Ekkk! First Go kart!! predator 212 and series 40 driven?

chris015

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Well guys. Im 33 years old. NEVER had one and wanted one as a kid. I was hauling a van to the crusher and came across from research is a carter brothers go kart with a predator 212 engine. The number on the axle tube is 1708. Upon googling i found a pdf file of the diagram and part #s. cart is from 2001. The yard guy said the engine was siezed and said he would take $50 for the whole thing. I took it home! a dab of marvel oil in the cylinder and she broke loose and ran! 2017 model motor too.

That was 6 months ago. Work has me busy so im time limited. So Upon TONS of research after i learned what a centrifugal clutch was on small engines and the series of belts. I was like why so complicated? Well things started off wrong. Someone installed a 30 series driver. After $50 in belts to find the right size i finally found it. The frame is slotted for adjustment so i couldnt really go by center bolt to center bolt since the driven is mounted on the jack shaft.

So i thought it was ready to go. Nope. Got it all set up thinking its all 30 series. upon looking the driven is a 40 series. NO! DANGET!

So this was after i test drove it. belt got hot. oh and the crank seal blew apart because i was misinformed. that brass sleeve the belt idles on i was told it was a spacer between the driver and crank. Wrong! it chewed up the seal. Well new seal installed,lesson learned.

So here i am. 3/4" crank shaft and i need to either use a 30 series driven which i cant find and even then it looks like i cant use it since the driven spring system is flipped on the jackshaft.

Can i use buy a 40 series driver and use a 3/4 to 1" sleeve adapter? Im waiting on new tires to come in right now. darn thing has 2 pc wheels up front. Now i need tubes too. Already did the stage 1 kit on the engine. Sounds like a ripper.

Il get pics up later tonight if i get home early enough.

edit : here is 2 pictures. the one with the stage 1 is a week old. The other was when i first got it. That converter was TOASTED. Had to buy a new one. Few reasons i posted these was 1. its dark outside. No new ones are happening. 2. to show the driven clutch in both images.

So, since im new to this i will ask my one of many stupid questions. In the first image you see how the driven spring system is facing the engine? Anyway around that? from what i understand the tapered side will be on the wrong side if i mounted a 30 series driven that way? So its back the next question. Can you confirm in the second photo that it is a 40 series driven? Im fairly sure it is.

and yes,engine is covered while not in use. lol
 

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chris015

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edit #2
Read first post. This is my "internet find that will fix this!!" This photo is a 212 predator series. Actually off this site too. high five guy. its i think a Hemi but the shaft is still 3/4 so shouldn't matter.

im still looking for answers on my first post but!

If anybody knows what im looking at on this one and can give me some in depth info on it with maybe part numbers etc to get me away from this 30/40 series issue Thatd be great. so Just to clarify...me+chain driven go karts. IQ maybe 2. I do work with automotive and rebuild hydraulics. So. im not snowflake stupid. Just new to this gokart stuff. Im doing all this for a kid for christmas although im not going to lie i wanna play with it for a few days to get the gocart "fix" out of me. So im trying my best to keep budget at a minimal as i aint got much either myself. I just wanna make this lil turd happy.
 

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redflash

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valve cover says....hemi..........too dark of a picture, wait until sun shines on the other side....then take the picture.........oh yeah you could turn the kart around..........

Da redflash
 

chris015

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little lost sorry.. the picture with the hemi is a pic i found online i was using it to compare to my future clutch setup..
 

karl

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Can you confirm in the second photo that it is a 40 series driven? Im fairly sure it is.
Those pictures don't help much at all, can we get a more direct picture of this driven clutch? It May be a 20 series.

Edit- it is a 20 series driven, that uses a symmetrical belt angled on both sides. . The 30 series driver on your engine is asymmetrical ,
that has an angled side outward, and flat towards the engine. Also the 30 series driven runs outboard, VS your 20 series driven that is inboard.

So you can put a 20 series driver+ belt on, or get rid of the jackshaft / 20 driven and buy a 30 series TAV2 backplate
and adapt it to work.
 
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panchothedog

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The picture in the 1st post is a non hemi. The picture in #2 is a hemi. Unless you are going to go into the engine and by hop up parts it really doesn't matter.
The cams and the flywheel are different, other than that not much. For your drive problems you have a 30 series driver ( on the engine ) and something different on the back. Buy a 30 series driven and put it back there. You CAN'T
run mixed series parts, it won't work. Stay with the 30 series torque converter.
You don't need the 40. It's much more expensive, and the 3/4" to 1" adapter
are cheesy as hell. If you don't mind spending 60 bucks you can get a brand new 30 series plate system. New driver, driven, shaft, sprocket, and mounting plate. For some reason most of the kits come with metric mounting hardware and even though the engine is made in China and has mostly metric bolts on it
the threaded holes in the side cover ( where the plate bolts on ) and the one on the end of the crankshaft are all 5/16" x 24. Lots of videos showing how to service your driver and clean it up. Go Power Sports also has good video on the subject as well as how to measure for the correct length of belt.
 

