Can it be done better, for less??

[Deutch420]

http://cruzincooler.com/parts products/50series/1000.htm

Long story short, i'm looking to acquire the fastest electric powered cooler possible (without getting silly). I would like it to be able to go 15mph+ easy, however i would prefer speeds in excess of 20+mph. If possible, i would love if the cooler was large enough to accomidate a 180lbs adult without looking like king kong in a convertible Toyota Prius. Long use is always a bonus. Going to be used at many track events, NHRA, corvette challenge etc... Also i might try it on my local golf course so offroad is not a necessity but wouldnt hurt...

So the Cruzin Cooler is 1000watts in a little 92lbs kart/cooler. Can it be done better for as much or less? Would it be cheaper/faster to DIY with a golf cart or forklift motor and scoot parts etc...?

Thanks in advance!

 

[robotmickey]

Well my friend and I wanted to do the same thing so we could take it to swap meets and stuff. I got an electric scooter for free from another friend, then I took the guts from that, made a little frame and used the triple trees from a pocket bike. Removable functioning cooler, so you can leave it at camp and sit on a crate or something. It probalbly goes 12 or 13mph, but thats about as fast as I want to go on it. That seems a lot faster when you're 2inches off the ground. Its only 300watts, 24 volts too so there is a bunch of room to go waaaay faster. This is what we came up with:

 

[rabies]

wow. that is pretty cool. ima have to make sumthing now with this welder

 

[Bluethunder3320]

would you consider a honda gx200 clone? for $100-130 new usually.

 

[robotmickey]

Forgot to mention, grand total spent was about $150 USD.

 

[Deutch420]

Well my friend and I wanted to do the same thing so we could take it to swap meets and stuff. I got an electric scooter for free from another friend, then I took the guts from that, made a little frame and used the triple trees from a pocket bike. Removable functioning cooler, so you can leave it at camp and sit on a crate or something. It probalbly goes 12 or 13mph, but thats about as fast as I want to go on it. That seems a lot faster when you're 2inches off the ground. Its only 300watts, 24 volts too so there is a bunch of room to go waaaay faster. This is what we came up with:

Mickey,
I tried to read as many threads on this forum before posting. Yours was one of them. Your rig looks nice. How do you keep the cooler from sloshing around wile driving? I would like to make something similar to what you made, however i would like it to go much faster (we build race cars for a living, i cant be putt putting around events @ 10mph... ). I have driven the cruzin cooler 500watt. Does like 15mph. Too slow. So if you had say, 6x the budget you spent on your rig, minus the spair parts to use, how would you go about this? I could spend more if needed, but i need to remember this is a toy. I was going to buy a hub based electric powered bycicle, as they can do 30mph @ 60 mile ranges, but the kits are almost 2K$ and are built directly into the bike tire (26", way too big for cooler cart). I dont mind spending extra for better batteries etc... Ide rather spend more and be happy then stay within my budget (1K ish) and not enjoy to drive it...


Ive put a few months of thought into this, I have a couple ideas. I have access to a machinest with CnC machines, 4130 chromoly etc... So i could go 1-off instead of starting from a scooter etc... However i dont feel i know enough about these to do a 1-off + i think it would end up too heavy. less is more here. I never built something like this so im trying to decide what motor, batteries, gears/sporkets, direct drive kits, throttle kits, brakes etc.. will work best to suit my needs. I think the forklift/golfcart route will be too heavy. It would be nice if myself and a friend were able to pick the unit up with ease (under 200lbs) as it will be transported frequently. I am open to all suggestions and ideas. The more in depth the replies the better!

would you consider a honda gx200 clone? for $100-130 new usually.

Correct me if im wrong but the gx200 is gas powered, right? Im trying to stay with electric for noise reasons. I dont want to draw any unwanted attention so noise is very important.

 

[Bluethunder3320]

yeah theyre gas.. pretty quiet stock... just saying because it would save you alot of money and youd have alot more power. im not holding you back from electric though.

 

[robotmickey]

Oh yeah, you could go way faster. You could use some race cart wheels that are better for going faster. Also if you wanter to quicker I would have 4 wheels instead of 3, cause on mine I can turn around at about a quarter throttle and pull the inside wheel off the ground.
So if you want to go faster you're gonna need more watts. So like 1000 to 1200 watts at 36 volts. What kind of run time do you want on this? Mine is 7 amp hours and my friend drove it pretty wildly for about a mile and a half.
You could go with a treadmill motor which are like 1400-1800 watts, but you need anywhere from 90 to 130 volts.
This is how I suggest you do it:

Get one of these:
http://www.monsterscooterparts.com/36-volt-1000-watt-motor-controller-throttle-kit-standard.html
You could even get two and run twin motors for something really unique.

