Torque Converter on a Motorized Bicycle
- Thread starter augidog
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r97
Measure twice cut once
Looks like its coming around nicely! Now its time for some welding 
yes & no...i have a couple nice attach-points on my frame already, so i'd like to devise an adjustable bolt-on bracket for the TC & seat. the lower jackshaft will also be clamp-on & adjustable. after i get these two pieces figured out, i will have to pay for fabrication, but i found a local guy to do that. i could do it myself but i left my MIG in my other jacket, and i don't need enough welding to justify buying a cheapo for the winter.
another month, another few pieces. i snagged my engine sprocket, a hub for a driver-jackshaft, some 3/4" shaft, and some keystock.
i went with 3.5:1 from the engine to the converter-driver. after i widen the hole a bit, the billet hub (from BMI) will fit perfectly flush in the backplate...boy i've been lucky with mixing and matching my parts.
this assembly is getting really heavy, a lot of mass...sure hope my math is right, or i'm building myself one expensive paper-weight.
i went with 3.5:1 from the engine to the converter-driver. after i widen the hole a bit, the billet hub (from BMI) will fit perfectly flush in the backplate...boy i've been lucky with mixing and matching my parts.
this assembly is getting really heavy, a lot of mass...sure hope my math is right, or i'm building myself one expensive paper-weight.
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Photo11102133.jpg -
Photo11102132.jpg
TorqueRanger
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What size motor is that ???
i recently scored this brand new Tanaka 47 Type-R. the 47R is a factory modified 47cc brush-cutter engine.
in this particular power/weight class, 50cc on a bicycle, there's not much better than a Tanaka.
http://scooter.wikia.com/wiki/Tanaka_47r
it makes 2.8hp & does 12k. i think i could lose as much as 25% of that to drivetrain
mass/inertia, so i'm giving the engine a 3.5:1 advantage over the converter, which
outta make the tav "think" it's hooked to a ~6-8hp/3-4k engine.
i previously used (and still have) a 2.2hp/11k Tanaka 40cc with over 15,000 bicycle-miles on it, all single-speed 25:1 to 20:1, that's hard work...but it shows no signs of giving in any time soon.
with a 46:1 to 15:1 range to work with, and a properly matched pedal ratio, i expect this 47 will pretty much last forever, and together we'll be able to handle even the toughest mountain passes...hehe, and without me needing a nap halfway up.
i've got a long ride ahead of me next season, and will have no time to dally, so i'm building a bullet-proof drivetrain to match the bullet-proof chassis.
in this particular power/weight class, 50cc on a bicycle, there's not much better than a Tanaka.
http://scooter.wikia.com/wiki/Tanaka_47r
it makes 2.8hp & does 12k. i think i could lose as much as 25% of that to drivetrain
mass/inertia, so i'm giving the engine a 3.5:1 advantage over the converter, which
outta make the tav "think" it's hooked to a ~6-8hp/3-4k engine.
i previously used (and still have) a 2.2hp/11k Tanaka 40cc with over 15,000 bicycle-miles on it, all single-speed 25:1 to 20:1, that's hard work...but it shows no signs of giving in any time soon.
with a 46:1 to 15:1 range to work with, and a properly matched pedal ratio, i expect this 47 will pretty much last forever, and together we'll be able to handle even the toughest mountain passes...hehe, and without me needing a nap halfway up.
i've got a long ride ahead of me next season, and will have no time to dally, so i'm building a bullet-proof drivetrain to match the bullet-proof chassis.
Last edited:
Doc Sprocket
*********
Uber cool! What is your projected top speed, somewhere in the 25-30MPH range?
more or less, fully laden...maybe 35 on a level run, but look at all that low-end.
