Choosing a Welder

[Azliyx]

I know this question is asked a lot, but i feel more comfortable making a choice supported by some pros.

First off im choosing to get a mig/flux core welder mainly because of the easiness i've heard about mig, but also the fact it's interchangeable so i can also arc weld too.

I've never welded before or have any experience in welding, but im taking up this experience for the summer so i learn how to weld and ultimately build a go-kart frame in the future and possibly build a go-kart.

Like everyone else i have a budget, and it's come down to these choices.

1) A 170 or 180 amp mig/flux chicago welder $200-$300
http://www.harborfreight.com/welding/mig-flux-welders/170-amp-migflux-wire-welder-68885.html

2) $286 lincoln mig welder
http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-25e...=10053&langId=-1&keyword=welder&storeId=10051

3) Buffalo mig welder 125amp $184
http://www.homedepot.com/Tools-Hard...splay?catalogId=10053&langId=-1&storeId=10051

I'm leaning more to the lincoln because of all the great things i've heard about it.
If you have better suggestions or deals (in US) you can find id appreciate your help. Thanks. Other than that, what is the best choice?

 

[devino246]

Welcome to DIYGK.

Generally speaking, one machine can't do SMAW (arc) welding and GMAW/FCAW (MIG/flux-core) welding. The machines work differently. A GMAW/FCAW welder is a good choice, however.

The harbor freight welder will require a 220v plug. Most people don't have a 220v plug in their garage, so that may or may not be out. Several members here have had good luck with those welders, but I haven't tried one so I can't comment.

Between the second and third, I'd go with the Lincoln. When the time comes that you want to upgrade, you'll be able to sell the Lincoln for a decent price.

 

[r97]

I owned the FCAW only version of that welder for a year and built one go kart and one mini bike with it. No complaints, resold it for $150. The Lincoln is definitely the way to go out of those options.

As for other options, search craigslist diligently for months if you have to. Eventually a decent Miller, Lincoln Electric, or Hobart welder will appear. Also, add the Hobart handler 125 on northerntool.com to your list of options. If there is anyway you can stretch your budget, look into the Hobart Handler 140 at northerntool.com.

 

[Azliyx]

Thanks for the info everyone.
So i will definitely be avoiding welders that require 220v outlets, because i don't have them in my garage.

As for the lincoln, that is probably the one I'm going to get. Is there a preferred place to buy welders besides used? It seems that home depot has the best price so far. (including sales tax is about $306 for the lincoln i posted earlier)

The other thing I'm worried about is the price of shielding gas; how much do those generally range in and where would i buy it?

One more thing. The max amperage rated for the lincoln is 88 amps; how much of a limiting factor is that?

Thanks

 

[r97]

Another place to look would be your local welding supply, google search airags.com. If you buy the welder from them they can often give you a package deal on the gas cylinder too.

Price varies extremely, you can rent a gas cylinder, or you can buy one. there are many sizes available too. Also keep in mind the cost of a refill. Again, talk to the guy at your local welding supply about this, he should be able to hook you up with the right stuff.

For just being able to go and weld something, 88amps will be enough for 1/8" with FCAW wire, and possibly with gas too. If you wanted to go higher than that I would suggest you use some special techniques (pre heating, multi pass etc), 1/4" would be the max I think you could go, although it might be better to just have a local shop weld that one section. Also keep in mind that the hotter you get the welder, the more you need to pay attention to the duty cycle!

 

[Br@ndoM@n]

Dont buy china!