Then get one of these:
http://www.monsterscooterparts.com/schwinn-mongoose-gt-izip-ezip-36-volt-battery-pack.html
again you get two and hook them up in parallel for more run time.
(Option two): You could design your own battery pack here:
http://www.robotmarketplace.com/products/battery_build_main.html
They are much more expensive but they are much lighter. You would probably also want two because they don't run as long. (Only 10amp hour max per pack)

Charger for battery option one:
http://www.monsterscooterparts.com/36v1xlrbach.html

Chargers for battery option two:
http://www.robotmarketplace.com/products/battery_chargers_nicad_nimh.html

Axle bearings:
http://www.bmikarts.com/item/1-Bearing-Kit-3-hole-400400-711
(great website for misc. parts)

Heres your axle (1" doesn't need to be longer than 32" inches really) :
http://www.bmikarts.com/item/Solid-Aluminum-Axle-6008-or-6018-845

Wheel hubs:
http://www.bmikarts.com/item/Lightened-Aluminum-Rear-Wheel-Hub---1-&-1-1-4-600225-or-600230-2
(Someone else on this site can appoint you to some good tires and rims and where to get them, not exactly my expertise.)

Heres some brakes:
http://www.bmikarts.com/item/1-or-1-1-4-Hydraulic-Brake-Kit---Red-600505R-or-600510R-5781
(This kit comes with a master cylinder for a pedal style set up, don't know what you want. You could adapt this for a paddle style for an upright steering wheel instead of handle bars.

Don't know what kind of gearing you want? The cruisincoolers are geared for torque, but you could set it for more speed and still have plenty of torque. I was thinking something like 5 to 1? 7 to 1 maybe? Motor comes with an 11 tooth sprocket (8mm). You don't what much heavier chain than that because if you make it too big it'll start robbing power from your motor. There are several choices here:
http://www.electricscooterparts.com/sprockets.html#8mm
You would also have to find a suitable Hub for it.

[All of these components are compatible with a 1" axle.]

Moving on,
On my cart I have some straps that keep my cooler along for the ride. I decided I wanted a deck instead of trying to put the guts inside the cooler, mainly because I didn't want to cut up my cooler. I also knew that if I did that the cooler would no longer be water tight and the functionality of it would be lost. I can also move the cooler without having to move the entire machine. You can also put something else on it like a beer crate of case of soda or something to sit on, it's just kinda cool, idk ha ha.

Frame:
I made my simple ladder frame out of some 3/4" square tubing I think it was. It has a plywood deck thats bolted underneath that the cooler sits on.

Turning:
Like I said, I cut off the triple trees from a $10 pocket bike that I got at the flea market. But for going any faster you should probably have four wheels. I hope that you are familiar with the Ackerman affect, and scrub radii, if not, brush up on steering principles here:
http://www.rctek.com/technical/handling/index.php

Once you have come up with a front steering design we can help you find the correct parts you'll need.

I hope this helps a little, I didn't proof read it or anything so I'll take questions ha ha. Feel free to make changes or whatever, this was just to start you off with some ideas. Hope this helps.

 

[robotmickey]

oh my goodness I wrote a lot...

 

[Bluethunder3320]

oh my goodness I wrote a lot...

thats some good info!!!!! good job!

 

[robotmickey]

You could also find an old race kart on craigslist, shorten it, and affix a cooler to the top of that instead of a seat. Just a thought. Bighead did it on is bar stool kart.

 

[Deutch420]

Mickey,
Thanks! A lot of those sites and kits im familiar with, mainly only b/c i have looked at them before.

I was thinking to start off with a good base. Get quality basics that wont have to be changed out when/if i chose to upgrade the motor/batteries etc. Possibly buying a pre built frame, or a kit and modding it. I agree 4 wheels is a must. I figure i would like to start off with a good frame,brakes and axles. The suggested motor/controller/throttle kit from Monster is a good idea, however i fear it will get boring really fast. Also with the added weight of a full, large cooler, will it be able to do even 15mph? I wonder if i should just start off with something better. Although i can always re-use the throttle.

Is there a basic frame i can buy to start off with? Im confused on the steering. I think if i went straight up with the steering wheel(like a school bus) instead of on a 45 degree angle it would save a lot of room. I dont need the steering column on an angle due to the upright position you wil sit at wile on the cooler. There should be plenty of room on a standard kart frame for me to play around with if i free up space by eliminating the angled steering column (usually angled b/c ur legs would go under it for the gas/brake. however i want to use a twist throttle for gas, and pull trigger for brake.). However i would like to keep the throttle a twist style throttle and this wont work with a wheel. . ideas? maybe i can use an ATV style handle? I can always add support beams and thin sheet metal to make the floor flat to accommodate the cooler. I can elongate it if needed. I just think if i plan to do 30+ mph, I should start off with something semi-proven as opposed to something i threw together.

So is there a basic kit i can start off with and build on? Maybe buy something used with wheels, brakes etc but no electronics?

Being able to use it for long periods of time is important to me. I wont be going top speed all the time, however if im not speeding, i will be accelerating fast. Is is possible for me to get 15-20 miles of use like the cruzin cooler? Or would this require too many batteries?

What type of battery setup would i need to reach my desired goals (if even possible) if i went with the "design your own pack" type setup.