TC low-end: 3.5 X 2.7 X 5 = 47.25:1
TC top-end: 3.5 X .9 X 5 = 15.75
do the ideal math on 12000r at 15.75:1 to a 26" tire
http://www.compgoparts.com/TechnicalResources/SprocketCalculator.asp
TC low-end: 3.5 X 2.7 X 5 = 47.25:1
TC top-end: 3.5 X .9 X 5 = 15.75
do the ideal math on 12000r at 15.75:1 to a 26" tire
http://www.compgoparts.com/TechnicalResources/SprocketCalculator.asp
Doc Sprocket
*********
You could climb a wall! Yeah, I don't think hills are going to give you any trouble. I look forward to seeing the end result. Got any idea what total curb weight might be?
how much do she weigh?
well, i dunno...i keep missing out on chances at getting on a scale.
the bare steel frame is 22" tall with a 16" extension.
the crank & chainring are retro Worksman Tricycle, solid steel.
the wheels are steel, with steel moped hubs and heavy steel spokes.
the front-end is off an old whizzer, 1" SS tubes, real oil suspension.
the lights are powered by a 24V/20A SLA battery-pack.
the gascan is 1 1/4 gal.
the trailer hitch is salvaged from an old steel Wester Flyer.
the trailer is an upside down steel utility table.
the trailer wheel is steel.
luckily, the trailer suspension is very lightweight alloy
i carry a full & comfy campground, and a lot of tools & spares.
i weigh 200lbs.
and now i'm glomming on all this new machinery...
there is a recycler closeby here, and yes i'll be able to roll through in the spring and finally find out.
btw-total length = 11' 1"
well, i dunno...i keep missing out on chances at getting on a scale.
the bare steel frame is 22" tall with a 16" extension.
the crank & chainring are retro Worksman Tricycle, solid steel.
the wheels are steel, with steel moped hubs and heavy steel spokes.
the front-end is off an old whizzer, 1" SS tubes, real oil suspension.
the lights are powered by a 24V/20A SLA battery-pack.
the gascan is 1 1/4 gal.
the trailer hitch is salvaged from an old steel Wester Flyer.
the trailer is an upside down steel utility table.
the trailer wheel is steel.
luckily, the trailer suspension is very lightweight alloy
i carry a full & comfy campground, and a lot of tools & spares.
i weigh 200lbs.
and now i'm glomming on all this new machinery...
there is a recycler closeby here, and yes i'll be able to roll through in the spring and finally find out.
btw-total length = 11' 1"
Attachments
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Sabrina_2_Alaska.jpg
r_chez_08
Should be in the shop...
Cool! What are the rules and regs with motorised bikes?
it's not all good news...
recently, the state of washington completely erased the term "motorized bicycle" from it's laws and codes, and modernized its 50cc "moped" defintions...bicycle components simply cannot meet these clarified codes, and that is that. any bicycle with gas-assist is illegal in washington state, period.
another change is the addition of the defined "electric assisted bicycle" which will enjoy all the freedoms that gas assisted bicycles just lost, but at a 20mph limit down from the previous 30mph.
historically, this is a blow for the motor-vehicle that led the way for everything else with 2-wheels and an engine. this event is directly related to the recent (re)surge in popularity, paired with an epidemic of blatant violations & abuse of every last freedom we & our contraptions enjoyed. i have a lot more to say about that on my forum, but this is far as i'll go here.
this hurts me as an avid fan of the motorsport & its' legacy, but i was leaving washington state next season anyway, and will be keepin' on for as far as i can get before everyone shuts us down.
finally, i've collected enough parts to complete my diy torque-converter. matching billet hubs from BMI (wow, really heavy duty) for jackshafts, the symetrical flanges & tapped holes will make solid mounting a breeze. i'll buy belts based on my finalized center-distance.
the pulleys are "upside down" on the other side of the hubs, i'll need to shim the driven out about 1/8" for alignment. these are rock-solid assemblies, with a lot of mass but virtually zero rotational drag...so far i'm pretty doggone pleased.
recently, the state of washington completely erased the term "motorized bicycle" from it's laws and codes, and modernized its 50cc "moped" defintions...bicycle components simply cannot meet these clarified codes, and that is that. any bicycle with gas-assist is illegal in washington state, period.
another change is the addition of the defined "electric assisted bicycle" which will enjoy all the freedoms that gas assisted bicycles just lost, but at a 20mph limit down from the previous 30mph.
