Harbor Freight Engine Swap Help

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Karty2000

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Looking to change out my Yerf 3203 engine with a HF Predator.

The cart is stock and I believe this is a bolt in replacement?

http://www.harborfreight.com/65-hp-212cc-ohv-horizontal-shaft-gas-engine-epa-69730.html

If specific pictures would help let me know. Thanks for putting up with a newbie.

Specific questions:

-For the 3203 Yerfdog, what size drive shaft bolt will I need?
-Does the pull start NEED to be rewound or is it just easier if you do?
-Some people seem to struggle with the throttle when they replace an engine...Is there anything specific I should look out for?
-Any other hints/tips/concerns?

Thanks
 

Karty2000

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I should add that one of the reasons I'm looking to replace the engine is because, even at very low idle, it jumps and creeps forwards. The belt seems loose enough but am going to check to make sure the right one is on there...wouldn't want to buy an engine and find out it was creeping due to the belt being incorrect.


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machinist@large

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Looking to change out my Yerf 3203 engine with a HF Predator.

The cart is stock and I believe this is a bolt in replacement?

http://www.harborfreight.com/65-hp-212cc-ohv-horizontal-shaft-gas-engine-epa-69730.html

If specific pictures would help let me know. Thanks for putting up with a newbie.

Specific questions:

-For the 3203 Yerfdog, what size drive shaft bolt will I need?
-Does the pull start NEED to be rewound or is it just easier if you do?
-Some people seem to struggle with the throttle when they replace an engine...Is there anything specific I should look out for?
-Any other hints/tips/concerns?

Thanks

I should add that one of the reasons I'm looking to replace the engine is because, even at very low idle, it jumps and creeps forwards. The belt seems loose enough but am going to check to make sure the right one is on there...wouldn't want to buy an engine and find out it was creeping due to the belt being incorrect.


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:welcome2:

You've got CVT issues, not the engine. And yes we will need photos to help you out. And as you have an iPhone, the on board camera will be up to the task. Just make sure to take them in good lighting, and from multiple angles.

And if possible, try to load the photos at high resolution; my phone automatically defaults to the lowest resolution setting, which turn's a photo into some weird form of abstract art.

To upload photos, scroll down the post page until you get to manage attachments; click on that, and the rest should be self explanatory, (and hopefully will upload in the most favored thumbnail format). :thumbsup:
 

Karty2000

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:welcome2:

You've got CVT issues, not the engine. And yes we will need photos to help you out. And as you have an iPhone, the on board camera will be up to the task. Just make sure to take them in good lighting, and from multiple angles.

And if possible, try to load the photos at high resolution; my phone automatically defaults to the lowest resolution setting, which turn's a photo into some weird form of abstract art.

To upload photos, scroll down the post page until you get to manage attachments; click on that, and the rest should be self explanatory, (and hopefully will upload in the most favored thumbnail format). :thumbsup:

Welp, after fixing the CVT issue (THANK YOU!) it was working great. Then is started to stall after idling for a while and tonight it stalled and when I went to pull start it the rope pulled out. ugh! I decided to pull the air filter on a hunch that something else was going on and noticed gas in the filter...

I think I'm back to putting a predator engine in the thing and be done with this old engine!!
 

Zombient

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Those Hemi 6.5 Predators are pretty peppy. I picked up one during their outdoor sale, gonna put it on my rat-kart.

I have the Yerf-Dog that's right below yours. Basically the same, but no back shocks.

I'm sticking a 13hp, modded to 15-16hp on that death trap.
 

Karty2000

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Those Hemi 6.5 Predators are pretty peppy. I picked up one during their outdoor sale, gonna put it on my rat-kart.

I have the Yerf-Dog that's right below yours. Basically the same, but no back shocks.

I'm sticking a 13hp, modded to 15-16hp on that death trap.


Lol. Yeah, it needs to be reasonably safe for my kids so for now just the 6.5!! Seems really plug and play with the 3203. Digging around it sounds like some people have some idle issues etc out of the box so hoping I don't!!


