Carbide 150 (ASW 7150) RPM question

[bwheelz05]

Happy Labor Day!!

question:

Those of you who’ve had (have) Carbide 150’s (ASW 7150 model)- what RPMs are you seeing average with WOT on flat even terrain? After installing tach and setting to 1 spark per revolution, It’s idling at 1500 RPMs and maxing at around 5600-5700 RPMs. (Speed about 36-37 MPH- per
GPS)

Confused because the specs state @ 7500 RPMs is max at full horsepower... I’ve got to be misunderstanding something...
I Should be seeing max RPMs per the manual (or close to it right?).

Again it’s stock right now. Ordered upgraded 24 mm carb with the upgraded jets and a stage 1 kit (UNI filter,CDI etc) from buggy depot.

Cart was cleaned and lubed today. CVT and belt looks good. Tires at proper PSI (worn though) - new oil /filter etc..

Maybe I set the Tach wrong... it’s got 5-6 wraps around the plug per instructions. Although again I am probably misunderstanding something about the RPMs—


Other than this question- the kart runs fine. Is slow going and takes awhile to reach top speed but I am fairly certain that both the stage one kit and the new carb will make it more ‘lively’. ... right?

*am also researching what’s needed to go into upgrading the rollers ... I have to watch the expense though *


Please school me (nicely

Much obliged!

 

[Karttekk]

Just go to American Landmaster's site, they have factory manuals/trouble shooting guides for a bunch of machines.

https://americanlandmaster.com/

 

[bwheelz05]

Right-

That isn't what I am asking--- "Where are the service and owners manual?" (There is not a 'troubleshooting manual i have found yet..)

Have both already- neither discusses what I am asking...

I am asking of those owners whom have similar model Karts as mine; What are they seeing as an average RPM range (stock)

 

[Karttekk]

A GY6 engine is a GY6 engine no matter what it's installed in. Here's a trouble shooting guide for a GY6 in a scooter but the same principals apply. It doesn't appear too many people on this forum run those engines, most people on here are familiar with the horizontal shaft "lawn mower" engine. Nothing wrong with that, most go karts run that style of engine. They're designed for them. See if this helps. If your rollers aren't flat spotted, your valves are adjusted properly, your air and fuel filters are okay and there isn't anything dragging or binding and your gearing is correct, your kart should speed right up. You could even call American Landmaster and ask their support department your questions. This is taken right from the factory service manual: Output Power / Torque [N.m(r/min)-1] ------------- 9,9 hp @7500rpm / 13ft-lbs @ 5500rpm

http://www.family-motorsports.net/GY6-50cc-150cc.pdf

 

[itsid]

first:
NO go kart ever ran a gy6.. (the one exception you never heard of anyways ommitted; the road legal Kredler F100/ F170)
what you are talking about is a mini buggy
kart: one seat, no supsension, wheels 13" or less [pick at least two]
buggy: two seats, fully suspension, wheels 15" or bigger

Aaand the gy6 is originally a scooter engine made for the Honda CN clones, that's why it
has that funny oblonged body (as the scooters swing arm) and a way to attach the wheel directly to it.

And worst: no two gy6es are the same if not fromt he same mfg (and I talk engine manufacturer!!) sure general specs might match (combustion volume, length of housing...)
but other than that you can have anything from two very similar to two very different engines

No, we do not care much about gy6es in general.. for exactly that reason.
every chinese backyard shop and it's guard dog made a gy6 at one point in time and the difference are too much to list amongst these.
usually primary and secondary reduction are the things that break your back.
Some (Howhits for example) cast a FnR into the case and yet another iteration of same old same old..
documentation is essentially close to non existent.

Good news: I think your's was made by Shanghai Howhit Machinery
(as the Carbid itself was made by them [L6K starting segment of VIN, right?])
And they should have indeed the manual you were looking for.

