Powerland 420cc GAB 2.0
- Thread starter bob58o
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bob58o
SuckSqueezeBangBlow
I know it does. I have a 390 carb on my 212. I could make the linkage myself if I didn't want an extended break in period with the governor.
My head is all over the place these days. I may need to adjust the governor arm, or maybe I just need to sleep and look at it again tomorrow.
KartFab's vid for gx390 throttle set up with gov
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IPsZp7b8sYk
KartFab
Active member
It does that on startup so the engine actually starts. Shouldn't do that at idle though. Governor only starts working in the correct position after engine is running.
bob58o
SuckSqueezeBangBlow
So I played around with the governor a bit.
AS IT WAS....
(not running)
I could not see anyway how the carb would open up all the way. 3/4 of full throttle maybe.
With only the solid rod connecting the gov. arm to the carb (spring disconnected), the butterfly WILL close all the way. With the rod and spring connected, even with the throttle lever in the idle position, the spring pulls the butterfly open about 1/4 of the way.
SO I ADJUSTED THE GOVERNOR ARM....
I loosened the nut that holds the gov. arm to the part of the gov. that extends down into the block (GOV. SHAFT). I rotated the gov. arm so that the butterfly opened all the way. Then I rotated the gov. shaft in the same direction I rotated the arm to open the butterfly, and then tightened the nut back up.
AS IT IS NOW....
Moving the throttle lever WILL open the butterfly all the way.
Allowing the throttle lever to return to idle will close the butterfly completely IF THE SPRING IS DISCONNECTED AND ONLY THE SOLID ROD IS CONNECTING THE GOV. ARM TO THE CARB.
IF THE SOLID ROD AND SPRING ARE CONNECTED, then the spring still pulls the butterfly open 1/4 of full throttle when the throttle lever is in the idle position and the engine is not running.
SO MY QUESTIONS ARE ...
DOES THIS SOUND CORRECT????
HOW DOES THE BUTTERFLY EVER CLOSE ALL THE WAY???
IS THAT SPRING NEEDED??????????
AS IT WAS....
(not running)
I could not see anyway how the carb would open up all the way. 3/4 of full throttle maybe.
With only the solid rod connecting the gov. arm to the carb (spring disconnected), the butterfly WILL close all the way. With the rod and spring connected, even with the throttle lever in the idle position, the spring pulls the butterfly open about 1/4 of the way.
SO I ADJUSTED THE GOVERNOR ARM....
I loosened the nut that holds the gov. arm to the part of the gov. that extends down into the block (GOV. SHAFT). I rotated the gov. arm so that the butterfly opened all the way. Then I rotated the gov. shaft in the same direction I rotated the arm to open the butterfly, and then tightened the nut back up.
AS IT IS NOW....
Moving the throttle lever WILL open the butterfly all the way.
Allowing the throttle lever to return to idle will close the butterfly completely IF THE SPRING IS DISCONNECTED AND ONLY THE SOLID ROD IS CONNECTING THE GOV. ARM TO THE CARB.
IF THE SOLID ROD AND SPRING ARE CONNECTED, then the spring still pulls the butterfly open 1/4 of full throttle when the throttle lever is in the idle position and the engine is not running.
SO MY QUESTIONS ARE ...
DOES THIS SOUND CORRECT????
HOW DOES THE BUTTERFLY EVER CLOSE ALL THE WAY???
IS THAT SPRING NEEDED??????????
bob58o
SuckSqueezeBangBlow
Attachments
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governor-adjust.jpg -
governor-spring-renamed-19345.jpg
bob58o
SuckSqueezeBangBlow
BREAK IN PERIOD
I guess My engine break in will be like this.
First start.
No load.
5 minutes at 1800 RPM.
Allow the engine to return to COLD.
Re-torque head bolts.
Second start.
No load.
60 minutes varying engine speed from 1800 - 2500 RPM (5 minutes at one speed, then change)
Allow the engine to return to COLD.
Change Oil.
Third start.
No load.
60 minutes varying engine speed from 1800 - 2500 RPM.
Allow the engine to return to COLD.
Forth Start.
TC connected to Axle, Rear ended jacked off the ground, Wheels free to spin.
60 minutes varying engine speed from 1800 - 2500 RPM.
Allow the engine to return to cold.
Change Oil.
Fifth start (actual driving)
30 minutes of actual driving.
No more than half throttle.
Short bursts of Acceleration.
Allow engine to cool
Sixth Start.
30 minutes of harder driving.
Shorts bursts of full throttle acceleration.
Done.
???????
I know this debated is about as unsettled as karting debates go.
Load vs No - Load. Easy break in vs Ride it hard break in. Constantly change RPMs or set the throttle and walk away.
"It'll be fine"
---------- Post added at 05:05 AM ---------- Previous post was at 05:02 AM ----------
Going to see If I can get the first THREE starts today.
