trash dump find...need help

[ghost civic]

I found this electric wheel chair thing at the dump. It was complete, even the charger.

I brought it home and tried to charge it...nothing happened. Didn't really expect it to be that easy.

So, now I would like to test the motor by applying 12v directly. But im a bit confused...there are 2 sets of wires going to the motor. one set has a red and a black wire. The other one has either 1 or 2 black wires. Could that second wire be for motor braking?

Also, I assume these things don't go fast enough for go kart use. Do I have any options other than overvolting the motor? I don't even know how many volts these things are meant to run on.

If the motor and axle are good, im thinking I will remove all the plastic, attach a seat/make a battery tray and figure out some way to make the steering work go kart style. I have a couple of 12v SLA batteries.(power wheels size)

any advice would be helpful.

 

[itsid]

more likely a series wound motor.

no magnets, seperate 'magnet coils'

it'll only run with the correct wiring and/or controller.

attaching two leads to a battery will most likely get you nowhere

'sid

 

[ghost civic]

more likely a series wound motor.

no magnets, seperate 'magnet coils'

it'll only run with the correct wiring and/or controller.

attaching two leads to a battery will most likely get you nowhere

'sid

ah, so if I cant get it to work with the controls, it aint going to work at all.

I did figure out it was running on 2 12v 12ah batteries, in series. That is going to make it hard for me to get more speed...don't want to run 36v, that's to many batteries. The only thing I can think of is if I can get larger diameter tires...effectively increasing the gearing.
Will play with it more tonight and see if I can get it to do anything.

 

[itsid]

IDK for sure, but I'd say so yes.

specs are on the motor though;

Oh and that gear box that it's attached to, wont let you go any faster anyways;
those are MEANT to be slow by design.
(think about the reaction time of the 'typical driver' )

Anyways, look at the specs of it, there should be a motorlabel.. at least you'll find the modelnumber and could google your way to the specs.

24V is plausible though..

'sid

 

[ghost civic]

well specs on the model itself says 4.5mph and a range of 10 miles. sounds about right for being that slow and running on 24v.

I was able to get power to the controls (front light and a led on the control as well as the battery charge gauge) but still nothing to the motor.

I figure there are 2 possible causes...either the main control box in the back (near the motor) is done for....or the potentiometer that is on the F/R lever is not working. Any ideas on how to bypass the potentiometer? It has 3 wires going to it.

Ill look up the motor specs next time I work on it.

thanx.

 

[ghost civic]

ok, motor info:
model: ZIPR3-GM
voltage: 24Vdc

that was all I could find, which was on a label. If there is more info on the case itself, it is where I cannot see it.

 

[ghost civic]

oh, maybe I should mention...even with power off I cannot turn both wheels by hand at all (if you turn one, the other spins the other way due to the diff, but you cant get the motor to turn) Not sure if the braking is like on a power wheels...where brakes are engaged anytime the throttle isn't applied or if you should be able to move the wheels with the power off.

 

[itsid]

I got some bad news for you...

that motor is only 155 Watts ...

sooo not too much speed at all; it's heavily geared down (that's why you can't turn the wheels) but speed is not exactly an option I'm afraid

'sid

 

[ghost civic]

for sake of argument...if the motor was used without that gearbox/axle...could you get any decent speed out of it (10-15mph?)

also, any idea on how to bypass a potentiometer? Im trying to figure out if the controls are bad or if the main ecu thing is bad. the controls are basically 2 potentiometers...one for speed adjustment and the other for forward/b/reverse.

 

[chancer]

I have a 350watt motor for sale in the classifieds if that would help!

 

[ghost civic]

I have a 350watt motor for sale in the classifieds if that would help!

probably could...im trying to build something out of free stuff

 

[ghost civic]

Ok, tonight I finally realized the blinking green light on the controls was blinking 8 times, then pausing. Looked up the manual and the green light can be a troubleshooting indicator.

sadly, it indicates that the controller is bad. I have checked and double checked all connections. I opened up the controller box and oddly, it looks fine. doesn't smell burnt either. No signs of a short or anything.

I know regular DC motors, but not about series wound motors. Is there no way to test the motor without a controller?

