Always the hard way

[wannakart]

I have a 70's era Carter Brothers Go Kart that we grew up riding as kids.
I am trying to update the old frame with more modern wide tires and polished aluminum racing wheels for my kids to now ride.
Replacing the original 5" split wheels and hubs with light weight hubs with 5/8" ID bearings and the 3 bolt pattern with 1/4" bolts that mount them to the Douglas racing wheels.
The kart has a single left rear wheel drive dead axle which is 5/8".
The kart has the original #41 sprocket and Drum/band brake assy which bolted to the old original 5" 2 piece wheels with a 4 bolt pattern which I think were 3/8".
To accomidate installing an 11.5x8.00-6 tire on the polished aluminum douglas wheel I would need a dual flange hub 6" between flanges that is 3 bolt pattern on one end to match the newer style racing wheels and 4 bolt pattern flange on the other end that would match up to the Carter Brothers original brake drum and sprocket?

Or, does anyone have a better idea to make it work excluding putting the original tires/wheels back on or going to a live rear axle kart.
We had a live axle kart for a short time but the kart under any power at all wanted to keep pushing the kids straight ahead even though they were turning the wheel. Even with me on it 6' 2" and 235 LBS I had to let up quite a bit off the gas to get it to turn good.

 

[anderkart]

You can buy Douglas spindle mount wheels for the front.

I was thinking you might be able to do some mods to use these 3-bolt to 4-bolt wheel adaptors on the rear: http://www.cannonmfg.com/Store-Wheel-Hubs.htm

 

[wannakart]

The left and right front and right rear wheels were not an issue, just the left rear drive wheel. I believe what I need for the left rear drive wheel is a dual flange hub with a bearing in each end for a 5/8" stub axle. The hub would need to be 6 inches between flanges to accomodate mounting the wide Douglas racing wheel and a Dunlop 11.5x8.00-6 tire. The go kart wheel would attach at one flange and at the other the sprocket and brake drum. Doesn't look like such a part is available.
Does anyone know of a reliable machine shop to make one for me?

 

[anderkart]

I'd try to find a local fabricator/Machine shop so they could have your sprocket/drum and Douglas wheel in hand to make sure they build the adaptor right the first time.

I'm still thinking we might be overlooking another more simple method to accomplish this. Could you post a pic of your L-R sprocket/drum assembly with the wheel removed?
(or post a link/pic to one just like yours for sale online somewhere)

 

[wannakart]

Thanks, Will see what I can do, after I take some pics and then read up on how to post them on here.

 

[anderkart]

10-4.
I use off site photo hosting at: http://photobucket.com/ Its free and prety easy to do, plus they'll automatically downsize your images if required.

After you register and upload your pics to photobucket, you'll simply need to copy the desired pictures "image code" found underneath each uploaded pic. Then back here on DIY, you'd paste that image code right into any threads "Reply to Thread" box right along with any typed message you want to include.

Then before actualy posting, I always use the "go advanced" / "preview post" feature here to double check and see that the pic is working right. I probably made it sound overly complicated but it usualy only takes a few seconds to upload and post pics after you get used to it. (this same pic posting procedure will work on many diferent Internet forums)

You can locate the pic anywhere within your typed message you want (before your message, anywhere in the middle or at the very end of your post)

 

[wannakart]

Pictures of past project

Okay, I think I've got the loading photo's down after successfully loading these of my bar stool. I just need to get the kart out and try to take some pics worth a thousand words.

 

[wannakart]

Here's some pictures, hope they help. I got a longer shank 5/8" bolt today to weld on after the original shorter one is cut off. I had thought that the hub would have to be 6" between flanges but after measuring from center of wheel to edge of wheel it's just under 4 7/8" and if each flange was 1/4" thick it would make it 5 3/8" total, leaving plenty of clearance for the chain on sprocket. Just need to find a machine shop to make it! The first 2 pictures are items that are similar to what I am needing.

 

[anderkart]

I'm just kinda thinking/typing out loud here but...

How about if you had the adaptor i linked above, and you removed its 4 studs, and then bolted it directly to your origanal sprocket/hub with countersunk Allen bolts. I'm thinking it could also have 3 wheel studs that would match up and mount to your Douglas wheel. If your wheel requires more back spacing, you might be able to use 3 longer wheel studs, along with a 3 hole rear wheel hub : http://www.cometkartsales.com/store/wheels/vankhubs.htm drilled through and cut down to the corect length to just act as a wheel spacer.

I beleve Douglas also sells wheels with many diferent back spacing's. Heck as far as that goes for a few extera bucks they might even build you a custom wheel with the corect back spacing and 4 stud holes to fit directly on your origanal hub and solve your whole darn dilemma here...

