Getting my old Dingo by Manco running again.

[Rhizzlebop]

got it for Christmas in 1990. Now trying to get it going. A guy at a small engine repair shop has it. He put a new carb on it and it runs but he says he can’t get it to stop leaking fuel. Something about th bottom of the carb where it bolts on. Says he’s tried gasket o rings etc and it leaks. It would crank and run but not smooth. It came with an 8 hpbriggs from 1990.

anyway, I’m now thinking of getting the 13 hp predator and just have him replace it. The engine guys those old 8 hp Briggs put out a lot more than 8 hp.

so if I go this route is the 13 too much and will it start breaking clutches and chains and torque converters or is it just a small upgrade?

I never broke a chain on it but threw it off a few times as a kid. Other concerns?

also for the electric start on the predator does it require a riding mower/Atv battery or can I use one with just two metals spade tbs? Like I have a toro super recycler electric start mower. Has a smallish battery with spade tabs. It doesn’t charge tarry cause it came with a separate charger you plug In. I havnt charged that battery in over 4 seasons of mowing. Original battery from 2013. Still fires the mower.

if this would work I’d rather go this route. However seems like the 420 cc predator charges while it runs so it might destroy that type battery.

input appreciated. Thanks. I just wanna get it going so as my boys get big enough they can enjoy it like I did.

 

[madprofessor]

Can't answer the battery and charging questions, but action's called for elsewhere. If going the 13 hp. route, good for you, the electric start is a very desirable thing. It's also desirable to have the torque of the 13 hp. as opposed to the lesser torque you have just hotrodding a 6.5 hp. on up to 13+ hp., the torque increase doesn't match the hp. increase.
The action called for is to add a 40 series (8-16 hp.) symmetrical torque converter to the new 13 hp.. This replaces having a centrifugal clutch to put on the motor shaft, the driver/clutch is part of the TC. Here's what there actually is to consider.......... If the kart currently is using #35 chain (3/8") and axle sprocket, it would be in your best interests to graduate to 1/2" chain of either #41 or #420 size. Don't absolutely have to change, just a very good idea to do so from the start.
Look at this link detailing chain and sprocket sizes to see how things work together.......... Chain for Go Kart, Mini Bike | GoKarts USA®......... You'll see that I've left out #40 size of 1/2" chain, and you'll see why, the #40 sprockets can only be used with #40 chain, while the #41 and #420 sprockets can be used with any of the various 1/2" chains. Therefore, to avoid confusion, I just say unilaterally to not mess with #40 anything, no sprockets, no chains.

 

[Denny]

I had that same kart as you it sounds like but in 1988. Do not listen to madprofessor, in this case he has no clue what he is talking about. First off it is equipped factory with the 40 series cvt and 40 chain from the factory. Use only Genuine Comet belts.
It sounds like the float is set too low. I myself personally would do everything in my power to keep the 8hp flathead. It is a darned good engine. If you must change to a Predator the 420 is the way to go. Use a regular lawn tractor small battery. Securely mounted of course. It should be able to withstand the vibration and shock of riding. The 8 hp is a great kart I wish I had mine back everyday. The rear 22” tires and 42 mph top speed made it fun and able to take on any mud hole.

 

[Rhizzlebop]

I had that same kart as you it sounds like but in 1988. Do not listen to madprofessor, in this case he has no clue what he is talking about. First off it is equipped factory with the 40 series cvt and 40 chain from the factory. Use only Genuine Comet belts.
It sounds like the float is set too low. I myself personally would do everything in my power to keep the 8hp flathead. It is a darned good engine. If you must change to a Predator the 420 is the way to go. Use a regular lawn tractor small battery. Securely mounted of course. It should be able to withstand the vibration and shock of riding. The 8 hp is a great kart I wish I had mine back everyday. The rear 22” tires and 42 mph top speed made it fun and able to take on any mud hole.