Dont buy a china made unit. If u have probs with it service support is null. Any of the Big 3 are gonna be good, Hobart, Miller, Lincoln. Do know that Hobart & Miller are owned by the same parent company with ALOT of the models being pretty much the same thing with Hobart being less expensive. Miller being marketed more towards pro users and Hobart being marketed towards hobby users. Miller versions usually have slightly higher duty cycle and Hobart versions usually have slightly less duty cycle but little more AMPs than Miller version. Lincoln welders tend to cost more than Hobart/Miller. If going with a 110v MIG id recommend going with a 140AMP unit since its the most power any 110v welder can supply. Reason why I say 140AMP unit too is the fact that most are rated at 1/4 inch thickness on single pass and although u probably wont be welding much 1/4 inch material for gokarts, it is nice knowing if u do happen to need to weld that thick once in awhile ur machine is capable. Also note ur duty cycle increases when u run at lower power setting so figure u have a 140amp unit and a 90amp unit. Ur welding at 30 or 90amps the 140amp unit will be able to weld longer none stop then the 90amp and the 90amp unit welding at 90amps probably is only gonna be able to weld for 60 seconds at a time before u reach the duty cycle and have to let the welder cool for 8 minutes before u can lay down 60 seconds of bead again. lol. I own a Hobart Handler 140 and its frickin awesome. I made my own header for my Honda GX160 (easy) built a rear bumper and working on a swingout tire/gas can carrier for my freind and no problems. Only time I had a issue was that my buddies generator couldnt handle the welder. Also note that the bigger 110v machines can both do flux core and run inert gas to run solid wire. My machine came with the valves and everything ready to hook up a inert gas bottle out the box. If u want to spend a few hundred more u can go for a Dual Voltage MIG machine that will do up to 140amps on 110v and more amps, 200amps on 220v. I payed $499 for my HH140 and it came witha welding helmet, gloves and welding cap FREE and I got FREE shipping. Although spend the money for a autodarkening helmet. lol I dont want to spam the board by posting the company but Its not hard to figure who it is if u can use google. Also stay away from china mig wire. Any wire that says E71T-GS is pretty much crap. E71T-11 spec wire is a good all around wire. Lincoln Innershield 211MP & Hobart Fabshield 21B, Hobart RTP are good self shielding flux core and they are E71T-11 spec and can do MultiPass if u weld thicker metal. Also know if ur gonna do alot of sheetmetal ur gonna need gas and .023 tips if not ur gonna burn through the thin stuff. Medium guage metal needs .030 tips and wire and thicker stuff gonna need .035 tip and wire. .035 is pretty much the thickest wire that will run in a 110v machine. If u cant afford multipul tips and wire diameters id recommend just getting .030 and adjusting ur machine settings to make it work. Do know .035 wire is cheaper than .023 and .030. I have noticed the thicker the guage wire the cheaper it is of the same spool size. Cheaper 110v machines usually only can do 1 or 2lbs spools while the better 110v machines can run 1,2, or 10lbs spools. 1 & 2lbs spools are 4 inch spools and 10lbs spools are 8 inch. Hobart/Miller units come with a adapter to run all those diameter spools, Im sure Lincoln does too but not sure. Also note that welding wire is cheaper per lbs with bigger spools, kinda like buying in bulk. Hope this LONG post helped u somewhat. Good luck and have fun. Welding machine is a great tool to have and u can do sooooo much with one, not just build things but also to use for repairs.

 

[fowler]

Wow

 

[landuse]

Wow

I know. I didn't even read it....

 

[exenos]

I think you sufficiently demonstrated your burning hate of Chinese products.

 

[rifkin]

I don't know how to weld and I have never welded before in my life. I do not own a welder. However...

I have been looking into buying a welder to learn/practice/play with recently and have looked over many models and brands. The one I think I have settled on is a Hobart MIG such as http://www.amazon.com/Hobart-500550...ref=sr_1_1?s=hi&ie=UTF8&qid=1339095197&sr=1-1

The reasons why I find it better ignoring that particular price is that it is all hooked up for gas, not a risky chinese deal, and unlike that lincoln the hobart has 4 voltage settings. That package I linked is less than 100 dollars more, with a lot more equipment, and free shipping if you have amazon prime. If you do not have Amazon prime then you are missing out as it is awesome haha.

So my 2 cents without speaking from any experience but I have spent the past few days heavily researching welders for 6-8 hours a day (12 hour shifts at work with lots of slow times haha) and the best bang for my dollar as far as I can find is a Hobart, that one being the one I would personally buy just because of accessories.

edit: Actually checking that lincoln link a second time it clicked in my head that it also comes with accessories and that I might have misunderstood the biggest complaint I received about the lincoln which was the voltage settings, because I think it is L1 L2 H1 H2 which is 4 settings, the same as the hobart. I guess go with the lincoln as it seems much more of a level playing field right now.

