available racing slicks to their yardkarts
and then traction will unlikely be lost and the kart will flip.

Big Wheel Yardkarts (Dingo bred and alike)
usually had low pressure tyres since the rubber takes out most of the jerk in a gentle way cancelling out some of the ill momentum.
making them harder to flip.
can still be done though..
(hence roll bars are a thing on tall tyred yard and fun karts)

The tank on race karts sits under the steering column and shaft,
since that's the safest place for it to be...
very little chance of deforming a kart in such a way that it rips open
sitting there.
no matter how you crash your kart it can't make road or obstacle contact.. and even if it rips open.. it's far from any hot sirface so spilled fuel will not as easily ignite.

The behind the seat tanks have been mostly banned from the tracks,
since they CAN rip open when flipping the kart spilling a severe amount of gas over a pretty hot exhaust.
(hence engine cages were a thing to protect the tank)

'sid