I can tell you for sure I have no clue. Don’t even know what a float is. The guy I took it to works on lawnmowers and other small engine equipment every day. He’s a younger guy prob early 30s but he has a whole big building business doing this daily. Other shows I called said they wouldn’t even work on go karts. I personally do not have the knowledge or the time to dive into it.
I know this is the all black one with the big knobby rear tires (currently losing air so maybe need tubes) and the fronts look more like riding mower rear tires. Much less aggressive tread. Has the roll cage over the engine only.
When I was messing eith it I got it to fire on carueator spray but wouldn’t suck. I had drained the gas and got it flowing to the carb but that’s where my knowledge atopped. This guy suggested I buy a fuel tank (plastic) and a new carb and he’d get it going. He’s had it since May. Granted my fault since July for being out of town a lot and then he was sick with covid so I stayed away several weeks.
he says he has tried sealer and tubber gaskets etc and he thinks he’ll have it not leaking and in a couple days it’s leaking.
I don’t know anyone to take it to. I wish I could keep the engine. It’s an 8 hp. Is it true they were really much more than 8 back then?

I want it to live on but I don’t know much about it. He’s not even charging for any current efforts and he said I could come get it or we could look at a new engine.
That led to the predator talk abs if the 13 hp is a good match up that’s what I wanna do.

I asked about the output shaft matching and he said it should but if not he’d use an adapter. I asked about it fitting and he said yes there’s plenty of room.

I don’t wanna do this spend 400 on the motor plus a battery and then he says oh now the clutch won’t work or the torque converter won’t fit. I bought a new belt and brake band as part of what I want him to put on.
I recall buying a comet belt because the angle was critical. 40 or 400 kind of rings a bell from research I did on the belt.

I don’t wanna put something on there too weak for power. I also don’t wanna out something on there and it’s so strong that it starts snapping chains and clutches apart.

I do recall it went about 40 mph when I rode it. I wanna be able to take it out somewhere once I get it going and ride the boys and eventually them ride.
If I’m gonna spend 400 on the motor plus the labor to do it I figure I might as well go as big as I can and add the battery.

I live in South Carolina and just want it running. I’ve had it for 31 years and don’t want to get rid of it for any price.

am I right on what this guy said that an 8 hp engine now would not be as strong as this old one? Also I didn’t follow what the other poster above said about the torque. Was he saying the 13 hp won’t have as much torque as the 8 or it would have too much. I do t know.

 

[Denny]

The Predator would be a good engine to replace it with. You may want him to put the original carb back on and just clean it out. I do not have a lot of faith in your small engine guy. I think he is an idiot for not wanting to disassemble the carb and try to clean in the first place. The 8 hp was kind of torquey to begin with, the 420 should be a good fit. If I remember right the 8 had a 1” diameter out put shaft and so does the Predator.

 

[Rhizzlebop]

The Predator would be a good engine to replace it with. You may want him to put the original carb back on and just clean it out. I do not have a lot of faith in your small engine guy. I think he is an idiot for not wanting to disassemble the carb and try to clean in the first place. The 8 hp was kind of torquey to begin with, the 420 should be a good fit. If I remember right the 8 had a 1” diameter out put shaft and so does the Predator.

Yea. He may be the problem. I called several places. Most won’t even touch go karts. Only deal with mowers and commercial stuff like generators and pressure washers.
This guy spoke well and so I took it to him.

some repair guys around here never answer the phone, or sound like they are drunk if they do answer. Some basically work from what looks like a pile of crap in the front yard or garage.
This guy has a nice building and seems to do a ton of mower wo4k at a legit business so I went with him. He indicated he had had good luck in the past with these replacement carbs. I dunno. I can call him back and ask that.

otherwise I’m leaning toward the predator 13 hp. From what you’re saying it’s a nice replacement that should fit.

 

[madprofessor]

???????? Don't know what part I got wrong, except maybe I didn't know that when you got it 31 years ago that way back then it already came with a #40 chain on a 40 series CVT. I was only on my 3rd marriage back then.
I absolutely stand by my assertion that if you put a 13hp. on it like you were considering that you should add a 40 series CVT, and Denny knows I agree that genuine Comet belts are the best and often solve all the CVT problems folks have. My mention of how a CVT negates the need to purchase a centrifugal clutch was only to provide info should you decide to retrofit a 13hp. and be unsure whether to go CVT or clutch-only.

to avoid confusion, I just say unilaterally to not mess with #40 anything, no sprockets, no chains.

