can you have it all with electric

[TeamCheap]

how far can electric vehicles go right now.

As a comparison lets take my wifes stock raptor 350 atv (6 speed-20HP/dry weight 375lbs) which is just a mild sport atv, top speed of 50-55mph or so with a run time of approximately 4.5 hours of mid to 3/4 throttle on a full tank of fuel, what would it take to match that with electric.
the raptor has a 2.4 gallon tank and fuel weighs about 6lbs a gallon so total weight with tank and even carb is maybe 25lbs, there is NO battery I know of that can match that.yet

would a trans help the electric as well, I'm guessing it would.
then there's the batteries needed to make it run for 4.5 hours at a reasonably fun pace.
I'd be happy reaching 3/4 the performance of the raptor with a solid half the run time, is that doable with todays hardware.

I'm asking the people that know far more about it than me because I find the electric vehicles interesting granted I realize I'm comparing apples to potatoes but still fun to think about.

I'm very curious and would like to build an electric single seater buggy in 2018 so that should give me some time to learn a little bit anyway.

 

[Kartorbust]

With 4.5 hours of run time at a constant 53.5mph is 236.5 miles. Only electric motorcycle I know of is based heavily on the lightcycles used in TRON Legacy, and only has a range of 80 miles. So that should give you a baseline to go off of.

 

[TeamCheap]

It wasnt a constant speed she ran it between 25 mph and 45 mph for the most part on the bull gap loop which if I remember is about 100 miles but we did take a few side trails and she needs her smoke breaks.

I'm thinking a trans of some sort would maybe help extend the battery life while getting the most out of the electric motor.

Use all that low end torque to get it moving then change the ratio's a bit once its up and cruising at it's most efficient zone.

Looks like I'll be looking at performance data for motors in my future.


Just something I was reading.

A 5-hp motor operating a 4:1 V-belt drive at 450 rpm produces 58.33 ft-lb of torque when drawing full current. Replacing the system with a VFD may require sizing the system for the torque required at low speed. In order to operate an ac motor at 450 rpm, a 20-hp VFD and motor rated at 1750 rpm may be required if full torque capacity is needed. A 20-hp system, when rated at 1750 rpm, develops 3 ft-lb of torque/hp or 60 ft-lb. An alternative would be a 15-hp motor rated at 1200 rpm that develops 4.5 ft-lb of torque/hp. Usually, the issue is speed, not torque, and the system must be sized for the application.


Comparing variable speed drives

Electronic / Mechanical

20:1 speed range / 4:1 speed range

Maintenance required / Maintenance required:

Clean fan and heat sink / Lubricate and adjust belts

Quick speed change /Adjust pulley diameters

with keypad /check speed with tachometer

Its obvious that its all just numbers, you can shift things around but all the numbers are there somewhere

 

[Rail rider]

I've looked into this a little bit. People are using 12v treadmill motors for these projects . running them at 24v uses less Ah . but you'll need to find the right size speed controller. And the batteries are not cheap to buy just for a potentiality failed experiment.

 

[ML-TOYS]

Well an "electric" vehicle can only go as far as your extension cords.

 

[TeamCheap]

I've looked into this a little bit. People are using 12v treadmill motors for these projects . running them at 24v uses less Ah . but you'll need to find the right size speed controller. And the batteries are not cheap to buy just for a potentiality failed experiment.

I seen the treadmill motors for sale at surplus center and was wondering if they would be any good but I'd rather buy a more purpose built system rather than mess with adapting a motor at this stage in the game for me.

The good thing about the treadmill motors is they can be had for free from craigslist but still not worth my time and plus they have some wicked power requirements for them.
Here are specs of one from surpluscenter - 2hp/$39.95

Power 2.0 HP
•Voltage 130 VDC
•Amperage 14.3 Amps
•Speed 5650 RPM (Nameplate)
• 6175 RPM @ 130 VDC, No Load

•Rotation Reversible
•Enclosure OFC
•Duty Treadmill
•Mount Two 7mm Holes in Housing on 3" Centers
•Shaft 17mm dia. x 48mm overall length w/ 1/2"-13 x 14mm long LH threaded end
•Rear Shaft 16mm dia. x 26mm overall length
•Size 10-3/8" x 6-3/8" O.D.
•Shpg. 35 lbs.

---------- Post added at 10:42 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:03 AM ----------

I need to find a high capacity round/cylindrical battery, just thinking if I could line a section of of the steel tube frame with pvc or some other insulator and have the batteries tucked in there it might make for a neater more compact frame of course the tube might be 4"-6" in diameter but that's ok as it would be the main part of the frame.