And what type of batteries do u suggest? They have 1,000 different types.

What battery style would be the most easy to upgrade?

i dont want to ask too many more questions as ive already bombarded you with them. I personally think it would be awesome to rock out on a badass, fast cooler. Insta-Beer.

Thanks again!

 

[robotmickey]

I don't think that 30mph is realistic with your design parameters. I think that twenty or so is about max.
Batteries: That website has a lot of good stuff. I think if you went down that route of building your own batteries you should pick the batteries with the highest milliamp hours. So I think that there was one that had 10000mah. Although the 36volt pack was like $600 and you would probably want two for it to last longer to have a total of 20 amp hours at 36 volts. They would end up being a lot lighter than the the lead acid ones, but that's about the only upside. I have a super pocket bike that's all electric and it probably weighs around 225 pounds with me on it and it goes 25mph for about 40-50 minutes of me just going around the block. Its 800 watts at 36 volts, batteries are lead acid 20 amp hours, 12 volts each, gearing is 5:1. So 1000watts of maybe 250pounds with a rider should do around 17 to 22 depending on the gearing. And like I said, you don't want to be going much faster than that sitting straight up 2" from the ground, most of the things that I make don't go fast enough to constitute helmet but going to much faster than that will. Besides it's hard to go faster than that.

 

[Deutch420]

http://www.eastcoastwholesales.com/electric_scooters_x900.htm

i found these for 430 buxx each shipped. I was thinking about buying 2 of them. welding them together and use 1 shorthened handle bar to control both front wheels. They say 1 of these will do 25-30mph. So if i double it up + add weight (cooler) i should be there.

IF i went this route, do you think it would be easy to hook up both motors to a single throttle? I should be able to just splice and combine the wires that lead to the throttle which would allow me to control both at the same time. Could this damage the throttle?

Also it comes with front and rear disc/calipers. Being its only possible to have a left and a right squeeze brake handle, how would i get control of all 4 brake discs with just the 2 levers? You cant splice those kind of brake lines i presume. Maybe just use both rears, or 1 front and 1 rear?

Thoughts? i think this might be the easiest route if the website is not a scam

 

[Deutch420]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2giTX3iLzLQ

here is a vid of the scooter. At the end is a vid of him on it. Doesnt look anywhere near 25mph, maybe more like 15mph. but the vid could be misleading, i hope?....

Think i could hit top speed with these doubled up (2 of them combined side by side) + maybe 75lbs (cooler with ice n beer)? It should speed up faster too i think, but top speed doesnt improve correct?

 

[robotmickey]

I think that combining two of those types of scooters side by side could be hard with the weird spring fork in the front. You could do it, but it might look funny IMO. I don't know exactly how those throttles work. You could defiantly figure it out. I don't think that splicing the wires that connect to the controllers would hurt the throttle but I don't know if it would work/ get full performance, you would have to just try it. I still think that 1000watts should be plenty for your application. If you feel like you need more power, go back to Botparts.com and look at their motor selection, they some pretty beafy motors there.

I about to lay the hammer down on a kit that will put out some serious power.
http://www.robotmarketplace.com/products/package11.html

Now this is a package for your motor only, but it would get you some SERIOUS speed. You will still need batteries (some BIG ones to be able to harness all the power) and a frame and wheels and such. Any where from 2500watts to 5400watts depending on the voltage you use. Make sure to look and see that this is exactly what you want. Its a good kit, but its expensive and you still need a lot of things so take some time and decide what you really want. The very first motor kit that I sent you the link to provided very good power and was much simpler to assemble and use, as well as a lot cheaper. This kit is for a far more advanced and experienced electric DIYer. I would defiantly recommend the first kit from monster scooter parts. You can always upgrade later.

 

[oscaryu1]

here is a vid of the scooter. At the end is a vid of him on it. Doesnt look anywhere near 25mph, maybe more like 15mph. but the vid could be misleading, i hope?....

Think i could hit top speed with these doubled up (2 of them combined side by side) + maybe 75lbs (cooler with ice n beer)? It should speed up faster too i think, but top speed doesnt improve correct?

Lol he said 30mph... LOL...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=txyDd3VvI9M

That's my old project scooter I built 2 years ago when I was 14... you can get quite a bit o' power out of these motors, just gotta know their physical limits.

 

[j.concepcion54321]

oscaryu how many volts did you run through that motor?

 

[mrdak]

Hey Robotmickey, Thanks for all of the information you posting in this site, it was VERY heplful... I was wondering what your cooler kart weighed without the cooler sitting in it, just as it sits in the picture you posted... I am building my own 3 wheeler with the 1000 watt motor 36 volt, so far it look pretty cool... Let me know please...


Dak...

 

[robotmickey]

It doesn't weigh very much, maybe ~25-ish pounds if that. Be carful, a 1000watt motor is going to get you going pretty fast, and if it only has three wheels and is narrow like mine, turning can be precarious. Even at slow speeds the inside wheel on mine comes off the ground.

Good luck with your build.