Another possibility is those adaptor hubs in your first 2 pics could probably have all the studs removed, one end corectly drilled out for a 3 bolt pattern, and then the other end bolted to your hub.

note: theres actualy 2 completly diferent, 3-hole bolt patterns commonly used on modern race karts. American and metric, so if you order any parts make sure you know which style your working with.

 

[kcclassic]

on another note

hey wannakart, very cool project. I'm looking for some wheels to fit what must be an identical carter bros 1215 for my cousin. he picked it up on craigslist for pennies and I've been helping him get it running. He's wanting something a little larger to take offroad that will help clear the sprocket in the rear. any ideas on what will fit this hub and bolt pattern. Or if you could just point us in the right direction to find parts for this thing such as a new sprocket etc, that would help tremendously. I apologize for jacking your thread, but this is the first good lead I've had. Thanks

 

[kibble]

Ooh.... Me likey barstool!

 

[dpaxson]

how about you use a front hub thats got mounting holes for front brakes? then just make an adapter plate for you're sprocket.

 

[wannakart]

hey wannakart, very cool project. I'm looking for some wheels to fit what must be an identical carter bros 1215 for my cousin. he picked it up on craigslist for pennies and I've been helping him get it running. He's wanting something a little larger to take offroad that will help clear the sprocket in the rear. any ideas on what will fit this hub and bolt pattern. Or if you could just point us in the right direction to find parts for this thing such as a new sprocket etc, that would help tremendously. I apologize for jacking your thread, but this is the first good lead I've had. Thanks

Not many wheel options for older style kart wheel hubs, that I knew of or was interested in!
That's why I just changed out all the original 4 bolt pattern hubs with light weight aluminum ones that have a 3 bolt pattern that fit the newer polished aluminum wide racing wheels and fat slicks. We have accumulated a lot of new parts that never got used, hubs, steering wheels, chain guards, tires and wheels, #41 sprockets, engines and numerous exhaust headers building a bar stool racer, several different go karts and few mini choppers that we would ride in local parades.

 

[wannakart]

how about you use a front hub thats got mounting holes for front brakes? then just make an adapter plate for you're sprocket.

After wadeing through and checking the ideas I've received so far only to find out that for one reason or another they either just won't work or would end up being so "rigged looking".
I have been talking to a guy selling a pair of front hubs with rotors for a shifter kart on eBay but not sure if it would be long enough, waiting for a reply back from him.
I need a hub 5 3/8" long to allow mounting a sprocket to it and leaving clearance between tire/wheel and drive chain.

 

[dpaxson]

that seems really long. what is the back spacing on your wheels?

 

[residentg]

Another thought, but might end up being expensive: I have an old Carter-Brothers 1765. It actually came stock with a differential. Maybe you could look into that type of rear setup. That would take care of your steering issues. Here is a link to a site where you can download Carter parts lists:

http://www.gopowersports.com/carterbrothersgokarts.aspx

let us know. JB

 

[wannakart]

Hi,

The picture I posted of the bar stool, I have a diff rear end on it and have a couple extras sitting in the garage.
But that would mean cutting the back end off the kart and completely fabricating a new back end for a diffferential live axle by welding on 4 bearing hangers, 2 for each side of the differential.
With this project I am just trying to put a wide tire and wheel on the l/h rear drive stub axle for a cool little kart for the kids.
I want to leave the kart frame itself as stock as possible.

I have a couple different leads on having a dual flange hub made to order and am waiting to see what pans out.
Having a one piece hub made will leave the kart looking more like it came that way.
I will post pics when kart is complete.

I tried going to; http://www.gopowersports.com/carterbrothersgokarts.aspx
and all it says is UNDER CONSTRUCTION and to please come back soon!
I do hope that at some point they get the site up and running as it would be very helpful.
I just checked the tag on the rear part of my frame and it says the model number is a 1203, can anybody tell me more about it like when it was made?

 

[wannakart]

Found a site...

Found a site,

http://www.carterbro.com/_files/Ipls/1203.pdf

for a complete list of parts numbers for Carter Brothers Model 1203.
I called the number it has listed for Carter Brothers Mfg. Co., Inc. (334) 735-2301 to order a couple other parts.
I also ask when the model 1203 was made and was told they did not know because most of their parts sheets have a manufacture date for the model but the one they had for the model 1203 did not.

 

[wannakart]

that seems really long. what is the back spacing on your wheels?

The pic I posted of the Dunlop slick shows the back spacing of the wheel, measurement is to center of wheel where hub flange would mount. There is no off set, both the inside and outside are the same. The measurement is actually about 4 3/4" to edge of rim. I wasn't holding the tape measurer exactly straight, but I thought it was close enough for someone to get the idea. I had the camera in one hand, the tape measurer in the other and trying to keep the puppy away also.

 

[dpaxson]

i think you're going to have trouble finding a front hub that long. something custom machined looks like the only option