Brakes and Wheel Upgrade Options?

[only126db]

Here is my deal, I picked this kart up for my sone and it has the old brake system that rubs on the tires and I dont feel it is safe at all.

It takes forever to stop and I worry (he almost ran me over the other day).

With this system my tire/wheel size is limited to pretty much what is on it now and I would like to get him some tires and wheels eventually that will absorb some of the bumps.

So my question is basically, without any welding is there something that can be done on the cheap to upgrade the brakes and be able to upgrade the tire/wheel combo to a more offroad setup.

I quickly looked at removing the brake bar which will allow for a substantially larger tire, but what about the brake upgrade?

Are there any cheap kits or anything available for something like this?

Thx

 

[landuse]

As far as I know, there is nothing that you will just be able to bolt on. You will need to do some fabrication to instal some other braking system.

Wait to see what some of the other guys have to say as well

 

[anderkart]

I think Manco has all the parts to upgrade your Red Fox to a drum/band brake setup. If Blazkowiez doesn't respond to your thread here, I'd suggest you send him a PM:--> http://www.diygokarts.com/vb/member.php?u=5853
or contact him at his kart shop here at this link: http://www.gokartsoftexas.com/mainpage.html

He's very cool/knowledgeable guy and will also know what taller tires/wheels would fit. He'll probably also suggest a larger rear sprocket to maintain your gear ratio so you dont burn your clutch up.

 

[souperman000]

I have the same kart. A quick message about tire size:

Dont go too large because of the way the frame is deasigned, the rails beside the seat stick out and also can hit the tire depending on the size. I have to move my axle hangars back to accomodate a large wheel.

 

[only126db]

I have the same kart. A quick message about tire size:

Dont go too large because of the way the frame is deasigned, the rails beside the seat stick out and also can hit the tire depending on the size. I have to move my axle hangars back to accomodate a large wheel.

I was thinking a 13-500x6 Turf tire or maybe 16 at the very largest, but most likely a 13-500x6.

I think I could still use the factory brakes with the 13" till I upgrade brakes.

Just for a little more clearance, more width for traction & cushion on the bumps.

I think a 13 will still keep it very stable too.

 

[souperman000]

On my measurements, with a 36" axle at the current position, 13" is the biggest you can go

 

[only126db]

On my measurements, with a 36" axle at the current position, 13" is the biggest you can go

you are right, i just measured and 13 is all she's got.

i must have measured my other tires wrong the first time, i thought they were 11.5", but they are 10.5".

 

[souperman000]

I am moving my hangars back to accomadate bigger tires that I got for free.

Just remember if you move them, you need to make sure you still have enough room for your sprocket and stuff. You might not have a problem with this because you have a dead axle, but Live azle karts have to watch out for this

 

[only126db]

anything i do right now will not require any fab work.

i am only looking at basic bolt on type upgrades, any welding isnt an option right now.

if i am going to do welding it would be live axle snowmobile engine action i would be doing.

but at that stage it no longer becomes for the kid.

 

[Doc Sprocket]

While I have no immediate suggestions for "fab free" brake upgrades, I caution you against going too large on the tires without altering your gear ratio. Assuming your existing gear ratio is appropriate, a good rule of thumb for tire size without regearing is 10%. Anything more than that, and your performance will really go out the window at best. At worst, the clutch will be unable to tolerate the abuse and burn up in short order.

When I refer to "10%", I mean this- if for example, your current tire size is 10.5" Then, 10.5" +10% =11.55" (12" at absolute best). As you can see, there's not a lot of room in there for tire size increases without regearing. In addition, the 10% rule of thumb is just a general concept and may vary kart-to-kart. Experimentation will tell, but don't be too surprised if you end up needing to regear.

EDIT- Actually, you'll want to look into band brakes. They are certainly superior to your scrub brakes, and I think a "weld-free" installation is feasible. The drum would get bolted to your hub, and if you're halfway creative, the rest should come fairly easily.

 

[only126db]

While I have no immediate suggestions for "fab free" brake upgrades, I caution you against going too large on the tires without altering your gear ratio. Assuming your existing gear ratio is appropriate, a good rule of thumb for tire size without regearing is 10%. Anything more than that, and your performance will really go out the window at best. At worst, the clutch will be unable to tolerate the abuse and burn up in short order.

When I refer to "10%", I mean this- if for example, your current tire size is 10.5" Then, 10.5" +10% =11.55" (12" at absolute best). As you can see, there's not a lot of room in there for tire size increases without regearing. In addition, the 10% rule of thumb is just a general concept and may vary kart-to-kart. Experimentation will tell, but don't be too surprised if you end up needing to regear.

EDIT- Actually, you'll want to look into band brakes. They are certainly superior to your scrub brakes, and I think a "weld-free" installation is feasible. The drum would get bolted to your hub, and if you're halfway creative, the rest should come fairly easily.

I have been doing some calculating on the gearing for a bit already.

The kart now can spin the one tire for quite a ways when in dirt and actually if sitting still in the driveway with the wheel turned towards the drive tire the kid can get the tire smoking doing donuts, she gets going quick but tops out real quick too, I gps'd myself doing 22 or 24mph wide open down the road.

I need to actually recount the teeth on my sprockets since I forgot what I have.

I am also looking at changing out the #35 chain, I think its just too weak and am going to get tired of chasing master links around....

I also did see those band brakes, but wasnt sure if they would work for me, it looks like it would be a super easy retrofit, in my head it seems too easy so I came to ask...

 

[Doc Sprocket]

I've never used a band brake, but they are widely used. Surely they are superior to scrub brakes. Do yourself a big favour, though- buy your brake band from a good go kart supplier. Apparently, the ones Norther Tool sells are absolute garbage. (Again, no personal experience here).

 

[Blazkowiez]

First thanks to the guys for kind words.

You do have the option of conversion on band brake and it will stop that one wheel. However unless you go through water quite often scrub brakes are amazingly effective.

You may need more leverage, or perhaps to make an s bend in the stretched rod.

If you want band brake please note and we'll explain further. If you want scrubs here we go.

1. If you want larger wheels your option is to cut and weld the mounts on the scrub brakes, that will allow for up to a 13" tall tire.

2. I mentioned leverage, you can move the rod up to the top hole on the pedal, and the bottom on the lever on the scrub brake. This will increase throw and modify the power on the brakes themselves.

3. An s bend would take out the stretch and play over years of using the brakes. Simply heat a section of the rod and using a pair of channel locks bend the sucker, this shortens the rod and makes things much stiffer.

4. Add more air to the tires if need be, it may wear differently but will give you brakes.

Lastly, #35 chain can be strikingly strong if you buy the right kind.