The above statement about #40 chain and sprockets is truly just a lazy opinion only, keeps me from confusing myself. Of course and certainly and for sure there's nothing wrong with a matching #40 chain and #40 sprocket. It's just wanting to make changes later where I'd likely confuse myself, so I just personally avoid #40 anything, and telling others the same keeps me from getting blamed for their mismatches later. And I did clearly state "to avoid confusion".

 

[Denny]

Mad if you read my post again. That kart came from the factory with a 40 series cvt and 40 chain. Why on earth should he have to reinvent the wheel when he has a set of mags? The smaller 5hp had a 30 series and 35 chain factory.

 

[madprofessor]

Why on earth should he have to reinvent the wheel when he has a set of mags?

Not sure what Denny's talking about with the mags allegorically, but literally I bet a set would look pretty cool on a kart. Something like a miniature set of Keystone Classics. Anyhoo, never seen a flathead gokart engine that I was aware of as being same at the time, 8hp. or otherwise although I may have looked right at several, just not known it.
Apparently those who were getting knowledgeable about gokart engines while I was out being Superman for almost 4 decades have classed your 8hp. in the classic if not iconic category, so do keep that engine even if you do put a Predator 420 on your kart like you've been considering. Too bad your small engine guy's given up on it and said you can come get it.
If your existing 40 series CVT will fit on the 420 and the #40 chain fits everything like original you're already ahead of the game, and you said the new belt's a Comet brand. If your existing battery will work with the 420 it sounds like the limit of your costs would be the 420 itself.
Maybe you can learn enough on this forum from those who know old iconic engines better than myself that you can bench-repair that 8hp. yourself eventually, maybe put it back in the kart to have a "numbers matching" antique, and have yourself a ready 420 for a custom build at some future time.

 

[Rhizzlebop]

Not sure what Denny's talking about with the mags allegorically, but literally I bet a set would look pretty cool on a kart. Something like a miniature set of Keystone Classics. Anyhoo, never seen a flathead gokart engine that I was aware of as being same at the time, 8hp. or otherwise although I may have looked right at several, just not known it.
Apparently those who were getting knowledgeable about gokart engines while I was out being Superman for almost 4 decades have classed your 8hp. in the classic if not iconic category, so do keep that engine even if you do put a Predator 420 on your kart like you've been considering. Too bad your small engine guy's given up on it and said you can come get it.
If your existing 40 series CVT will fit on the 420 and the #40 chain fits everything like original you're already ahead of the game, and you said the new belt's a Comet brand. If your existing battery will work with the 420 it sounds like the limit of your costs would be the 420 itself.
Maybe you can learn enough on this forum from those who know old iconic engines better than myself that you can bench-repair that 8hp. yourself eventually, maybe put it back in the kart to have a "numbers matching" antique, and have yourself a ready 420 for a custom build at some future time.

I do appreciate your inputs. I do not know. Maybe it is a classic, maybe you’re being a hair sarcastic. Lol.

I can bring back the old engine but don’t really have anything to do with it.
I called this morning to see if he did in fact try to clean the old carb. I’m not certain he did but he said he did. He said it was bad. Again I don’t know which is 2hy I took it somewhere I thought could get it running.

im not thrilled @bout buying an engine but my overall priority is to get it running and my kids to ride it like I did.
Since this predator 420 charges as it runs I’ll have to go typical lawn tractor battery. The type on my toro push mower you just plug it up to charge every couple seasons. But the mower doesn’t charge it. So I think that would destroy the battery.

he’s gonna mount a holder box for it behind the seat and mount the new motor and get it going.
He also mentioned he might need a longer belt, depending if the one I bought fits when he gets the new motor mounted. (Not sure if it’ll have to sit further back in the slots. Not sure they make incrementally longer ones but I dunno.

Anyone here know about a remote kill switch that if my kid is riding this I could kill the engine from my hand if gets in trouble? Is this a good idea, and s8mple, or more trouble than it’s 2orth? I also am putting a new kill switch on the steering wheel as it broke off years ago and I rode a while with just touching the wires to kill the engine.