BUT if PO swapped the engine for one the same outer dimension and combustion volume,
you might have a lower hp version (I think 150s came in 7.5, 9 and 11hp.. )
this now states 9.9 *shrugs* ah well.. inconsistency again

Anyways.. all Manco/AmericanLandmaster buggies I'm aware of are less than 40mph of stock top speed.. 35-39'ish or thereabouts (depending on passenger weight)
your's fits right in.. and thus I don't see any problem with it not perfoming properly.

'sid

 

[Karttekk]

Something else I didn't think to consider is the possibility the previous owner may have installed a speed reduction kit which limits engine RPM's. They're designed to keep inexperienced or younger riders safer by limiting engine speed. This is taken directly from a factory guide: A speed reduction kit is available for purchase through ASW’s Customer Service Department by
calling 1-800-643-7332 or by visiting our website at www.amsportworks.com. ASW is now American Landmaster.

https://americanlandmaster.com/WebStore/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=2_4&products_id=6

 

[itsid]

true, but the speed limiter kicks in at around 20mph.. since he's hitting the 'full' speed according to the 7150 manual I doubt he had that limiter installed ...

'sid

 

[Karttekk]

I think he's getting as much out of it as it can provide too, just throwing ideas out there to consider. Variator roller and clutch spring changes alter when the clutch applies and affect sheave functionality but a buggy isn't known for speed. They're better suited for trail riding and some hill climbing, at least in my opinion.

 

[bwheelz05]

Hey there-

So first of all, my apologies for posting anything GY6 in this forum. Wasn't aware that it was horizontal only.

Took apart the variator and was surprised, there isnt much wear at all on these guys. One though has just the slightest amount of wear but nothing that I would consider bad. Weighed in at 10 grams on the micro scale. The rollers all move freely up and down their ramps.

The belt does look decent also. Little dusty but good overall.

Checked tires again, proper PSI in fronts and backs.

Have not sign of a speed reduction kit installed in the electrical box. And I am hitting the high 30's. Something else is going on for sure.

Just called buggydepot on the status of my stage one kit.... they are waiting on the performance DC CDI it appears. Bummer.

Bur again stock the kart does function fine. I was just curious as to the low RPMs in comparison to others whom might have the same setup. Ill continue digging here.

Appreciate the information/advice gents!

---------- Post added at 08:50 AM ---------- Previous post was at 08:48 AM ----------

True true- trail riding, hill climbing, not really looking for 'FAST FAST FAST'.

I have had it out and about on the trails and hills. It doesn't decent. Needs a little more pep. All in all I am not horribly worried about the seemingly low RPMs - perhaps my tach is off.

 

[Karttekk]

Hey there-

So first of all, my apologies for posting anything GY6 in this forum. Wasn't aware that it was horizontal only.

Took apart the variator and was surprised, there isnt much wear at all on these guys. One though has just the slightest amount of wear but nothing that I would consider bad. Weighed in at 10 grams on the micro scale. The rollers all move freely up and down their ramps.

The belt does look decent also. Little dusty but good overall.

Checked tires again, proper PSI in fronts and backs.

Have not sign of a speed reduction kit installed in the electrical box. And I am hitting the high 30's. Something else is going on for sure.

Just called buggydepot on the status of my stage one kit.... they are waiting on the performance DC CDI it appears. Bummer.

Bur again stock the kart does function fine. I was just curious as to the low RPMs in comparison to others whom might have the same setup. Ill continue digging here.

Appreciate the information/advice gents!

---------- Post added at 08:50 AM ---------- Previous post was at 08:48 AM ----------

True true- trail riding, hill climbing, not really looking for 'FAST FAST FAST'.

I have had it out and about on the trails and hills. It doesn't decent. Needs a little more pep. All in all I am not horribly worried about the seemingly low RPMs - perhaps my tach is off.

If your rollers are "flat spotted" at all they need replaced.

 

[bwheelz05]

sorry let me revise - there is some slight wear- for sure.

