Frame design Help

[Micscience]

Hi I am new here and am excited to start a go kart build. I want to build a 2 seater kart to take kids for a ride and let them ride each other as well. I need some direction for the frame design. I would like to keep it some what simple and similar to this one:

http://www.diygokarts.com/images/plans-kart/kart-done-700.jpg

I do not have a pipe bender to make crazy bends, I'm sure there is a way around that. If there is a website or some link to where I can get some ideas or more frame plans please let me know. I have been searching threw the DIY's gallery for awhile now. I'm leaning more towards having a suspension so the frame design has to be suspension friendly. Sorry for all the reading thanks a bunch. here is a quick draft:

http://img835.imageshack.us/img835/5444/gokartframe1.jpg

 

[OzFab]

If this is your first build, I wouldn't even be thinking about suspension, it will only complicate everything.

If you're using square tube, you won't need a bender, simply cut the tube to the desired angle & weld... Just a little tip: when cutting to produce an angle, remember to cut both sides of the square line to produce an even join...

 

[Micscience]

I agree after surfing the net for hours I'm not going to add a suspension. Unless I end up buying some plans for the grandaddy 2 seater kart, but I doubt it.

I'm confused when you say "cut both sides of the square line" do you mean when making an angle, cut both ends where the join meets?

 

[landuse]

Here are some plans you can look at.

Free Minibike and go kart plans
http://www.sfu.ca/~jst4/plans/docs/bikes/Wren Mini Bike Plans.pdf
http://www.kartbuilding.net/Freeplans/plans.htm
http://www.kartbuilding.net/racingkart/index.html
http://www.popularmechanics.com/technology/how-to/tips/how-to-build-a-go-kart-in-one-day
http://www.instructables.com/id/Intro-44/?ALLSTEPS
http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=...94GgAg&usg=AFQjCNHtz0aMwZ2QIx7T3KAkEzOq-aQfFg

The first pic of yours is from this site, and if you look at this page, you will get some directions for how to build it

http://www.diygokarts.com/kart-plans/kart-plans-main.html

 

[Micscience]

Landuse thank you for the links it is very helpful.

 

[DaiSan76]

I agree after surfing the net for hours I'm not going to add a suspension. Unless I end up buying some plans for the grandaddy 2 seater kart, but I doubt it.

I'm confused when you say "cut both sides of the square line" do you mean when making an angle, cut both ends where the join meets?

He means that if you want to make a 60 degree angle, don't just cut 60 out of one side and bend it, cut 30 on each side of the center line and combine them to make 60.

I know it's a lousy picture, but what you don't want is the top one.

 

[OzFab]

Correct, otherwise, you joins end up looking like fig 1 instead of fig 2 in the pic

 

[DaiSan76]

Correct, otherwise, you joins end up looking like fig 1 instead of fig 2 in the pic

You make better pictures than me.

 

[Micscience]

Oh I see thank I get it now. That was my original intentions. I been having a hard time finding square tubing at the scrap yard I bought a 12 foot piece today and a 12 foot angle iron I'm going back tomorrow to check for more.

 

[Micscience]

Hey guys what do you think of gas piping for the frame. The total outside diameter is 1'1/4 wide and the wall thickness is around a 16th give or take. At first I thought that it would be to heavy and the lighter the better but some guy I met at the local scrap yard told me that it was fine and that he had made several with the same type of tubing. I was wondering what you guys think specially since I'm building a 2 seat go kart with an engine of 5-10HP hopefully. Thanks

 

[OzFab]

Correct, otherwise, you joins end up looking like fig 1 instead of fig 2 in the pic

You make better pictures than me.

I've probably had more practice

1.25" tube with 1/16" or 0.0625" w/t is perfect

If you were so inclined, if you cut open a yerf dog or manco frame, you'd probably find that's exactly what they're made from...

 

[Micscience]

Sweet so I'm on the right track. I was thinking of not making the frame design plans and build the frame as I go, this way I can design the frame as I go and if I want to add something later to the design I can. All I have right now is the frame material and steering wheel I'm wondering if I should buy the engine or the tires first before I start building the frame however, If so, then I will have to wait a while longer even though I'm real eager to start this build. Those who have built a gokart before, have you started building the frame without the rest of the parts?

 

[DaiSan76]

Sweet so I'm on the right track. I was thinking of not making the frame design plans and build the frame as I go, this way I can design the frame as I go and if I want to add something later to the design I can. All I have right now is the frame material and steering wheel I'm wondering if I should buy the engine or the tires first before I start building the frame however, If so, then I will have to wait a while longer even though I'm real eager to start this build. Those who have built a gokart before, have you started building the frame without the rest of the parts?

That works, but you end up cutting stuff off and redoing it, as well as having stuff cobbled on that looks like it wasn't planned (Which of course, it wasn't)

 

[Micscience]

Well I understand what you are saying I've been there however I was planning on only going so far until I get the rest of the parts for example: I was going to start welding the main rectangle part of the frame, the seat and head bar and side guards as well. After that I was thinking of waiting til I had everything else.

 

[OzFab]

The best plan is to have a plan! If it changes throughout the build to suit parts, so be it but, it's always best to start with a good, basic idea on paper.

There's nothing worse than building a frame then getting the engine or wheels or whatever, only to find out that it won't fit. Get the basics first: at least get the engine & wheels then build around them.

Ok, so, you're eager to get started & get your hands dirty, I get that but, how eager are you to chop it all to pieces when you realise nothing fits?

 

[Micscience]

well I don't see how the engine won't fit since it sits in the back and regardless of engine design I would leave enough clearance in the back. The tires I won't install until I'm sure of the diameter of the axles/hubs and the wheels. The reason why I don't like to do plans up front is because once I come up with a plan I get flooded with other ideas and I have a real hard time sticking to one idea then I change it up and then I can never make up my mind. On paper the kart looks a lot different then in real life and I wanted to base my ideas from what I see while I'm building it. Am I alone here? does anybody else at diygokart work this way?

edit: If I knew how to use AutoCad or some 3D editor then I would always do plans first.

 

[landuse]

What if the tyres you get won't turn all the way because they keep hitting the frame due to bad frame design. This spit happens. All we saying is that you should be aware of the problems that might happen. Unfortunately you only find out about them too late

 

[meedo]

imho sketch it first then draw to scale ,cut ,weld ,paint ,finish ,enjoy

 

[Micscience]

well thanks for the feedback I appreciate other people's ideas. I have already made a sketch I'll try to make up my mind.