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itsid

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Then is started to stall after idling for a while and tonight it stalled and when I went to pull start it the rope pulled out. ugh! I decided to pull the air filter on a hunch that something else was going on and noticed gas in the filter...

I think I'm back to putting a predator engine in the thing and be done with this old engine!!

stalling is likely an issue with your carb being clogged;
a bit of carb cleaning sets you back maybe 10 bucks (worst case)
generally it's just a bit of time you need to spend.

It's even possible that it's not a dirty carb at all, just a too rich mix (can be fixed by turning a screw)

And the rope can be replaced in a matter of minutes...
Personally.. a good running engine should NOT be replaced at all.
a predator is cheap, I agree.. but frankly... why buy something new you already have and can use.

Installing a new predator is about the same amount of work as it is 'repairing' your current engine...
the major difference is you need to spend another 80-90 bucks!

Your choice of course... but frankly I wouldn't!

OH, the air filter btw... that's likely oil, not gasoline.
foam filters are soaked (and just squeezed out) with engine oil,
that's normal.. to verify just post a pic of your engine and filter;
but I'm quite certain you'll have a foam filter ;)

'sid
 

Karty2000

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stalling is likely an issue with your carb being clogged;
a bit of carb cleaning sets you back maybe 10 bucks (worst case)
generally it's just a bit of time you need to spend.

It's even possible that it's not a dirty carb at all, just a too rich mix (can be fixed by turning a screw)

And the rope can be replaced in a matter of minutes...
Personally.. a good running engine should NOT be replaced at all.
a predator is cheap, I agree.. but frankly... why buy something new you already have and can use.

Installing a new predator is about the same amount of work as it is 'repairing' your current engine...
the major difference is you need to spend another 80-90 bucks!

Your choice of course... but frankly I wouldn't!

OH, the air filter btw... that's likely oil, not gasoline.
foam filters are soaked (and just squeezed out) with engine oil,
that's normal.. to verify just post a pic of your engine and filter;
but I'm quite certain you'll have a foam filter ;)

'sid


the carb is brand new. Cleaned it, drained gas and added a fuel filter last week. Air filter REEKS of gasoline and there is gas in the air filter 'area' (area was literally wet with gas).

Engine is original and since I'm bringing it to our vacation home where I prefer not to work on it much, I'm thinking for 90 bucks a new engine is the right choice. Maybe not. Need to think about it.


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thisismyusername

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the carb is brand new. Cleaned it, drained gas and added a fuel filter last week. Air filter REEKS of gasoline and there is gas in the air filter 'area' (area was literally wet with gas).

Engine is original and since I'm bringing it to our vacation home where I prefer not to work on it much, I'm thinking for 90 bucks a new engine is the right choice. Maybe not. Need to think about it.


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Just wanted to let you know if you didnt know, the air filter has oil on it by default, so what you are thinking is gas could just be oil. If you decide to clean your air filter you will need to re-oil it.

Also if you're wondering the bolt size for the pto shaft on the predator it is 5/16 -24, and probably about 1/2 and inch long. Also if you dont already know, which it seems lots of people dont, the shaft will not take a 5/16 bolt, it needs a 5/16 -24 which means that the bolt is fine threaded. You could easily order one online or just go to your local ace or some thing, but some stores like home depot, etc, dont carry fine threaded. I think lowes does though...

Now the engine does not need to be re wound, but if it is placed with a seat in front of it, its going to be impossible to start, :lolgoku::lolgoku:

The preadator has to be the easiest engine to connect a throttle to. It will take you 2 minutes. There is a nut with a hole in it, and a screw in the top, you will put the cable through the nut and tighten the screw onto the cable. Then there is also a little kind of housing think that you can tighten down of the outer part of the cable to keep it from moving. It is very very simple.

Another note for you is that the engine may run for a while but if you're driving it pretty hard with sharp turns, etc, it might stall after a couple minutes and not start for a while. This is because of the low oil censor, when you're driving it like this it throws oil all around in the engine and the oil censor thinks that the engine is out of oil. You can simply disable this by unplugging one of the wires by the kill switch or some thing, i haven't dont it yet because it has not happened to me so far on my projects, but that is no worry now, you can easily look up how to disable the oil censor on this forum and im sure their are threads on it.