Just nothing that strikes me as abnormal. But I will order new ones here and install them. Ill report back. Gottcyha- zero flat spots

Thanks!

 

[itsid]

a dull spot on a single roller isn't too much of an issue really..
(hit a grease-free spot once or twice perhaps)
if it feels round and smooth on your finger tips and is still as heavy as the good looking ones, I wouldn't be concerned at all.

Maybe ordering fresh rollers isn't a bad thing to have them handy in case you feel it getting worse over time (in a year or two)

And nono.. you got me wrong.. we're happy to help with all buggy/kart/quad/atv/mini bike/ trike related stuff as long and as much we can.
just gy6es are sooo notoriously inconsistent in specs and performance that we simply cannot hold enough information to spot every issue right away.

We need to zero in on a problem as we go and exclude known issues and mistakes..
and work ou way through
(kartekk covered that part just nicely IMHO so I kept quiet in that regard)

Anyways.. since your top speed is as it should I cannot seem to imagine any issue.
CDI modules like yours are limiting all the time.
And different size gy6es have different limiters preconfigured.
(say 5k, 6k, 7k, 9k... depending on combustion volume and/or intended use)
as I said: too many inconsistencies to know all possible options.

And if yours is maybe ever so slightly off
(say having a 6k limit on a 7.5k engine... you loose a bit of power up there)
coul you tach the engine w/o any load? (jacked up rear or removed belt?)
maybe that gives us a clue if need a different CDI unit or not.

 

[bwheelz05]

Rollers are pretty decent it seems- each one weighs in around 10grams. Nice round and smooth (that’s sounds funny haha)

Called America sportworks- they said the CDI I have in the Kart is the ‘stock’ most likely but there isn’t an identifiable number to be sure. I was told by the rep that their are inconsistent CDIs from time to time... (?).

I ordered a unlimited rev CDI was th my stage one kit from buggy depot.

Put the kart on jacks- the Max tach measured was 8800 RPMs and averaged at 7850 RPMs- wow you are right , very inconsistent. Perhaps that makes sense with wheels off ground- I should have asked if that’s what they measured their specs with.. wheels off ground.

Interesting...

 

[Karttekk]

Here are some worn rollers from the Carbide I picked up recently. The flat areas are obvious, some more than others. There shouldn't be any wear on them. Slight wear may not be an issue but ideally there shouldn't be any. They have to freely roll up and down ramps to work at 100% efficiency. An inexpensive, relatively easy upgrade to perform.

 

[bwheelz05]

A go kart is a ‘kart’ and a Kart is a ‘buggy’- off topic mini-rant

Gents- seen another fella posting a question about his unknown Chinese Kart/buggy/machine/four-wheel wonder.

He slightly got blasted about posting a ‘buggy’ question in a ‘kart’ forum.

Sid, your a moderator: Perhaps you can suggest when registering for an account or posting any topic, their be a pop up or something that states “Pure go kart related questions only”.

I looked through the forum rules and haven’t found anything stating ‘go kart’ only topics of discussion- I.E NO ‘buggy’ type questions.

I had no idea. When I started picking up yerf dog 3203s and spider boxes, this was the first forum that I went to for answers. And now I am getting larger ‘buggies’ (Still see them described as ‘karts’ elsewhere) and I know now there isn’t a whole lot of tolerance for buggy questions (at least as of late.)

My two cents that’s all, not picking a fight or being ‘distasteful’ by any means- hope it doesn’t come off that way. (Not my intent)

Simply put, some folks don’t know that this is a Kart only site. Again not harping or trying to start trouble. Just my observation.

**I do appreciate though your guys’ help either way

---------- Post added at 12:55 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:52 PM ----------

Karttekk- excellent! Yea the ones I put back in aren’t like those, much less wear but Ill certainly try it. Couldn’t hurt and I have ordered the variator tool to help keep the sucker from
Falling apart when removing the nut.

