Need quick help for engines and batteries for my hybrid gokart

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manojkumarjym

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i am going to design a gokart for a competition. i am a mechanical engineer. i have designed the mechanical specifications. but the batteries to be used is 48V (maximum) and 1KW dc motor. i need a help for designing the electrical specifications.
i need to know what type of batteries to be used
* Ni cad battery
*Li ion battery or * lead acid battery

total weight of gokart is 200 KG (including driver)
Motor to be used is 1KW only and batteries of max 48V

what type of motor i need to use and battery?? it must run for 30 minutes (or more if can).. i need calculations also...
please reply fast...
 

landuse

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I unfortunately don't know much electrical. Research is the only FAST option on this forum. There are just not enough members here with electrical knowledge to give you a fast answer
 

OzFab

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It matters not what type of battery you use, the amperage or amp/hour rating is what's important, the higher the better, then you need to find a happy medium between running time & battery weight...
 

manojkumarjym

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i too don't know much about electrical works. I just need a calculation for the following specifications of my gokart..
200 KG (incl. driver)
motor to be used is 1KW ( 1KW is the max. allowed for the competition)
Batteries of max 48V (48V is max. allowed and im confused with wide range of batteries and its units)
do i need a controller circuit??
im almost ready with all mechanical parts, but these electrical thing is stopping me..
( I read the above 2 threads mentioned.. can anyone help me out with the same calculations with above data.. )
 

manojkumarjym

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@Fabroman
i consulted upon a local battery dealer and he specified me 180Ah 12V lead acid battery..
is this OK for my hybrid gokart?? how much it would weigh?? or any lithium battery can i use??
 

dcastillo

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@Fabroman
i consulted upon a local battery dealer and he specified me 180Ah 12V lead acid battery..
is this OK for my hybrid gokart?? how much it would weigh?? or any lithium battery can i use??

That is way to big of a battery. What you need is probably 4 x 12v 20Ahr batteries.... that should give you 30 min runtime easy.
Hook them in series for 48v @20Ahr.
All I know about lithium is they are to expensive for me :)
-Danny
 

itsid

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Well hi.. and :welcome2:
Yes you need a controller to run the motor.

allow me to ask: you said you're a mechanical engineer, and that tells me:
you MUST know the very basics of math already.

So the question I have is :
How is it possible that you cannot put your numbers in a preassembled and labeled formula?

And the most simple of them all... since the motor size is NOT negotiable,
all you need to know is how many batteries do you need to run it for 30 mins at least.

Your motor has 1000W (oh.. is that mechanical or electrical power?? HUUUGE DIFFERENCE)
anyways:
Watts are Amps times Volts
known is watts and volts..

1000W (electrical power) means a current of ~21 Amps
1000W (mechanical power) means ~1250W electrical power so a current of ~26Amps

So @ 48V you need 4 12V batteries with a useable energy of ~13Ah each to run the kart for half an hour.

The point is, what energy of the individual cell can be used and what remains unused (to keep the cell alive and/or the make the controller happy)

A good controller comes with a drop off voltage preset, generally that's ~90% of the nominal voltage.
your nominal voltage is 48 so the controller might shut down the motor as soon your batteries cannot provide more than 43.2Volts anymore

A fresh & fully charged 12V battery (as funny as it sounds) provides up to 14V (13.8V)
12.9V the very least...

If we now assume a cutoff at 41V that'd be each cell MUST provide 10.8V
And for a modern lead acid battery that means 90% of the cells capacity can be used
ladezustand-batterie_4857.gif

you need 13Ah at the very least means you need 4
good quality 12V cells bigger than 14.4Ah each.
based on the above assumptions.

Now, as soon as you have the motor and controller,
you can measure and calculate the real powerdraw and read the cutoff voltage from the manual

and then use these REAL numbers to find out what batteries you need.

personally I'd take the safe route and get a batpack twice as big just to make sure it holds up,
since batteries (especially lead acid ones) don't like a high current constantly drawn from them very much, and they tend to overheat and that drops the voltage by a good amount.