historically, this is a blow for the motor-vehicle that led the way for everything else with 2-wheels and an engine. this event is directly related to the recent (re)surge in popularity, paired with an epidemic of blatant violations & abuse of every last freedom we & our contraptions enjoyed. i have a lot more to say about that on my forum, but this is far as i'll go here.
this hurts me as an avid fan of the motorsport & its' legacy, but i was leaving washington state next season anyway, and will be keepin' on for as far as i can get before everyone shuts us down.
finally, i've collected enough parts to complete my diy torque-converter. matching billet hubs from BMI (wow, really heavy duty) for jackshafts, the symetrical flanges & tapped holes will make solid mounting a breeze. i'll buy belts based on my finalized center-distance.
the pulleys are "upside down" on the other side of the hubs, i'll need to shim the driven out about 1/8" for alignment. these are rock-solid assemblies, with a lot of mass but virtually zero rotational drag...so far i'm pretty doggone pleased.
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torque_converter1.jpg -
torque_converter.jpg
That sucks about the change of law. At least you were planning on leaving the state anyway. This doesn't bode well for the rest of the states though. They might eventually follow.
Oh....I am glad you are getting everything together.
Oh....I am glad you are getting everything together.
if peeps keep using illegal engines & riding like idiots, for sure the other states will follow.
me too. i can only afford a few items each month, and each step drives me crazy waiting for the next.
over here its not just cc rating which is under 50cc but also has to be less than 2kw and with a top speed of 50kmph or less, i think. Atho i've seen plenty of rg50s, nsr50s and rs50s reg'd as mopeds lol
edit: and r chez i think they have similar rules in the uk. Except your police force is more onto it, have seen pics of them testing mopeds on minature rolling road dynos on the side of the road haha
where did you get that big drive pully thing for you back wheel? i wana get something like that. Was thinking of modding a smaller sized bike wheel
edit: and r chez i think they have similar rules in the uk. Except your police force is more onto it, have seen pics of them testing mopeds on minature rolling road dynos on the side of the road haha
where did you get that big drive pully thing for you back wheel? i wana get something like that. Was thinking of modding a smaller sized bike wheel
the drive-ring is part of golden eagle's belt drive: www.bikeengines.com
Really i live in washington state and never heard of this. ive seen plenty a people riding around on gas assisted bikes too. i live in tacoma,wa and see at least 1 person a day they drive by cops and the cops do nothing.
washington state
yes, a 50cc "motorized bicycle" used to be clearly defined as a moped. previous moped standards were somewhat loosely laid out.
look closely at both the state legislature:
http://apps.leg.wa.gov/RCW/default.aspx?cite=46.04
and the state patrol:
http://www.wsp.wa.gov/traveler/vehicles.htm
and take note...for the first time in 'ever, the term "motorized bicycle" is gone from both sites, the term "electric-assisted bicycle" has been nicely firmed up. legislation for mopeds is still the same, but the mechanical standards for mopeds has been raised sky-high.
here's the new (july 2011) moped standards...if your gas-powered bicycle violates or fails to meet any of this stuff, your bike is illegal.
View attachment moped.pdf
if the cops let someone ride, all good...but just so you know, the cops don't have to "let" us ride any more if they don't wanna. and if they wanna get us off the road, it's way easy for 'em now.
yes, a 50cc "motorized bicycle" used to be clearly defined as a moped. previous moped standards were somewhat loosely laid out.
look closely at both the state legislature:
http://apps.leg.wa.gov/RCW/default.aspx?cite=46.04
and the state patrol:
http://www.wsp.wa.gov/traveler/vehicles.htm
and take note...for the first time in 'ever, the term "motorized bicycle" is gone from both sites, the term "electric-assisted bicycle" has been nicely firmed up. legislation for mopeds is still the same, but the mechanical standards for mopeds has been raised sky-high.
here's the new (july 2011) moped standards...if your gas-powered bicycle violates or fails to meet any of this stuff, your bike is illegal.
View attachment moped.pdf
if the cops let someone ride, all good...but just so you know, the cops don't have to "let" us ride any more if they don't wanna. and if they wanna get us off the road, it's way easy for 'em now.
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