The Spawn of the Beast - mini chopper project

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zogthegreat

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Hi everyone!

This will be my first build on this forum, first a little background on the title. Last year I did a Razor Dirt Quad build, where I rebuilt the rear swing arm to hold a 54lb 9.5hp industrial motor and 4 12v 18ah batteries:





This is the motor next to a Unite 1000w 36v motor:



The build was a lot of fun and I ended up calling the project "The Beast" because of the size of the motor. In reality, however, I should have called it "The Wild Pig". It had a high center of gravity that made it handle like a pig on straight roads! I never got to open up the throttle on it, so I was disappointed with it in the end. I was thinking about lowering it by rebuilding the front suspension, but ultimately, I decided that it would be to much work.

I decided to find a go kart frame to drop the motor on to and I went out this weekend to a 39 mile long yard sale down here in central Florida to look for a frame when I saw this:



It had a 5hp gas motor on it that I told the owner I didn't want. After bargaining with the gentleman, I got the frame for $40.00! Since I'm putting most of the hardware from the The Beast on it, I decided to call it "The Spawn of the Beast".

My current plans are to set it up like this:



The red box on top of the batteries is a Kelly KDZ48200 controller. I'm thinking to mount it on the front down tube, (although I'm open to suggestions).

To make it look "pretty" I'm planing to use a head light like this:



with a speedometer like this:



And a voltmeter and ammeter combo like these:



I will also get rid of the gas tank, if I feel the need for something there aesthetically, I'll make something out of fiberglass, (I am definitely open to suggestions here!).

BTW, if anyone want's the tank, PM me and you can have it for the cost of shipping, I really don't like throwing things away, but I'm to lazy to sell it on fleabay!

As I said before, I'm open to suggestions, comments and philosophical musings! :D
 

Functional Artist

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Very Kool! :thumbsup:

Yes, keep us updated

How quick does that "big" motor suck then "little" batteries dry?


Analog meters look kool & retro

...but, the needles tend to bounce around a lot on kart's & minibike's

a digital meter may be a better/more practical option

...they are available with both amp & volt readings in one little unit (like 2" x 3") https://www.ebay.com/itm/DC-300V-50...154537&hash=item2c828a4f0b:g:A90AAOxypNtSnjUf

...they have smaller meters (up to 100A) available

...but, being @150A - 200A range you'll need the bigger one :2guns:
 

zogthegreat

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Very Kool! :thumbsup:

How quick does that "big" motor suck then "little" batteries dry?

Lol, I honestly don't know. It has some really scary power though! I was really afraid to open up the throttle on The Beast, the stability issues mixed with the massive amount of torque is what convinced me to look for a new frame for the motor, (I'm planning to drop a 1000w 36v Unite on The Beast so that I can ride it and not end up "damaged" ;) ).

a digital meter may be a better/more practical option

...they are available with both amp & volt readings in one little unit (like 2" x 3") https://www.ebay.com/itm/DC-300V-50...154537&hash=item2c828a4f0b:g:A90AAOxypNtSnjUf

...they have smaller meters (up to 100A) available

...but, being @150A - 200A range you'll need the bigger one :2guns:

Yeah, I used that type on both The Beast and my daughters Pocket Mod:

http://forum.modifiedelectricscoote...3&t=3286&sid=18d065bed020d9426e58c2e893cc2469

http://forum.modifiedelectricscooters.com/viewtopic.php?f=13&t=3333&start=150

(about 3/4 down on the page)

However.....

I scored on eBay this morning! On of the 12v 18ah SLA's that I was planning to use on this project somehow or other shorted out on my trip from Montreal to Florida, (I live full time in a 36' motorhome these days, I'm originally from California and -30 SUCKS!!!). So I went on eBay to peruse for new SLA's. I was looking at $120.00 with shipping for 4 new batteries and I thought that I would check and compare the price of lithium's when I found this:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/122752553886

:wai::wai::wai:

I couldn't afford it this month, (I just spent $1000.00 on gas!), but I really couldn't not afford it! A BMS isn't that hard to repair/replace and the entire pack only weighs 8 lbs! Each 12v 18ah SLA comes in at 12.5 lbs, so I'm losing 40 lbs of batteries!

Which means I have to change my design plans. I was going to go for a "retro" look, but now I'm thinking something sleeker and futuristic. I really have to wait for the battery to arrive next Monday and see what I'm dealing with. One thought that I'm having is to disassemble the pack and build a faux gas tank to hold the batteries, (although, since the batteries are my "fuel", is it really a faux tank?).