So get yourself 30AH batteries and you should be good for ~45mins
they're relatively cheap in lead acid (~45 USD) and not too heavy (~10-12kg)
so you spend less than 200$ and carry less than 50kg in batteries.
a LiFE bat pack would only weigh half of that;
but costs of ~100 USD per 10Ah 12V cell
would cause it to cost 1200 USD in the end. (five times as much)

'sid
 

manojkumarjym

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@itsid
these are the general rules/specs.
**Teams can use 1kw of energy for the tractive system of their
hybrid karts.
**Normal Low Voltage and Tractive System Voltage: The
maximum permitted operating voltage for is 48 VDC. The
maximum operating voltage is defined as the maximum measured
accumulator voltage during normal charging conditions.
So im going to use 1KW electrical power motor (i think so) and what is the voltage rating of that motor?? 24V or 36V or 48V???
in the gokart event, which is to be held for about 10 days, will the battery be able to charge up before every day?
Also there is a preliminary test in which the gokart is tested for the time taken to cross 100m flat surface with only electrical acceleration (engines shut off). so what are the specs. now??
 

itsid

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1kW of energy... that's an information that's utterly useless
kW isn't even a measurement for energy; that'd be Joule (or Watt seconds);
Watt is a measurement for power; HUUUUGE DIFFERENCE!

And to be honest.. I'd get the nicest labeled motor I could;
and that'd be an electric vehicle motor with a constant rating of 1kW!
(first that's mechanical power, not electrical, and it's the constant not the peak power...)
in peak that'd be something like 1600W of mechanical power and 3000W electrical power.

There aren't many 24 or 36V 1kW motors out there (ev motors)
so so a 48V would be my first choice.. if you can get a "48V 1000W my1020 motor" made by unite motors.. it's cheap (~100-120 USD)
but it's not been made anymore but you still find them new in some shops.

How long your batteries need to charge depends on your charger and the quality (and type) of the cells you end up using..


'sid
 

itsid

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How to NOT get an answer....

Okay Know what.. Now I'm p155ed!!!

I just got a PM with the title:
Urgent Help required for my Go Kart
manojkumarjym said:
This is my thread : Click Here

im going to use 48V 1000W Motor
is it enough for carrying ~200Kg Go Kart??
Will it have trouble in accelerating??
what max speed will it get??

i need to run it for atleast 30 min with Electric Motor powered by batteries. Is 30Ah lead acid battery is enough? how much volt it needs??

My seniors say that the motor turns off while turning the go kart. it is one of the serious issue. can the above motor sustain with turnings?? how can i solve the issue of turning off motor??

* I NEED MOTOR RATINGS (SPECIFICATIONS)
* BATTERY SPECIFICATIONS
* SOLUTION FOR PROBLEM: MOTOR TURNING OFF WHILE TURNING GO KART

Just reply with calculations for supporting your answer.. i must submit a report on the same..

...unabridged PM
no "hello.." no "please" no politeness whatsoever. :toetap05:

There's a reason for it being YOUR college class; so do your research!
I gladly help if I can, but I will not do your homework;
surely not at your command!!:mad:

if you want to skip the politeness and bawl orders in my direction you need to pay for that... and I doubt you'd like my hourly rate.

'sid
 

OzFab

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There's a reason for it being YOUR college class; so do your research!
I gladly help if I can, but I will not do your homework;
surely not at your command!!:mad:

if you want to skip the politeness and bawl orders in my direction you need to pay for that... and I doubt you'd like my hourly rate.

'sid

Well said :thumbsup:

Manojkumarjym, as is often stated, we are here to help, not do the work for you! Many have offered advice & assistance but, it seems you have ignored most of it, including a request for your location...

IMHO, if this scenario is too difficult for you to understand/comprehend, maybe mechanical engineering isn't the correct field for you...
 

manojkumarjym

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hey guys.. sorry for everything.. im already in a situation of total confusion.. i almost prepared reports on what engine, chasis, tyres etc to be used in my cart and still struck with my electrical works... im not commanding anyone, just need your advices and help from you guys.. im just 16 yrs old and i agree that im still behave like a child.. and this is my first project.. so please dont ignore me.. i need your help guys.. please respond to my PM.. its my humble request... and im from India..
 
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