Repair the stock motor or Predator 212cc?

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The Noose

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Hi everyone,
First off, I'm new and I'm probably going to ask dumb questions so forgive me in advance. I just recently bought my 8 year old a gokart and I desperately need some advice from people who actually know something. Any advice you guys can offer would be GREATLY appreciated.

So, this last weekend I bought a used Trailmaster 110 xrx (will post a pic as soon as I can find one.) for my 8 year old son. It's a year old. I got it for $350. Ran perfectly. Its a 3 speed plus reverse, electric start. My plan was to teach my son how to shift it, which I think he would have been able to handle easily.

Brought it home, my 8 year old was so happy he literally started crying. It was a special moment for me as a dad. I knew he wanted a go kart, but didn't know how much.

Anyway, I took him around the block a couple of times. No problems at all. My wife decided she wanted to take it for a lap. I explained to her that she would need to shift. She said she understood. Then she took off in first and floored it AND NEVER BOTHERED SHIFTING OUT OF FIRST. She went all the way around the block. The go kart died right when she pulled in to the driveway.

I'm about 80 percent sure she messed up the motor. I couldn't get it to start again. I replaced the spark plug, verified that I'm getting spark, gas seems to be getting to the carburetor. The compression seems really, really weak. I'm no mechanic, but if Im not feeling too optimistic.

Luckily, I have a brother that owns a hotrod shop that is willing to help me.
This is where I need some advice:

It appears the motor in this thing is a Chinese 110cc knock off. I think I can get parts for it from a place that sells these go karts not far from where I live (OKC).

My question is, should I try to fix the stock chinese 110cc motor, or would I be better off just replacing it with a brand new 212cc predator from harbor freight? Im thinking the HF motor would be simpler, plus it would be a 100 percent, guaranteed to work solution.

Of course, I would rather keep the electric start, the reverse capability, etc. I just don't know if it is worth fixing. If the motor is just a cheaply made piece of junk, I don't want to invest time and effort and most importantly a bunch of money into an inferior motor.

My brother has all the tools we need in his shop. He builds hotrods for a living, so I know for sure we will be able to make necessary modifications to the frame to install the predator motor if we go that route.

Then again, If the stock motor is realistically fixable for a reasonable price, and it isn't just complete junk, I'd love to get it running the way it was before my dufus wife got ahold of it.

What should I do? Cut my losses and just put a harbor freight motor on it and be done? Or should I see if I can get the stock engine rebuilt (if it's actually damaged)?
 

chancer

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I think that is an ATV type motor and the transmission is built in. So the predator engine will not work with your transmission. You probably could make it work. (Any thing is possible) but in your case it would be better to fix or buy new what you have.
 

landuse

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Welcome to the forum!!

It sounds like you have a GY6 type engine in your kart. I am pretty sure redlining it in first was not too good for it :D. Fortunately for you, there are a lot of cheap spares around for these engines. You can even buy one pretty cheap new.

If it were me, i would probably try fix up what you have, and if you cannot do that, then buy the same engine. This means it would just be a bolt on solution, and you won't have to do a lot of fabrication to try and get a predator to fit. The engine plate will have to be modified, and maybe some other stuff too. The GY6 also has a build in CVT (if i remember correctly). With a predator you don't have that

Post some pics of the kart, the engine etc for us to see what you have. Try find a name or serial number on the engine too. That way we can help you source parts. There are a few guys on here really knowledgeable on gy6 engines, so i think you will be ok.
 

The Noose

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http://oklahomacity.craigslist.org/snw/5140914730.html

I can't figure out how to post pics. Here is a link to the cl ad with pictures of the go-kart.

---------- Post added at 12:47 AM ---------- Previous post was at 12:46 AM ----------

I think that is an ATV type motor and the transmission is built in. So the predator engine will not work with your transmission. You probably could make it work. (Any thing is possible) but in your case it would be better to fix or buy new what you have.

Yeah, if I go with the predator, I'm going to get rid of everything. Just the predator with clutch. Go and stop sort of thing.

---------- Post added at 12:55 AM ---------- Previous post was at 12:47 AM ----------

Welcome to the forum!!

It sounds like you have a GY6 type engine in your kart. I am pretty sure redlining it in first was not too good for it :D. Fortunately for you, there are a lot of cheap spares around for these engines. You can even buy one pretty cheap new.

If it were me, i would probably try fix up what you have, and if you cannot do that, then buy the same engine. This means it would just be a bolt on solution, and you won't have to do a lot of fabrication to try and get a predator to fit. The engine plate will have to be modified, and maybe some other stuff too. The GY6 also has a build in CVT (if i remember correctly). With a predator you don't have that

Post some pics of the kart, the engine etc for us to see what you have. Try find a name or serial number on the engine too. That way we can help you source parts. There are a few guys on here really knowledgeable on gy6 engines, so i think you will be ok.

I will take some pics of the motor and stuff tomorrow and see if I can post them From everything I've read, I think you are spot on about the type of motor.

It was manufactured by taizhou trail blazer manufacturing in china. Imported by powers sports llc.

I have a parts manual for it, I just don't know how to post it.

---------- Post added at 12:58 AM ---------- Previous post was at 12:55 AM ----------

Thanks guys, btw. I know you don't have to help an Internet stranger, so I appreciate the advice.
 

landuse

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HERE is a thread on how to post pics.

If you do go the predator route you will have to get a torque converter, not a centrifugal clutch. The cost of both might be the same as a new gy6
 

The Noose

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update: Pulled the head out of the motor. The valves were bent, the spark plug hole was stripped. The cylinder was basically melted. The piston was half melted, the rings were shot.

