Predator 420 vs 212

GCC

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What would be the advantage of using a Predator 420 engine rather than a Predator 212? The gocart I am building is a 2 seater to be used by the grandkids in the field.
 

SquidBonez

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420 has more power and torque out of the box. Would be good for a large go kart or mini buggy. If you're really serious about going fast, you can certainly modify the 212 to put out comparable power to a stock 420 all the while revving way higher (way more top speed) for a similar price point.
- Stock 420cc (13HP/18FT-LBS) w/ 40 series TAV = $750
- Stage 2 212cc (15HP/roughly 15FT-LBS) w/ Juggernaut 30 series TAV = $740
But since you mentioned it's for your grandkids I doubt you want to go crazy with top speed.
 

chimmike

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420 has more power and torque out of the box. Would be good for a large go kart or mini buggy. If you're really serious about going fast, you can certainly modify the 212 to put out comparable power to a stock 420 all the while revving way higher (way more top speed) for a similar price point.
- Stock 420cc (13HP/18FT-LBS) w/ 40 series TAV = $750
- Stage 2 212cc (15HP/roughly 15FT-LBS) w/ Juggernaut 30 series TAV = $740
But since you mentioned it's for your grandkids I doubt you want to go crazy with top speed.

can the 420 be similarly modded, though?
 

Kent

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IMHO there is no advantage using a 420 for your application. Do you want your grandkids flipping the kart or cruising at 40 plus MPH on a gokart?? The electric start is a nice feature but that can be easily added to a 212. One more thing to consider is if this will be used as a yard kart you probably will want/need suspension unless they are riding on very smooth ground. Any anomalies in the yard will beat the kids and the kart up badly. Good luck on the kart, let us know how it comes out.
 

SquidBonez

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can the 420 be similarly modded, though?
Of course, but modding a big block gets expensive real quick. For the price of a stock big block and applicable transmission, you could have a small block that outperforms it. Similar power/torque but way more RPM (and less weight). More RPM means more top speed OR the ability to gear even lower than usual for more torque while still retaining the same speed. The latter is a huge benefit off road.
 

madprofessor

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I agree with the 212 folks completely. Only the electric start and lights are any advantage over a juiced up 212, and that can be put on. My own 212 is juiced up to 15+hp. transmitted through a cheap CVT to a live axle.
A huge win for juicing the 212 is the use of a billet connecting rod to replace the OEM rod. It will practically guarantee reliability from the engine due to its modified oil scoop arm (that's scoop, not splash) that's also bored through to the rod bearing, guarantees to keep it slippery. If an OEM engine fails, it'll probably be by breaking off the rod's oil splash arm and lunching the rod.
You can have the added bonus of ordering your rod .020" over stock length for more compression, and the hi-perf gasket set you order for sealing it all back up can come with a thinner .012" stainless steel head gasket for more compression coming the other way. So many different ways to juice a 212, that's only a small portion.
As for the lack of a magneto to power a battery for lights, I didn't put a magneto coil in mine. I got a 9600mah lithium-ion battery pack from Ebay for $30 to fun my 70 watts of headlights, Harley bullet tail/brake lights, stereo system, etc. Recharges with an extension cord to an external plug.
$99 for a 212 on sale off of $129 regular price, $322 from my hi-perf guy in N.C. for juicing it up to 15+hp., and a $53 Chinese CVT to push a 520 lb. kart. Scalded dog. Raped ape. Cooler than a skint d__k with sunglasses.
 

SquidBonez

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I agree with the 212 folks completely. Only the electric start and lights are any advantage over a juiced up 212, and that can be put on. My own 212 is juiced up to 15+hp. transmitted through a cheap CVT to a live axle.
A huge win for juicing the 212 is the use of a billet connecting rod to replace the OEM rod. It will practically guarantee reliability from the engine due to its modified oil scoop arm (that's scoop, not splash) that's also bored through to the rod bearing, guarantees to keep it slippery. If an OEM engine fails, it'll probably be by breaking off the rod's oil splash arm and lunching the rod.
You can have the added bonus of ordering your rod .020" over stock length for more compression, and the hi-perf gasket set you order for sealing it all back up can come with a thinner .012" stainless steel head gasket for more compression coming the other way. So many different ways to juice a 212, that's only a small portion.
As for the lack of a magneto to power a battery for lights, I didn't put a magneto coil in mine. I got a 9600mah lithium-ion battery pack from Ebay for $30 to fun my 70 watts of headlights, Harley bullet tail/brake lights, stereo system, etc. Recharges with an extension cord to an external plug.
$99 for a 212 on sale off of $129 regular price, $322 from my hi-perf guy in N.C. for juicing it up to 15+hp., and a $53 Chinese CVT to push a 520 lb. kart. Scalded dog. Raped ape. Cooler than a skint d__k with sunglasses.
Any pics of this kart? What's the top speed?
 

madprofessor

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Just noticed this post again here 1 day post-Trump. Pics attached, but top end unknown as attempts to test have found problems before I could get it off the patio. For instance, used heaviest gokart tierods (3/8") suppliers sell, and snapped one in two. So just finishing up making all new ones, 5/8" allthread sleeved with 1/2" EMT thinwall conduit, 5/8" x 2.25" allthread couplings for adjustment, etc. Pics show original setup. Missing flag paintings done now, Cuervo Gold and O.J. dispensers in dash finished, other stuff, ready to test soon. Also adding a pic of previous 212 build on an all-custom minibike build, that one about 12 hp. .
 

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madprofessor

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Just ran the calculator on my 12" tall tires, 5:1 gear ratio, and my theoretical 7,200 rpm's, as if it was straight chains, no CVT. Comes up about 51 mph. Add on to that the higher top end provided by the CVT ("torque converter") and it gets real scary. All depends on if I can really get that 7,200 rpm's the motor was built for.
 
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