Last thing is you say people have idling issues, kinda disagree with that one :yawn: haha
Well i personally use these predator engines because they are cheap, and if you treat them well they can last very long, but if you dont treat them well, its no big deal because its cheap for a new one. I do have the predator 212 on my mini bike and the predator 79cc on a scooter that i have, and i have never had an idling issue. They will pretty much always work out of the box for a while, and they might need a simple tune up later. But i think you are talking about a while ago i had seen some threads about people saying they were not idling right and the idle screw wasn't doing anything, im pretty sure that was an old model of predator but i have not seen any idling problems besides that.

Well i hope that this has helped you :lolgoku:
It all may sound very confusing at first and you might think that this engine will require too much work, changine idle, disabling oil censor, re-winding,etc. But i can gurantee you that it is very easy to browse these internet forums and learn it all very quickly. Heck i just got into this stuff a couple of months ago, and i have already built a gas powered scooter, and a mini bike, and MORE coming! I think that the engine you have would probably work, you might just have to browse around these forums for other people carbeurator issues, each time i click on one of these threads i swear i learn some thing new :thumbsup: But if you do decide to go predator, its no biggy, but i would suggest waiting until you have some time to put into the old engine, if you want it fixed asap and dont want to work on the old engine, then go ahead get a predator for 90 bucks. :lolgoku:
 

Poboy kartman

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the carb is brand new. Cleaned it, drained gas and added a fuel filter last week. Air filter REEKS of gasoline and there is gas in the air filter 'area' (area was literally wet with gas).

Engine is original and since I'm bringing it to our vacation home where I prefer not to work on it much, I'm thinking for 90 bucks a new engine is the right choice. Maybe not. Need to think about it.


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Your needle and seat are sticking...(or you damaged /lost) the seat in cleaning.....or your float is damaged/ leaking or is set incorrectly.....

But....unless you have a fuel pump that's overpowering it.....that's your problem....no question.
 

Karty2000

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Your needle and seat are sticking...(or you damaged /lost) the seat in cleaning.....or your float is damaged/ leaking or is set incorrectly.....

But....unless you have a fuel pump that's overpowering it.....that's your problem....no question.

Thanks. It worked for about a week just fine and then the other day it was hard to start, started stalling after about 30 seconds at idle.

I started opening the throttle when pulling to start in order to get it fired up more easily (it was taking maybe 5-10 pulls and alot of pumping on the carb). I'm wondering if the pumping and opening of the throttle caused the issue of gas in the filter....

---------- Post added at 06:50 AM ---------- Previous post was at 06:48 AM ----------

Just wanted to let you know if you didnt know, the air filter has oil on it by default, so what you are thinking is gas could just be oil. If you decide to clean your air filter you will need to re-oil it.

Also if you're wondering the bolt size for the pto shaft on the predator it is 5/16 -24, and probably about 1/2 and inch long. Also if you dont already know, which it seems lots of people dont, the shaft will not take a 5/16 bolt, it needs a 5/16 -24 which means that the bolt is fine threaded. You could easily order one online or just go to your local ace or some thing, but some stores like home depot, etc, dont carry fine threaded. I think lowes does though...

Now the engine does not need to be re wound, but if it is placed with a seat in front of it, its going to be impossible to start, :lolgoku::lolgoku:

The preadator has to be the easiest engine to connect a throttle to. It will take you 2 minutes. There is a nut with a hole in it, and a screw in the top, you will put the cable through the nut and tighten the screw onto the cable. Then there is also a little kind of housing think that you can tighten down of the outer part of the cable to keep it from moving. It is very very simple.

Another note for you is that the engine may run for a while but if you're driving it pretty hard with sharp turns, etc, it might stall after a couple minutes and not start for a while. This is because of the low oil censor, when you're driving it like this it throws oil all around in the engine and the oil censor thinks that the engine is out of oil. You can simply disable this by unplugging one of the wires by the kill switch or some thing, i haven't dont it yet because it has not happened to me so far on my projects, but that is no worry now, you can easily look up how to disable the oil censor on this forum and im sure their are threads on it.