 

[itsid]

if you know how the coils are setup, yes..
and if it IS a series wound motor (and not just looks like one for me )

then you can wire the field coils in series with the rotor windings, just like a starter motor and connect it to (please no more than 12V for testing purpose)

but in which direction is the big question.

Anyways, please take the best possible picture of the controllers inside, if possible a second picture of the PCBs backside

Maybe I can see something you can't

'sid

 

[ghost civic]

um, no idea what you mean about wiring the field coils in series with the rotor windings. I see a pos/neg wire...and then 2 smaller wires, one black and one yellow.

here are some pics.

 

[itsid]

Ahhhh I see.. that's not field coils that's the brake (I'm not sure how it's set up, might be engaged until powered for security reasons... *shrugs*)

The pictures though lack a bit of precision I'm afraid;
goo to identify the part, bad to identify the maybe small broken lead you missed or cooked copper trace

You sure it's 8 flashes?
7 would be a more common issue (throttle not in neutral when switching on)

Anyways, to test the motor you can simply power it with 12V to see if it turns the wheels, if it doesn't, don't give up just yet and also engage the brake (also 12V check both polarities, since I can't verify which one's positive likely yellow.. but again: *shrugs*)

if the motor doesn't turn no matter what you do.. then you know the reason for the flashing errorcode of the controller.. it simply doesn't detect the faulty motor..

the controller might still be functional (I know.. but ebay's there to take it off your shelf )

'sid

PS still: if you want to run the motor on a more regular basis.. use a controller, even a 155W motor if geared low, can break more than one bone if you can't switch it off fast enough.

 

[ghost civic]

if by brake you mean the lever on the motor, that is to switch it between "drive engaged" and "freewheel" for pushing it by hand. at least that's what the manual says.

to clarify...to test the motor I would apply 12v to the red and black wires going to the motor, right? the other black and yellow wires are much smaller diameter wire (not much thicker than the wires going to the hand controls)

I counted many times, and it was 8 flashes. wish it had been 7!

as you mention, the controller or the motor could still work...it is most likely only one of them is damaged. I don't understand why someone would throw this thing in the trash. even if they didn't want to fix it or bother to figure out what is wrong...why not sell it for parts? These things are $750 new! Someone who has one might have paid a few bucks for a parts machine. At the very least I would have given it away, no sense in putting it the trash.

I recently pulled a power wheels escalade out of a guy's trash. he said the gearboxes were blown, cause his kids could push it around the yard (no drag=busted gears)
In reality, the pos going to the gas switch had rotted off (which stopped it from working in the first place) and then the spring inside the switch rotted and left the switch in the "ON" position...so the connection was not made to short the motors and cause drag. I cleaned the switch, replaced the spring ($1) and had my kid driving it around in less under 30 minutes.

 

[OzFab]

Just to throw my hat in the ring, I had a similar situation some time ago, have a look at this thread...

The machine you have is meant for low speeds & uses compound gearing to achieve low speed while still having enough torque to climb hills; if you want any sort of speed out of it, you will need to add a larger motor, which will need a larger capacity controller, & reconfigure the final drive; although the OEM motor has a lower wattage rating, it will still spin at an approx max 2950rpm... as will a larger motor...

 

[ghost civic]

ok, so it is a brake...lol
the 2 smaller wires on the motor are connected to a small switch...which lets the controller know the brake is on!

I connected 12v directly to the motors pos/neg leads. It ran! swapped the leads and it ran in reverse. guess that means it is a normal DC motor.

as said, with that gear box it is really slow.

what will happen if I make my own chain or belt drive tho? Will a 155w motor on 24v have enough for a light go kart to go at least 10-15mph?

 

[itsid]

easier to judge by yourself...

apply twice to three times the weight you need/want to move and give it a try.. does it still move without much effort, does it still accelerate as quick as you would like it to be?

then yes, you can double or triple the speed, to move half or a third of the weight you tested with...
and get more or less the same resulting acceleration.

'sid

 

[ghost civic]

it can drive me over the lawn. it is certainly a bit quicker with my 5yo son riding on it tho.