 

[Denny]

I know they make a remote kill switch, but I don’t know of anyone ever using one though. I would hold off on buying a new belt until you have the new engine mounted to get a proper measurement.
I was talking metaphorically when I mentioned reinventing the wheel. Sorry for the confusion. But you could bolt on a set of golf kart mags as they are the same lug pattern.

 

[madprofessor]

Like wow! Had no idea how much those remote killers cost. BMI has one for $85...............
Remote Engine Shut Off for 12V & Non-12V Vehicles | BMI Karts And Parts
This one claims a 110 yard range for just $24, but you'd have to cut the molex plug off and wire it in however you can............
Amazon.com: Saihisday Dual Remote Control Start Kill Switch Compatible with Chinese 55cc-125c Taotao Kazuma Roketa Sunl ATV : Automotive

 

[Rhizzlebop]

Like wow! Had no idea how much those remote killers cost. BMI has one for $85...............
Remote Engine Shut Off for 12V & Non-12V Vehicles | BMI Karts And Parts
This one claims a 110 yard range for just $24, but you'd have to cut the molex plug off and wire it in however you can............
Amazon.com: Saihisday Dual Remote Control Start Kill Switch Compatible with Chinese 55cc-125c Taotao Kazuma Roketa Sunl ATV : Automotive

Hey. Thanks for doing a little googling. I’ve souped up powerwheels for the boys on 18v batteries But with 12v lights so I’m familiar with wiring and branching a 12 v circuit. That shouldn’t be a problem. $25 for that kind of range seems worth it. I’ll check it out.

I did wanna say I spare I ate you guys input to the matter. I don’t work on gas engines. Not my forte. I trusted this guy and still am trying to but I admittedly don’t know his whole skill set. Speaking with a little exaggeration I also can’t drag this issue out for years between trying to find others to work on it and procrastinating the matter because I don’t know the magic bullet to fix what I have or the magic wizard to do it. So I can’t drag this out 10 years and then the boys will be too big and onto cars. I just wanna get it running and have some fun for a few years while they are younger and I don’t really care what it costs within reason.

I’ve seen my father take small engines to people before to fix them and it drags on and the guy can’t really fix anything and it ends up sitting out in the weather for months and becomes useless. That was another reason I too it to this guy is he has a nice big shop and said he’d keep it inside. He even said he wished he’d had one of these as a kid and thought it was pretty cool and a little neatalgic and so I think he genuinely wants to help me get it fixed. He’s not even charging me for any of his failed efforts to clean existing or replace the carb and tank. Which is great. He said originally I could come get it no charge. But that’s when the engine replacement convo started in July on the phone because I was like there’s no reason to bring it back here if it’s not working. It’ll just delay the goal.

so I’m doing g the best I can with what I have available to work with. And I hate I can’t get the old engine running. But it is what it is I guess.

 

[Denny]

Replace the engine with the Predator. Keep the old engine to work and learn on with the boys. This way when the have a family and want to restore grandpa’s old kart they can look back on the good times they had with you learning how to do so. Trust me they will never forget. That way you get to make 2 sets of memories for the price of one. We can help you repair the engine and the fuel tank also.

 

[USAMAC]

My 8yr old son and I have spent the entire day doing just that with all of our small motor equipment. Doing maintenance and cleaning out carbs on a blower I thought was dead (only to find a small leave in it that caused it to not run for so long!) We've had a blast and working on his Kart has been a ton of fun already. I've learned a ton from these guys and my son has gotten so engaged in it with me. I kind of wish I was in your shoes needing to replace the kart's motor with a 420cc Predator and had the 8hp available to tinker internally with. I wish I knew more about your motor so I could look up some YT videos on people tearing them down. I've love to know what makes it work!

 

[Functional Artist]

Replace the engine with the Predator. Keep the old engine to work and learn on with the boys. This way when the have a family and want to restore grandpa’s old kart they can look back on the good times they had with you learning how to do so. Trust me they will never forget. That way you get to make 2 sets of memories for the price of one. We can help you repair the engine and the fuel tank also.

Yup

If your "small engine guy" is willing to mount a new Predator for ya, do it

Don't wait
...get 'er going
...& go have some fun, with them boys