Advanced Hemi 212cc Predator Build

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bob58o

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Ramming effect? Not happening...What DOES. happen is overlap...The exhaust valve is still open at the point the piston is starting up....the scavanging effect of the exhaust gases exiting helps suck more fresh fuel charge in...once that exhaust valve closes...it's all over...only bad things can happen after that.

I guess I was too specific and also incorrect at same time.
Does dynamic compression ratio even matter except at idle?
Doesn't actual compression depend on RPM and flow characteristics of the engine?

Will a 8.5 DCR turn into 10+ DCR at Peak RPM?
 

bob58o

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I can make this look good [enough]!
It'll be fine!
I can see the insignificant gains and losses already! Lol
 

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bob58o

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Not going to be perfectly smooth.
Strategically placed dimples (think golf ball :lolgoku:)for maximizing air flow in hard to reach places.

Coincidentally, my really expensive air flow simulator software, told me to leave imperfections in the exact places that are hard to get to with the finishing buffs and die grinder! So that's cool!:roflol:
 

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Jrgunn5150

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I guess I was too specific and also incorrect at same time.
Does dynamic compression ratio even matter except at idle?
Doesn't actual compression depend on RPM and flow characteristics of the engine?

Will a 8.5 DCR turn into 10+ DCR at Peak RPM?

No, your DCR is determined by your cam event's only. Cylinder pressure is RPM dependent.

There is a relationship between static compression ratio (ie 11.5:1) and cylinder pressure (ie 195 PSI). One problem is that cylinder pressure can be expressed in a few different ways to describe different things.
What most people refer to is cranking pressure ( measuring the cylinder pressure with aguage while turning the engine over)which is affected greatly by what cam you have. Not only the duration but also the opening and closing points. You can have two engines that are identical in every way, to include the same measured and calculated static compression ratios ( say 10.8:1) but different cams and they can have VERY different cranking pressures!
Taking it one step further is an engines Break Mean Effective Pressure (BMEP). which is a measure of the average cylinder pressures generated during all four engine strokes (for a 4stroke obviously). It is always highest at max torque as that is when an engine creates the highest cylinder pressure and instananious power regardles of engine size and operating RPM. Here things get complicated as BMEP is affected by all of the aspects of an engine that influence getting air in, adding fuel, compressing it, igniting, and expelling the gases, along with the thermal properties of the engine. The gas velocity ram effect of an intake manifold and the "tuning effect" of different headers are examples of altering an engines BMEP. The faster an engine turns the less time it has to fill the cylinder, how the cam,intake and exhaust allow it to get the gases in and out will determine at what RPM an engine achieves BMEP and consequently max torque. Where this gets tricky is time. As an example, one engine that reaches a max BMEP of 210PSI @4000RPM will have less power than one that reaches the same max BMEP @ 6000rpm. although both engines are creating the exact same downward pressure on the piston the faster engine is doing it more frequently AKA horsepower (Torque over time).
I've glossed over alot of very involved subjects quickly and have poorly represented the topic but it's a start.
The best book I've ever read on the practicle application of engine performance is "Four stroke tuning for performance" by A. Graham Bell. If your really interested in the science of making any car fast for any type of competition it's hard to beat.
 

Poboy kartman

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No, your DCR is determined by your cam event's only. Cylinder pressure is RPM dependent.