Now I'm thinking something like this:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/VAC1100A-L...091222?hash=item1a389ef516:g:u2EAAOSwZVlXnGrk

although these e-motorcycles have some nice gauges also:

http://www.bikeexif.com/electric-motorcycle

https://evmc2.wordpress.com/2013/11/15/the-electric-garage-shiun-craft-works-choppers-forever/

(you have to scroll through the pic on the second link)

So now I have to go through the frustration of waiting for Santa, (i.e. the USPS), to bring me my toy before I can make any more design plans!
 

Functional Artist

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Lol, I honestly don't know. It has some really scary power though! I was really afraid to open up the throttle on The Beast, the stability issues mixed with the massive amount of torque is what convinced me to look for a new frame for the motor, (I'm planning to drop a 1000w 36v Unite on The Beast so that I can ride it and not end up "damaged" ;) ).


I kinda ran into the same issues

Last year I mounted a "big" electric motor on a Dingo kart

http://www.diygokarts.com/vb/showthread.php?t=33680

It moved along but,

...it was so overloaded in the rear (motor, batteries etc.)

...that, combined with the live axle

...meant that it had nearly NO steering


So, one of my projects this summer was to mount that "big" motor on

...something more appropriate :thumbsup:

http://www.diygokarts.com/vb/showthread.php?t=37062
 

zogthegreat

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I got some work done on the frame today. There are a lot of holes from what appears to be two different gas tanks, as well as several others that I can't figure out what they were for:



I welded them up and cut off the fugly arsed repair job someone did on the foot pegs:



OK, I'm not the worlds greatest welder, but seriously? Whoever did this didn't even clean up the left over mig wire! Then I went at the paint with a wire brush attached to my angle grinder and a flap disk:



And then some black primer to keep it from rusting while I figure out my design plans:



Purdy!

The axle was a PITA to get out. One of the worm screws is rusted in. I tried using a propane torch, but that didn't work, so I'm going to drill out the center of the screw and try to use an easy-out to get the rest. I'm hoping to save the mount to reuse.

 

zogthegreat

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Well, it was a good news/bad news day today. The good news is that my battery pack came in!



These are Lifepo4 cells, not the Li-Ion the seller had advertised, but that part doesn't really matter to me:



They are also flat cells, not the 18650's that I was expecting, but once again, not a problem.

They problems is I was told on Endless-Sphere that my motor will fry the batteries! Not good! So that leaves me the following choices:

1 - Install a 20a fuse to protect the batteries and hope for the best.

2 - Change the motor for something that will be large enough to move the chopper, but won't damage the batteries. Save "The Beast" for a go kart frame like I originally planned.

3 - Save the battery pack for another project and buy some SLA's.

Grrrr! I had a really cool design worked out that depended on these batteries! (sigh), Back to the drawing board again!
 

zogthegreat

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Where's the bad news?

I had a really great design worked out based on the F-117 Stealth Fighter:





Think of this without the wings or tail. I was going to make a mold for the fuel tank and cast it with carbon fiber cloth. Flat, angular. I had even planned to do air intakes to keep the batteries cool. With matching front and rear fenders. I was going to paint the frame flat black like you see on the Dodge Chargers.

With SLA's, this design doesn't work, even if I could figure out how to put 50 lbs+ of batteries into the design, it would make the chopper to top heavy, replicating the problems that I had with the original "Beast".

Right now I'm leaning towards dropping a Predator 212 on the chopper and selling it off. Although I was reading Functional Artist post about his El Moto motorcycle conversion:

http://www.diygokarts.com/vb/showthread.php?t=37062

He's using 4 x 12v 35ah batteries. I'm going to ask him hows the mileage he's getting. But that's another $200 - $250 in batteries.

The sad thing is, until St. Elon Musk or someone else comes up with a newer technology in batteries, gasoline will continue to out perform batteries as far as energy per pound. Although Elon is trying to make batteries cheaper at least.
 

zogthegreat

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Well, it seems that the Government of Quebec has helped me decided on the size of the motor for my project! :mad:


COST OF REGISTRATION RENEWAL – MOPEDS AND SCOOTERS

Mopeds and scooters are considered as part of the same category.

MOPEDS AND SCOOTERS
Insurance contribution (tax included) - $273.00
Charge - $4.45
Vehicle registration fee - $13.20
Total - $290.65

https://saaq.gouv.qc.ca/en/saaq/rat...on/cost-registration-renewal/mopeds-scooters/

The "Insurance contribution" doesn't cover the need to have regular insurance on the bike, you still need to go to an insurance agency for that!

$290 is more than I pay for the plate on my car! That's "only" $265 a year! Add another $150 - $200 to get a VIN and title.

Now I know to go with a larger motor and also to move back to the US full time!

:mad: Would anyone like to know how to swear in French? I'm practicing right now!!!
 
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