That is two hours of run time.
Then I'll try to get the JS welded and bolted in place tomorrow and see if I can get get the FORTH start and third hour of run time tomorrow.
After that, It will be time for some actual driving with real load.
I guess My engine break in will be like this.
First start.
No load.
5 minutes at 1800 RPM.
Allow the engine to return to COLD.
Re-torque head bolts.
Second start.
No load.
60 minutes varying engine speed from 1800 - 2500 RPM (5 minutes at one speed, then change)
Allow the engine to return to COLD.
Change Oil.
Third start.
No load.
60 minutes varying engine speed from 1800 - 2500 RPM.
Allow the engine to return to COLD.
Forth Start.
TC connected to Axle, Rear ended jacked off the ground, Wheels free to spin.
60 minutes varying engine speed from 1800 - 2500 RPM.
Allow the engine to return to cold.
Change Oil.
Fifth start (actual driving)
30 minutes of actual driving.
No more than half throttle.
Short bursts of Acceleration.
Allow engine to cool
Sixth Start.
30 minutes of harder driving.
Shorts bursts of full throttle acceleration.
Done.
???????
I know this debated is about as unsettled as karting debates go.
Load vs No - Load. Easy break in vs Ride it hard break in. Constantly change RPMs or set the throttle and walk away.
"It'll be fine"
---------- Post added at 05:05 AM ---------- Previous post was at 05:02 AM ----------
Going to see If I can get the first THREE starts today.
That is two hours of run time.
Then I'll try to get the JS welded and bolted in place tomorrow and see if I can get get the FORTH start and third hour of run time tomorrow.
After that, It will be time for some actual driving with real load.
bob58o
SuckSqueezeBangBlow
1.16 quarts or 37 fl oz of conventional 10W-30 oil.
I plan on at least one oil change today after the initial oil fill, so I'll need just over two quarts.
---------- Post added at 07:50 AM ---------- Previous post was at 07:48 AM ----------
Got to find a return spring for the throttle.
Got to get (or borrow from a Predator, I think they are interchangeable) the cable stop and cable housing clamp to attach a throttle cable to the throttle plate.
Unlike the Predator 212, the PD420 does not have the necessary hardware to attach a cable.
The holes are there, but I need to obtain the clamp and stop.
---------- Post added at 08:08 AM ---------- Previous post was at 07:50 AM ----------
Bolted on the Driver Unit.
I used two fender washers. Like I suspected they started to collapse when I torqued to 25 ft lbs.
---------- Post added at 08:12 AM ---------- Previous post was at 08:08 AM ----------
Torqued the sparked plug. 20 ft lbs. Indexing washer put open side of the plug right between the intake and exhaust valves.
"Hit the one in the Middle"
I plan on at least one oil change today after the initial oil fill, so I'll need just over two quarts.
---------- Post added at 07:50 AM ---------- Previous post was at 07:48 AM ----------
Got to find a return spring for the throttle.
Got to get (or borrow from a Predator, I think they are interchangeable) the cable stop and cable housing clamp to attach a throttle cable to the throttle plate.
Unlike the Predator 212, the PD420 does not have the necessary hardware to attach a cable.
The holes are there, but I need to obtain the clamp and stop.
---------- Post added at 08:08 AM ---------- Previous post was at 07:50 AM ----------
Bolted on the Driver Unit.
I used two fender washers. Like I suspected they started to collapse when I torqued to 25 ft lbs.
---------- Post added at 08:12 AM ---------- Previous post was at 08:08 AM ----------
Torqued the sparked plug. 20 ft lbs. Indexing washer put open side of the plug right between the intake and exhaust valves.
"Hit the one in the Middle"
Mr. Spindle
Senior Member
Ooooh, this sounds exiting... it's like an experiment, "is it going to blow up or not?"
bob58o
SuckSqueezeBangBlow
There is such an experiment going on. But in another thread.
I got 20 saying the plastic governor gear fails before 25 hrs at 4800 RPM in a 212cc Predator.
Come on Boom!
---------- Post added at 09:32 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:10 AM ----------
I think your saying that this set up is correct and once the engine is running, the butterfly should be able to close all the way.
We shall find out.
bob58o
SuckSqueezeBangBlow
What happens when If I replace the spring with a paper clip or solid wire????
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AnrT7fOuMPk
---------- Post added at 03:12 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:10 PM ----------
Good Day Sir.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HaoySOGlZ_U
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AnrT7fOuMPk
---------- Post added at 03:12 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:10 PM ----------
Good Day Sir.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HaoySOGlZ_U
chancer
ɔ ɥ ɐ u ɔ ǝ ɹ
I believe this is what you were looking for:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M5QGkOGZubQ
I have used that line on my kids since they were babies! lol. They about Schlit themselves when they saw it in the Movie for the first time!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M5QGkOGZubQ
I have used that line on my kids since they were babies! lol. They about Schlit themselves when they saw it in the Movie for the first time!
bob58o
SuckSqueezeBangBlow
Just gave it about 15 pulls with no fuel.