There is a relationship between static compression ratio (ie 11.5:1) and cylinder pressure (ie 195 PSI). One problem is that cylinder pressure can be expressed in a few different ways to describe different things.
What most people refer to is cranking pressure ( measuring the cylinder pressure with aguage while turning the engine over)which is affected greatly by what cam you have. Not only the duration but also the opening and closing points. You can have two engines that are identical in every way, to include the same measured and calculated static compression ratios ( say 10.8:1) but different cams and they can have VERY different cranking pressures!
Taking it one step further is an engines Break Mean Effective Pressure (BMEP). which is a measure of the average cylinder pressures generated during all four engine strokes (for a 4stroke obviously). It is always highest at max torque as that is when an engine creates the highest cylinder pressure and instananious power regardles of engine size and operating RPM. Here things get complicated as BMEP is affected by all of the aspects of an engine that influence getting air in, adding fuel, compressing it, igniting, and expelling the gases, along with the thermal properties of the engine. The gas velocity ram effect of an intake manifold and the "tuning effect" of different headers are examples of altering an engines BMEP. The faster an engine turns the less time it has to fill the cylinder, how the cam,intake and exhaust allow it to get the gases in and out will determine at what RPM an engine achieves BMEP and consequently max torque. Where this gets tricky is time. As an example, one engine that reaches a max BMEP of 210PSI @4000RPM will have less power than one that reaches the same max BMEP @ 6000rpm. although both engines are creating the exact same downward pressure on the piston the faster engine is doing it more frequently AKA horsepower (Torque over time).
I've glossed over alot of very involved subjects quickly and have poorly represented the topic but it's a start.
The best book I've ever read on the practicle application of engine performance is "Four stroke tuning for performance" by A. Graham Bell. If your really interested in the science of making any car fast for any type of competition it's hard to beat.

JEEZE Marvin!

I mean........

I might

take

it to extremes

but.......

really?

.....do

you think

you might

break

that block

of words

up a

little?
 

Jrgunn5150

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Sometimes, it depends on how many people from Corporate are roaming around lol.
 

bob58o

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Great stuff! I feel like I'm almost complete with my small engine edumacation!
6 months ago, I knew nothing. Three months ago, when I started this thread, I knew little.

Now I have a decent understanding of how the different parts work together. This is very satisfying for me, that is being able to learn about and understand a mystery using only the internet! (and HF!)
 

bob58o

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I can still do 500 grit wet paper, black emery rouge, and white diamond rouge. I don't really want to.

What do you think? Good enough? This is 320 grit.
 

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Jrgunn5150

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I can still do 500 grit wet paper, black emery rouge, and white diamond rouge. I don't really want to.

What do you think? Good enough? This is 320 grit.

That finish looks as good as I've ever done. I've always only smoothed them, I never felt confident enough to reshape a combustion chamber.
 

Poboy kartman

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Did I mention I like things shiny? IT SUCKS! JK....Looks good Bob....(don't believe all those other guys that say I was laughing behind your back...they're just jealous) ...:lolgoku:

What's next? (I know you can't be putting this thing together yet!):rolleyes:
 

bob58o

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Did I mention I like things shiny? IT SUCKS! JK....Looks good Bob....(don't believe all those other guys that say I was laughing behind your back...they're just jealous) ...:lolgoku:

What's next? (I know you can't be putting this thing together yet!):rolleyes:

Since you mention it... I haven't yet molested the exhaust side of things...

---------- Post added at 05:43 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:39 PM ----------

Did I mention I like things shiny? IT SUCKS! JK....Looks good Bob....(don't believe all those other guys that say I was laughing behind your back...they're just jealous) ...:lolgoku:

What's next? (I know you can't be putting this thing together yet!):rolleyes:

Not sure what else I will ever use the white diamond rouge for. I have it. I'll make it mirror for the sake of GAB.
 

bob58o

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NASCAR Ray supports the theory of leaving rough texture inside the chamber. He wanted to say because of poor atomization of the fuel, but worded it differently.

He referenced the dimples as well, but talking about the intake.
 

Jrgunn5150

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NASCAR Ray supports the theory of leaving rough texture inside the chamber. He wanted to say because of poor atomization of the fuel, but worded it differently.

He referenced the dimples as well, but talking about the intake.

I wouldn't be terribly worried about atomization in the chamber, that happens in the carb, and is supported in the runner, and through the valve. Once it's in the chamber, BANG, it's over. Then out through an exhaust port made as smooth as possible.
 

chancer

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Once it's in the chamber, BANG, it's over.

But... Suck Squeeze bang Blow. At 5000 RPM
Atomized Fuel is sucked in Squeezed and then BANG! So
60 seconds in a minute divided by 5000 RPMs =.012 but Xs 2 suck and Squeeze is .024 of a second time the fuel has to Deatomize.
If your engines torque curves gives you the most power at 2800 RPMs
Then even more time you do the math but i guess .03?
Is it deatomizing in 3 hundredths of a second?

I do not know I just do math good!
 
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