the prohibitar nightmare

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Russell ATV

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Thread hijack :p

I'm thinking of removing the governor on my 6.5 clone too. But I'll probably be running flat out for good periods of time, would you advise I still remove it?

Have you run any other mods? If so, then things like a lean mixture from not matching up the mods can kill an engine.

If no mods, then watch your engine temp, and try to keep off the valves floating (5000+ RPM). Remember, this engine was designed to run all day between 3000-3600 RPM, so running it for a long duration at higher RPM does require some monitoring.

That said, this is exactly what the Box Stock racers do. They run the motor mostly stock without the govenor for an entire race (xxx Laps). After a season or two (even more), they may tear it down and inspect wear. From what I have heard, the engines hold up very well.

People are now starting to race these engines as Super Box Stock, with several mods. It will be interesting to see the long term effects of running 7-8000RPM while generating 12+ HP for long periods of time. This will truely test the engine.

Russ Barrow
Russell ATV
 

killawatt

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rode around today with the stock motor but couldnt get the idea of pulling the governer out the back of my head so i did it and its about the same up untill just over 3600 rpms then acceleration decreases a little but it was extra power i wound it out for a good 10 sec but the way it sounded at red line worried me
 

Scorch3

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rode around today with the stock motor but couldnt get the idea of pulling the governer out the back of my head so i did it and its about the same up untill just over 3600 rpms then acceleration decreases a little but it was extra power i wound it out for a good 10 sec but the way it sounded at red line worried me

Thats the valve float, and your cue to back off the throttle.
 

wfc

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I have three genuine Honda motors that I regularly play around with. Two 8hp motors, and one 13hp. The two 8hp motors are on an offroad kart and motorbike respectively. I would like to add some personal experience to this question, as it may help others.

There are numerous mods that can be done to the Honda, clonda type engines. Removing the governor would propably be the first step, and in my case did add a slight power increase on its own, but nothing amazing. I dont have acess to a dyno, so just relaying how it feels when driving. I did however check the topspeed, and the removal of the governor did add a couple of mph.

There was no question of valve float at all. The next step was to advance the timing. Living all the way over in South Africa we dont get any of your nice add on performance parts, so I had to file down the key to be able to advance the flywheel timing to about 6 degrees. The results of advancing the timing was significantly better than just removing the governor. The motor was much more torquey, and acceleration improved significantly. Again there was a couple of mph diference in top speed, which would indicate an increase in overall rpm. There was no valve float with this modification either.

Next I took off the standard Honda exhaust, and built up my own free flowing one, capped off with a muffler from a big 12hp kohler that I had lying around. Besides it sounding a bit like a lawnmower, it actualy worked very well. Again there was an improvement in the seat of the pants power delivery, and throttle response was improved. Again there was no discernable valve float.

After all of this I got quite adventurous and pulled the head off to do some work on the ports. I propably spent about three hours working at it. I used the cheap option, a dowel with sandpaper wrapped around it to the right size fitted to a drill, and some round files. Smoothed out the finishes, and enlarged the ports slightly. Also increased the area where the gas curves towards the combustion chamber. I am sure that I may not have done the worlds best job at it, but once again the results were imediately evident. Better torque curve, developing power in a much wider rev range from much lower to quite a bit higher. Top speed again increased a little as measured with a gps on the go. There was still no perceptible valve float. The motor pulled strong all the way up to its max rpm, and could run there all day, and frequently does when me and the kids start playing around.

My las mod was to add the carb off of a 13hp honda to the gx240. Obviously it worked in conjunction with all of the other mods. The result is a motor which pulls like a freight train (compared to how it was initialy) We have our own track in our back yard.... big property, and in some of the places you cannot run full throttle anymore as the power just runs you right off the track.

After fitting the larger carb I have encountered some falve float, but only slightly. I can live with it for now. From spending much time on many forums I understand that I have propably reached the limit of what I can get from this motor without fitting a billet conrod. These are simply too expensive for me as your currency is currently worth 10 times what ours is. The motor is run extremely hard, often for hours on end, and it handles it all briliantly.

The modifications that I made are all within the grasp of the average guy, and they made a world of diference to the way the kart goes. It used to be a fun kart, now it is an adictive adrenalin rush. :biggrin5:
 

killawatt

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nice explain to me though what you were talking about with the flywheel? i didnt get the 6 degrees thing some pics would br great
 

wfc

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The position of the flywheel determines the timing of the engine. On these motors that is fixed, so you cannot adjust it to advance the timing. The position of the flywheel is determined by the flywheel key. To advance the Flywheel it needs to be rotated to a clockwise position (to the right) with the crank stationary. For you it may be the easiest to just buy an offset flywheel key. This will automaticaly advance the timing on your motor. Otherwise you can do what I did. The original key will remain in the crank when you remove the flywheel. leave it in position, and mark with a scribe on the lefthand side the line where the key enters the crank. When you remove the key you should see clearly a line dividing the exposed area of the key from the area that is inside the crank. now put the key in a bench vice so that the exposed area is visible but the rest is in the vice jaws. Take a small file or dremel and carefully work away about 0.045" I didnt have a micrometer or other fancy tool, I used a feeler guage to judge tee ammount removed. You are only removing metal from the exposed part of the key, make sure you remain square when filing. Now replace the key again with the filed down area to the left. If you now replace the flywheel you will feel that it can be slightly rotated to the right. Rotate it as far as possible to the right and then tighten the flywheel nut. The flywheel should be tightened to 60ft.-lbs. You timing will now be advanced about 6 degrees.
 

killawatt

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does that affect the life of the motor in any way and is there a website or link on how to do it or something on that offset flywheel key?
 

killawatt

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yea i have the two year thing with harbor frieght i just dont want it going out to soon you know looked on ebay for that offset flywheel key got nothing
 

wfc

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It is obviously true that modifying an engine will to some extent shorten the lifespan, but that hasn't stopped thousands of people from doing it anyway. There is just something about messing around with a motor, and feeling the difference when you first testdrive it after your hard work that is quite satisfying. It is one of those things you will have to work out for yourself, do I want reliability (not a bad choice), or do I want a bigger smile on my face (not a bad choice either).

If you do end up doing some mods to your motor, just make sure that you run with good quality oil, and change the oil more frequently.

I dont realy know where you can find an offset key, maybe you could try AGK at www.affordablegokarts.com
 

ZnsaneRyder

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Take the governor off the engine, it won't blow up.

I've held my engine full throttle @ 5000RPM doing 50mph on my bicycle, and have never blown it up. It seems like the internals are built well on these engines, as I've put LONG hours and several thousand miles on my Honda Clone, and just a sparkplug change, and it still runs good as new. I use my motorized trailer + bicycle as my regular transportation, and these clone engines are EXTREMELY reliable!

Being a go-kart doesn't get the long and hard hours of my ride, I'm sure a non-governed engine will survive just fine on your kart. Just back off the throttle a touch when you max it out.
 
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