 

[Br@ndoM@n]

Its not that I HATE china made products, 90% of the stuff we buy today is made in china these days. I do dislike china welders because there junk and dangerous. Dealers are buying these machines for as low as $30 each and reselling them for $100. How well built or engineered is a welder that can be sold for $30 with a profit margin? There have been people who have baught this machines and have had them catch on fire. I have used a cheapo wire feed machine and it couldnt weld crap. Also quility machines are built beefier. My lil welder is like 3 times the weight as my buddies cheapo wire feeder. Cheapo wire feeders are just a box with a big transformer.

RIFKIN, try northern tool it might be cheaper there and they have free shipping on hobart welders. The gas valve it comes with is made by Smith Equipment as in Smith OXY TORCHES its a good regulator which will cost ya $100 if purchased separate.. Only complaint about the regulator is the guage lens is plastic. Smith Equipment is owned by Hobarts Parent company.

 

[Br@ndoM@n]

Thos L1,L2,H1.H2 are preset voltage taps. My Hobart is setup the same way. but there just numbered 1 to 4. Lincoln is a good machine too. My next MIG is gonna be a Lincoln PowerMIG 256. The little Lincoln should have a chart on side door that will have recommended settings for the material ur welding. There are some machines that have infinite voltage settings which is nice feature to have to fine tune ur settings.

U gonna be using the machine on home current or generator? Asking cause ur gonna plug it in to ur house make sure ur breaker ur pluggged into is 20AMP and not 15AMP. U could have probs with breaker tripping if ur plugged into a 15AMP circuit. If ur gonna run it on generator make sure it can put out enough wattage. If ur generator is rated for 5000watts but ur 110v plug isnt a duplex plug it probably wont put out enough to keep it happy. If it isnt a duplex plug then on 120v ur generator will only put out half the rated output. I learned that the hardway.

 

[rifkin]

I don't know about the OP but I will be running it in/out of my garage which the previous owner had also done so there is wiring to support it, including 220v. There is also a bucket of brass gauges and stuff but I don't know anything about it and have left it sitting there for the past two and a half years.

 

[fowler]

U need to learn to summarise your points

 

[Br@ndoM@n]

lol my bad. just trying to help.

 

[landuse]

U need to learn to summarise your points

And paragraph things. It hurts my eyes seeing a block of writing like that...

 

[Br@ndoM@n]

And paragraph things. It hurts my eyes seeing a block of writing like that...

I use my phone for internet and its not a smart phone so basically when I post anything its like a big txt message and I have to tpe fast or POS thing times out so I dont have time to make it look pretty sorry. Where I live theres no internet service besides mobile so I dont use my laptop except when I go to "town" 40 miles away.

 

[Doc Sprocket]

Asking cause ur gonna plug it in to ur house make sure ur breaker ur pluggged into is 20AMP and not 15AMP. U could have probs with breaker tripping if ur plugged into a 15AMP circuit.

Agreed. I spent six years welding in the field- those little "Lincoln Lunchboxes are "rated" to run on 15 amps (a legality), but they are MUCH happier if you feed them 20. Keep the circuit as physically short as possible (preferably right off the panel) and avoid extension cords. If you are not 100% electrically competent, have a qualified electrician do the work.

 

[OzFab]

If you get the right welder you can be lucky. My 130A Chinese Mig/Mag runs off a 10A plug, through a 10metre extension cord. The only problem I've had was overheating when I was building my trailer due to extended, continuous welding for more that 10 minutes, but that comes down to the duty cycle of the welder.

TBH, my little chinese welder has really surprised me. It has it's problems but, overall, it's not bad

 

[devino246]

If you get the right welder you can be lucky. My 130A Chinese Mig/Mag runs off a 10A plug, through a 10metre extension cord. The only problem I've had was overheating when I was building my trailer due to extended, continuous welding for more that 10 minutes, but that comes down to the duty cycle of the welder.

TBH, my little chinese welder has really surprised me. It has it's problems but, overall, it's not bad

Keep in mind though, y'all have 230V running to your standard outlets.