Decided to go ahead and order a new motor. The guy at the parts department at Sooner Power Sports in OKC is ordering the motor for me. Going to cost 300 bucks. Should be a drop in replacement.

All things told, I will have spent 650 plus some elbow grease. Should be a nice little kart. Thanks everyone for your suggestions and advice.
 

chancer

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Can we see some pics of the destroyed motor and melted parts. Don't know why but that kind if stuff is cool to me. :devil2:
 

OzFab

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Before you go ahead & order a complete engine (I'm probably too late for that though) make some enquiries about just the top end (piston, rings, jug & head), it may work out cheaper & easier...

Also, AFAIK, complete 125cc top end conversion kits are available...

It's a high probability the engine was on it's last legs when you bought it, your wife just "finished it off"; a few months ago, I bought a garden edge trimmer; it started & ran (rough) when I brought it home but, a few days later, it wouldn't start at all; turns out the rings were just holding on enough to let it start & run just one more time...
 

The Noose

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Can we see some pics of the destroyed motor and melted parts. Don't know why but that kind if stuff is cool to me. :devil2:

Sure can. I'll take some pics tomorrow and post em.

---------- Post added at 10:12 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:47 AM ----------

Before you go ahead & order a complete engine (I'm probably too late for that though) make some enquiries about just the top end (piston, rings, jug & head), it may work out cheaper & easier...

Also, AFAIK, complete 125cc top end conversion kits are available...

It's a high probability the engine was on it's last legs when you bought it, your wife just "finished it off"; a few months ago, I bought a garden edge trimmer; it started & ran (rough) when I brought it home but, a few days later, it wouldn't start at all; turns out the rings were just holding on enough to let it start & run just one more time...

I considered this, but here is my thought process:

Since there was such extensive damage to the piston, jug, valves, etc. there is a good chance that once I open up the crank case I'm going to find other things damaged. Since I'm not very experienced rebuilding motors (I have exactly 0 experience in fact), I'd be willing to bet I'm gonna do some stuff wrong. I might save a hundred bucks by rebuilding the damaged engine, but then I'm gambling on my ability to do it correctly. There is just as good a chance that I buy 250 dollars worth of parts and never get it working right. Not to mention all the hours of work I'd put into trying to figure it out.

Buying the whole new engine eliminates a lot of potential errors on my end, and has a much higher likelihood of working.

The other thing is that looking down in the crank case, it looked like someone dumped Goldschlauger down into it! Lol All the bits and chunks of metal that use to be the piston would have to be cleaned out of there (I assume anyway). Honestly, I don't trust myself to get it put back together right if I had to take it all the way apart.

You may be right about the motor being on its way out though. Of course, the motor was manufactured in 2014, so it's not too old, but being used, there's no telling what that motor has gone through before I got it.

I don't know. I will have $650 total in the gokart when all is said and done. Considering it will have a brand new engine that's actually bigger than the stock engine (putting a 125cc in instead of the 110cc) I think I still got a pretty decent deal.

---------- Post added at 10:17 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:12 AM ----------

Is that a Hammer Head?

No, it's a Trailmaster 110 xrx. From what I can tell it's the same thing as the "mid" xrx, except it has the semi auto transmission instead of the full auto transmission that the mid model has.
 

OzFab

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I considered this, but here is my thought process:

Since there was such extensive damage to the piston, jug, valves, etc. there is a good chance that once I open up the crank case I'm going to find other things damaged. Since I'm not very experienced rebuilding motors (I have exactly 0 experience in fact), I'd be willing to bet I'm gonna do some stuff wrong. I might save a hundred bucks by rebuilding the damaged engine, but then I'm gambling on my ability to do it correctly. There is just as good a chance that I buy 250 dollars worth of parts and never get it working right. Not to mention all the hours of work I'd put into trying to figure it out.

Buying the whole new engine eliminates a lot of potential errors on my end, and has a much higher likelihood of working.

The other thing is that looking down in the crank case, it looked like someone dumped Goldschlauger down into it! Lol All the bits and chunks of metal that use to be the piston would have to be cleaned out of there (I assume anyway). Honestly, I don't trust myself to get it put back together right if I had to take it all the way apart.

Fair point...
 

afremont

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Wow, that's pretty nice for $380. You should see what you have to pay for anything anywhere near that nice in houston. It'd be twice that much. Basic carts without suspension sell for $400 to $600 if they're running and usable. Anything under $300 is a POS for the most part and needs a bunch of work.

---------- Post added at 08:18 AM ---------- Previous post was at 07:44 AM ----------

This should make my point. Such a deal, huh?
http://houston.craigslist.org/snw/5150244738.html

Here's another beauty
http://houston.craigslist.org/snw/5147133988.html
 

afremont

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Yeah, there's some nice ones, but like I said they want a ton of money for them. Two of the ones you linked to don't have any suspension. The OP got a decent cart for under $400, the cheapest one you linked is $550 and the only one with suspension is $850. That's just too rich for my blood.

One of the best deals that I found is this one.
http://houston.craigslist.org/snw/5150389639.html

That could be turned into a decent enough kart for less than $300 total I think.

I found one that has a beat up Stage 2 Predator and the guy is claiming that the motor is worth $700 by itself. I disagree. Actually here it is:
http://houston.craigslist.org/snw/5118477117.html
I just can't see paying $700 for that, but maybe I'm expecting too much. Most things I find under $400 can't even be ridden, much less electric start, shifter, reverse etc. Anything in that league is over $1000.
 
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