Denny

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Get a 20 series driver that is what you have for a driven. Get a good Comet or Max-Torque belt for it and don’t look back. Jim the owner of Max-Torque is on here at times. Go to GoKart Supply web site and look up CVTs. It will tell you all you want to know including how to measure for a proper belt!
 

chris015

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Get a 20 series driver that is what you have for a driven. Get a good Comet or Max-Torque belt for it and don’t look back. Jim the owner of Max-Torque is on here at times. Go to GoKart Supply web site and look up CVTs. It will tell you all you want to know including how to measure for a proper belt!
You know im glad you said 20 series as i didnt think much into that but upon looking the 20 is a 3/4" belt and when i was looking at the 40 series it was 7/8 and i was thinking "im not sure how a 7/8 is going to ride in that pulley?"

You just saved me some money.
 
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Well guys. Im 33 years old. NEVER had one and wanted one as a kid. I was hauling a van to the crusher and came across from research is a carter brothers go kart with a predator 212 engine. The number on the axle tube is 1708. Upon googling i found a pdf file of the diagram and part #s. cart is from 2001. The yard guy said the engine was siezed and said he would take $50 for the whole thing. I took it home! a dab of marvel oil in the cylinder and she broke loose and ran! 2017 model motor too.

That was 6 months ago. Work has me busy so im time limited. So Upon TONS of research after i learned what a centrifugal clutch was on small engines and the series of belts. I was like why so complicated? Well things started off wrong. Someone installed a 30 series driver. After $50 in belts to find the right size i finally found it. The frame is slotted for adjustment so i couldnt really go by center bolt to center bolt since the driven is mounted on the jack shaft.

So i thought it was ready to go. Nope. Got it all set up thinking its all 30 series. upon looking the driven is a 40 series. NO! DANGET!

So this was after i test drove it. belt got hot. oh and the crank seal blew apart because i was misinformed. that brass sleeve the belt idles on i was told it was a spacer between the driver and crank. Wrong! it chewed up the seal. Well new seal installed,lesson learned.

So here i am. 3/4" crank shaft and i need to either use a 30 series driven which i cant find and even then it looks like i cant use it since the driven spring system is flipped on the jackshaft.

Can i use buy a 40 series driver and use a 3/4 to 1" sleeve adapter? Im waiting on new tires to come in right now. darn thing has 2 pc wheels up front. Now i need tubes too. Already did the stage 1 kit on the engine. Sounds like a ripper.

Il get pics up later tonight if i get home early enough.

edit : here is 2 pictures. the one with the stage 1 is a week old. The other was when i first got it. That converter was TOASTED. Had to buy a new one. Few reasons i posted these was 1. its dark outside. No new ones are happening. 2. to show the driven clutch in both images.

So, since im new to this i will ask my one of many stupid questions. In the first image you see how the driven spring system is facing the engine? Anyway around that? from what i understand the tapered side will be on the wrong side if i mounted a 30 series driven that way? So its back the next question. Can you confirm in the second photo that it is a 40 series driven? Im fairly sure it is.

and yes,engine is covered while not in use. lol
Quick question because we are very similar in both that we just got into and that we have a janky driven/driver set up lol my kart also has the driven mounted on a jackshaft, so I have a question for you, how did (if you did) you find the correct belt size? Because I also learned that center to center wasn’t the best way to go about it seeing as I couldn’t find the proper belt, anyway. Even weirder to how similar our situations are, I also acquired a carter bros kart for next to nothing (not the one I’m talking about here but still cool) but mine was in pieces when I got it
 

panchothedog

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As stated by MAD in post # 11, center to center is the ONLY way to measure for the correct belt length, BUT it makes a difference depending on if you are running a 6" or a 7" driven clutch. All the charts shown by the popular vendors show the correct length depending on distance and diameter.
 

chris015

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Got the 20 series belt and converter in. Fitted great. Sat the kart on some blocks to mess with it since im waiting on 1 last tire. The cvt looks like it works perfectly.

LOL. gotta add this in. I was revving on it a little for kicks. it vibrated off the block and took off under my old blazer suv. I was like. yep enough vodka for that Saturday night.
 

chris015

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Can't wait to see how it takes off under load.
I will get a video of it. Im now debating on what colors to paint it. its a ugly mix of faded purple and green. Im considering a gallon of that roll on or even the spray on rhino truck bed paint.

edit : also my peeps. Them front spindles.....one side has a bunch of play. Is there bearings inside or bushings? passenger side had a good 1/8" of wobble.
 

Hellion

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I agree with Denny. Do it up right with some gloss, semi-gloss or even satin (not flat) spray paint enamel in a bright primary color or something (red, blue, yellow).

It doesn't have to be stripped down to bare metal, just rough sand the old paint to provide a "tooth" for the re-coat. Pay special attention to any
active rust though and treat those areas with either mechanical removal or a rust treatment. Add a primer coat if desired or just topcoat it without a primer layer underneath in Krylon or Rustoleum.... or better yet the cheapest enamel (dollar store?) you can find. They're all pretty much the same.

Krylon, Rustoleum, VHT, Dupli-color and other big brands are pretty pricey $$ these days.

I'm a big fan of masking tape or masking off areas to prevent overspray. Overspray on tires or seats just looks like you're clumsy or didn't care.
And besides, you're doing it for a kid. That's great. (y)(y)
 
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