New Carb?

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devino246

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Nitrogen becomes unstable around 2500*f and combines to form NOx. Car engines have(or had) valves to recirculate a small amount of exhaust back into the combustion chamber during peak NOx production times (partial throttle) to cool the combustion chamber. Those valves are called EGR valves, btw. Not really sure small engines get as hot as car engines.

And yep, TS got it right.
 

Badot

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Ah, sorry, catalytic converters completely slipped my mind. :oops:

Not to threadjack, but I want under the impression that recirculating the exhaust just caused the fuel/air to burn slower so the stuff burning didn't reach such a high peak temp rather than actually cooling the chamber... It makes more sense to me at least, but is that wrong?
 

devino246

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Ah, sorry, catalytic converters completely slipped my mind. :oops:

Not to threadjack, but I want under the impression that recirculating the exhaust just caused the fuel/air to burn slower so the stuff burning didn't reach such a high peak temp rather than actually cooling the chamber... It makes more sense to me at least, but is that wrong?

I believe it actually cools the chamber.
 

Doc Sprocket

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For emission control, recirculating exhaust gas helps burn off fuel that did not thoroughly burn off the first time through. I believe it helps cook off some other pollutants, too.
 

devino246

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For emission control, recirculating exhaust gas helps burn off fuel that did not thoroughly burn off the first time through. I believe it helps cook off some other pollutants, too.

Thats what the cat does. There isnt enough exhaust entering the combustion chamber to put much of a dent in hydrocarbon emissions.
 

Doc Sprocket

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Dang- there's no emoticon for throwing your hands out, palms up, in an "I dunno" gesture... I was taught that in high school- I believe it;s in one of my textbooks, too. Beats me. BUT-

Don't believe everything you read on the 'net!

What was this thread supposed to me about, again?:worried2::huh:
 

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Oh god I think I've opened up a can of worms

From the wiki, some parts omitted (...):

"EGR in spark-ignited engines

The exhaust gas, added to the fuel, oxygen, and combustion products, increases the specific heat capacity of the cylinder contents, which lowers the adiabatic flame temperature.

...Although EGR does measurably slow combustion, this can largely be compensated for by advancing spark timing...A properly operating EGR can theoretically increase the efficiency of gasoline engines via several mechanisms:

...
- Reduced heat rejection. Lowered peak combustion temperatures not only reduces NOx formation, it also reduces the loss of thermal energy to combustion chamber surfaces, leaving more available for conversion to mechanical work during the expansion stroke.
- Reduced chemical dissociation. The lower peak temperatures result in more of the released energy remaining as sensible energy near TDC, rather than being bound up (early in the expansion stroke) in the dissociation of combustion products. This effect is minor compared to the first two.

It also decreases the efficiency of gasoline engines via at least one more mechanism:

- Reduced specific heat ratio. A lean intake charge has a higher specific heat ratio than an EGR mixture. A reduction of specific heat ratio reduces the amount of energy that can be extracted by the piston.

... The EGR valve also cools the exhaust valves and makes them last far longer (a very important benefit under light cruise conditions)[citation needed]

--------

So what I'm getting from that is that it lowers peak combustion temps. The only thing I'm seeing that it says the exhaust directly cools in the exhaust valves.
 

devino246

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"Because NOx forms primarily when a mixture of nitrogen and oxygen is subjected to high temperature, the lower combustion chamber temperatures caused by EGR reduces the amount of NOx the combustion generates."

Not to get in a argument, just making sure we have it right. I may very well be wrong, but everything Ive read indicates lower CC temps.
 
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