Lil bit of an oil pre splash.
Going to add gas.
Give it a few more pulls to prime the chamber.
Turn it on and let it rip.
I'll get video. I post it if it starts.
First starts after rebuilds rarely go well for me.
Wonder what I forgot this time????
Lil bit of an oil pre splash.
Going to add gas.
Give it a few more pulls to prime the chamber.
Turn it on and let it rip.
I'll get video. I post it if it starts.
First starts after rebuilds rarely go well for me.
Wonder what I forgot this time????
Jrgunn5150
Rudderless
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That's why I just take them out of the box and run them lol, good luck.
bob58o
SuckSqueezeBangBlow
Smells like clay.
Wondering if the exhaust needs to be cured?
Would it still be shiny if it was cured?
Maybe some clay still on the side of the piston.
Some popping at low speed.
The gov set up can't be right.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=GlgYiLfs96w
---------- Post added at 09:01 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:47 PM ----------
Jets need to be bigger?
30degrees tonight
Wondering if the exhaust needs to be cured?
Would it still be shiny if it was cured?
Maybe some clay still on the side of the piston.
Some popping at low speed.
The gov set up can't be right.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=GlgYiLfs96w
---------- Post added at 09:01 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:47 PM ----------
Jets need to be bigger?
30degrees tonight
bob58o
SuckSqueezeBangBlow
So Doctor, why the smoke?
The paint on the exhaust seemed a bit tacky still. Could that be the source?
I eyeballed 1.125 qts of oil out of the 5 qt jug. Seemed perfect on the dipstick. So I doubt there was too much oil in it.
I may have not torqued the exhaust on enough. It was a strange fit and I don't remember how tight I got it.
Maybe I broke it installing the head bolts?
Or should I expect some smoke on initial break in????
I was trying to put my hand on the head to check or abnormal head temps, then I realized I don't know what normal head temps feel like with my hand because I try to not touch hot engines with parts of my body.
Any guesses are much appreciated.
The paint on the exhaust seemed a bit tacky still. Could that be the source?
I eyeballed 1.125 qts of oil out of the 5 qt jug. Seemed perfect on the dipstick. So I doubt there was too much oil in it.
I may have not torqued the exhaust on enough. It was a strange fit and I don't remember how tight I got it.
Maybe I broke it installing the head bolts?
Or should I expect some smoke on initial break in????
I was trying to put my hand on the head to check or abnormal head temps, then I realized I don't know what normal head temps feel like with my hand because I try to not touch hot engines with parts of my body.
Any guesses are much appreciated.
bob58o
SuckSqueezeBangBlow
So the main jet on the GoPowerSport's kit is 0.046".
The pilot jet I was using was drilled two sizes bigger.
I'm using fresh 93 octane.
35 degrees and 70% Humidity.
AR3923 spark plug.
Stock Timing.
10.6:1 static compression.
I've decided it is probably the header paint. That is smoking. It is the best case scenario (I think) so that is what I am going with.
I'll make sure the exhaust is on tight as well.
Heading back over to my buddy's house to see if I can get this running better. I want to run it for 10 minutes then cool for 10 minutes. Run for 20, cool for 20. That is the curing process for VHT paint.
Let's see if I can get this to idle. I may have to keep the choke on, but didn't want it too rich during break in. Think I read too much fuel is bad during the break in process for some reason. I may need to go up one size on each. Figure Chicago is colder than Texas?
The pilot jet I was using was drilled two sizes bigger.
I'm using fresh 93 octane.
35 degrees and 70% Humidity.
AR3923 spark plug.
Stock Timing.
10.6:1 static compression.
I've decided it is probably the header paint. That is smoking. It is the best case scenario (I think) so that is what I am going with.
I'll make sure the exhaust is on tight as well.
Heading back over to my buddy's house to see if I can get this running better. I want to run it for 10 minutes then cool for 10 minutes. Run for 20, cool for 20. That is the curing process for VHT paint.
Let's see if I can get this to idle. I may have to keep the choke on, but didn't want it too rich during break in. Think I read too much fuel is bad during the break in process for some reason. I may need to go up one size on each. Figure Chicago is colder than Texas?
Flyinhillbilly
The great cornholio
Looked like the header paint burning to me, if it's tacky then that's pretty much confirmation in my mind. As far as the idle goes, I have no idea and am sure interested in what fixes it.
bob58o
SuckSqueezeBangBlow
It idles fine now.
Some popping when giving it throttle with no load, but maybe that is expected???
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=SirmzSW2ZR4
Some popping when giving it throttle with no load, but maybe that is expected???
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=SirmzSW2ZR4
Flyinhillbilly
The great cornholio
Awesome. I'm looking forward to a ride report on this one.
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