Last thing is you say people have idling issues, kinda disagree with that one :yawn: haha
Well i personally use these predator engines because they are cheap, and if you treat them well they can last very long, but if you dont treat them well, its no big deal because its cheap for a new one. I do have the predator 212 on my mini bike and the predator 79cc on a scooter that i have, and i have never had an idling issue. They will pretty much always work out of the box for a while, and they might need a simple tune up later. But i think you are talking about a while ago i had seen some threads about people saying they were not idling right and the idle screw wasn't doing anything, im pretty sure that was an old model of predator but i have not seen any idling problems besides that.

Well i hope that this has helped you :lolgoku:
It all may sound very confusing at first and you might think that this engine will require too much work, changine idle, disabling oil censor, re-winding,etc. But i can gurantee you that it is very easy to browse these internet forums and learn it all very quickly. Heck i just got into this stuff a couple of months ago, and i have already built a gas powered scooter, and a mini bike, and MORE coming! I think that the engine you have would probably work, you might just have to browse around these forums for other people carbeurator issues, each time i click on one of these threads i swear i learn some thing new :thumbsup: But if you do decide to go predator, its no biggy, but i would suggest waiting until you have some time to put into the old engine, if you want it fixed asap and dont want to work on the old engine, then go ahead get a predator for 90 bucks. :lolgoku:

Good info thanks. There's a good video on youtube about the replacement and it looks straightforward, especially the throttle which looks like it can be a real PIA on other models.

I am really compelled to do the swap and just have a nice clean new engine in there but I've never done one before and may just try to fix up the old one first.

Replacing the pull start on the original Tecum. looks to be a PIA too though. The frickin entire right side of the engine needs to come off to get to the it. Ugh!
 

itsid

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first thing is to check your spark plug to see if your mix is off.
if the plug is black or at least 'chocolate' brown, you're feeding to much gas.
a brand new plug might not be dark, just wet...but once the plug is wet it'll no longer spark until it dried ;)

best post a pic, when in doubt.

if the plug is dry and has a nice tan colour (latte macchiato :lolgoku:)
it's a different problem, maybe a weak wire that shorts every once so often *shrugs*
We need pics to get an idea where to take a closer look I'm afraid.

For now: spark plug; since with gasoline in your airfilter, a rich mix is at least not unlikely ;)

'sid
 

Karty2000

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fsince with gasoline in your airfilter, a rich mix is at least not unlikely ;)

'sid

I think the fuel in the filter may be from overpumping the carb when trying to start...Of course, that doesnt answer why its so frickin hard to start or why it stalls after a little bit...

What can I take pics of to help? Plug and what else?
thanks much for the help!

---------- Post added at 08:35 AM ---------- Previous post was at 08:05 AM ----------

and for all thats holy and sacred....How the **** do you get the pull cord rope through the hole inside??? Good god!
 

mckutzy

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There's a knot inside the handle. It pulls through and then you tie it, sometimes there is a metal tab or plate inwhich it is tied to.
 

Karty2000

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There's a knot inside the handle. It pulls through and then you tie it, sometimes there is a metal tab or plate inwhich it is tied to.

The hole was really small. Honestly dont know how they got the cord through it. I widened the hole a bit and got it through. thanks
 

Karty2000

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Ok. So I'm back up and running. Last snafu was coming home to a puddle of gas. Bottom gasket on carb was leaking gas. Got a replacement and now it's sealed nicely.

The persistent issue im having is this:

If I increase idle I can get her started in a couple pulls but once she's warmed up I need to back off the idle or it starts catching/engaging the band because it's revving too high. So I let it warm up about a minute and then adjust idle back down a bit (3/4 turn down or so). Clearly that's not a long term solution. What am I missing here?

Thanks


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Poboy kartman

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I would say at this point.....get some SeaFoam and put a little in the tank and just run it like you are...it could very well just clear up that last little bit of imperfection in your fuel delivery system.....and pretty cheap...and definitely easy!
 
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