 

[ultralight01]

With 4.5 hours of run time at a constant 53.5mph is 236.5 miles. Only electric motorcycle I know of is based heavily on the lightcycles used in TRON Legacy, and only has a range of 80 miles. So that should give you a baseline to go off of.

Look into the Zero motorcycle. Over 130miles range so that speed.

---------- Post added at 09:03 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:01 AM ----------

OP, what are you wanting to build?
You can build a buggy, you'll want around 36-48v for maximum power and speed. You can build a electric mountain bike, which if you ask me, rule the world of electric vehicles. Or... something else. But we need to know so we can find the size of your battery.

Note. Don't buy SLAs. Lifepo4 or lithium only.

 

[TeamCheap]

At the bottom of my first post I said I wanted to make a single seater buggy and compared it to my wifes raptor 350 because the weight and riding conditions would be about the same.

more detailed description here:
First off I want to build it as close to the KYOSHO assault RC buggy as I can because it looks cool but also has a very simple build to it.I'll have a full cage and the engine wont be hanging so far off the back.

single seat buggy
removable power pods-???? electric motor/12HP flat twin B/S engine
dry weight between 350-475lbs (hoping it weighs less)
sport ATV size tires on aluminum rims (probably match the raptor or blaster)
I'd like 1 to 2 hours of run time with a max speed of 45mph

 

[Functional Artist]

Check out, El Dingo.

http://www.diygokarts.com/vb/showthread.php?t=33680

*spoiler alert;

Still workin' on 1 - 2 hr run time & 45 mph top speed.

 

[Kartorbust]

I think the Traxxas Bandit would be easier to copy. But I'd look at existing dune buggies and buggies in general to get a good idea.

 

[TeamCheap]

I think the Traxxas Bandit would be easier to copy. But I'd look at existing dune buggies and buggies in general to get a good idea.

NOPE this thing is dead simple construction with only a few tricky parts to it, of course a buggy to ride in will need a few changes that an RC car doesn't need.

I have a few of the original kyosho RC buggies and they are fairly cool to run and simple construction overall and the front end is very unique.

I like the two main square rails and I'd like to have batteries set in them, the front end is sort of simple and the back is just trailing arms.

---------- Post added at 05:37 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:10 PM ----------

Check out, El Dingo.

http://www.diygokarts.com/vb/showthread.php?t=33680

*spoiler alert;

Still workin' on 1 - 2 hr run time & 45 mph top speed.

I seen EL-dingo and it is very nice, a bit too much weight over that live axle but an inspiration for sure.
For my rear axle I'm thinking a diff with very thick sticky grease(for like 1.5 tires driven )

That is what I like about the square rails on the side for either setting batteries into or more likely saddling them on the rails and being able to adjust the weight distribution.

I think I need some sort of transmission to utilize the motor and batteries to the max.

I can see me dropping some serious cash on the electric parts, mostly the batteries.

 

[TeamCheap]

Is it possible to have a 36v and 72v system using 6 12v batteries and 1 motor and 1 speed controller.

On my 12 minute ride home from work I was wondering if I could have 6 batteries wired so I can switch between 36v for long run times at slower speed or 72v for a wild ride but less run time.

Is there a decent motor and speed control that can handle a setup like that?

I can see me dropping some serious cash on the electric side of it all.

I think I could come up with a simple selectable two speed chain drive system, NO shift on the fly but still better than nothing.

 

[bigrigbri]

I'm betting a engine torque converter would lower the initial set off current allowing a slightly higher gear ratio.
If you could use a wound field motor then transferring from series to shunt through a speed controller might eek out more run time.
What about a Harley D gearbox which is a separate unit that can be used like a conventional box at differring speeds

 

[TeamCheap]

I'm betting a engine torque converter would lower the initial set off current allowing a slightly higher gear ratio.
If you could use a wound field motor then transferring from series to shunt through a speed controller might eek out more run time.
What about a Harley D gearbox which is a separate unit that can be used like a conventional box at differring speeds

The torque converter might work well if it is set to kick in at the motors peak RPM/torque.

The harley gearbox sounds expensive how much do those run?

with the chain drive I was thinking a jackshaft with two different sized sprockets spaced a few inches apart, the sprockets ride on bearing hubs locked onto the jackshaft and facing each other they have drive coupling teeth and in the middle of those 2 sprockets is a double sided drive coupling keyed to jackshaft but able to slide back and forth to engage either sprocket.
Without being able to shift on the fly though it would be almost useless.

I still think a belt driven vari-drive is the best option I have.

The problem I see with electric is in using the motor for ALL the speed variation which means either slow top speed but longer run times or fast and short run times.