 

[Karttekk]

I think the "buggy" style machines are gaining popularity, maybe that's why more questions relating to them are popping up. They're relatively "soft" compared to an actual go kart with their independent suspensions, huge tires, F N R gearboxes, rear view mirrors, multiple wheeled disc brakes. Almost like small cars. Go karts offer more excitement and challenge nearly sitting on the ground and being able to take off and fly in a matter of seconds, plus the modifications and upgrades are all over the place. I may be way off here but I think most retail go karts are the racing or shifter type. I'm not sure if any actual go/fun karts are being manufactured in the USA anymore.

 

[bwheelz05]

I understand- that’s true - Yerf dog and Manco were alive awhile- didn’t they manufacture in the USA?? ASW is in Indiana but they just resell I believe.

I’ve been looking at Buggydepot more and today and they do certainly cater more to the ‘buggy’ style.

Perhaps it’s just assumed that Diykarts caters to both types so that’s all I meant-

 

[bwheelz05]

Tad gutless

Took it out again for some off road trials- flat and open it’s decent. Pulling uphills it’s crap!

Took apart the drive again just to check, all seems good. I need to start researching a decent compromise between speed and uphill ability.

There is two things I am seeing: Try different weight rollers or change out the springs.

Will have to give each a try. Doubt the engine is internally worn. Just doesn’t have the ‘UMMPH’ to climb.

 

[Snaker]

I bought a new ASW 200 series UTV in 2010. At that time ASW built the chassis and assembled with sourced China bolt on parts. The most consistent thing about ALM / ASW /Manco/ ?? is that they change everything frequently.

On the rpm, I don't have a tach connected and no clue what mine runs.

On the rollers, they are a crazy, poor performing design. Putting a roller between two opposing ramps guarantees flat spots. The roller is going to roll on one ramp while skidding against rotation on the opposing ramp or it will simply skid and not roll at all. Usually what happens is the rollers seem to kinda roll / kinda skid until the flat spotting begins. I've had sets where one roller may have a bunch of equal flat spots occur around the roller and another of the set may have one huge flat spot down to the metal core with the rest of the circumference looking like brand new.

I have also changed out roller sets from a well worn set to brand new and I couldn't tell a seat of the pants difference between. If your going to check and replace rollers for the slightest amount of flat spotting your going to be busy and spending a lot. If the concern is there I would advise switching from rollers to slider style flyweights.

With these GY6 machines I suggest you take a look at scooter forums for powerplant related issues. Lots of info and they go pretty deep in tuning and mods. I favorite is http://49ccscoot.proboards.com/#category-6


http://49ccscoot.proboards.com/#category-6

(I put myself at the mercy of the moderators for this link)

 

[itsid]

Gents- seen another fella posting a question about his unknown Chinese Kart/buggy/machine/four-wheel wonder.

He slightly got blasted about posting a ‘buggy’ question in a ‘kart’ forum.

Sid, your a moderator: Perhaps you can suggest when registering for an account or posting any topic, their be a pop up or something that states “Pure go kart related questions only”.

I looked through the forum rules and haven’t found anything stating ‘go kart’ only topics of discussion- I.E NO ‘buggy’ type questions.

as long as it has a rather compact size and no license plate,
any number of wheels between 2 and 8
we WILL be interested and happy to help where we can.

And funny enough that does include the occasional home made airplane (three wheel in case you wonder) and even zero wheel contraptions that are of interest ("more builds" is just for such)
We even had a Golf MkI Cabrio (you called it Rabbit back then)
and he got help as well... so yeah

And we like to call things by their name whenever possible.
a Buggy is not a Kart
(just like a Yamaha Virago is not a Harley and a Ford Bronco is not a Jeep)
Doesn't mean we do not like Buggies (we do mostly... we just don't like them being called a go kart too much!)

And yes, I know manufacturers do so as well...
they do the same with pedal cars..
and you see the difference between a pedal car and a full size buggy, no?
And you'll certainly agree those two do NOT belong into the same category of vehicles, right?

'sid