T-bucket go kart

[Cbreiter]

Hello to all, I am new to go karting, actually I got my first one about 2 years ago, now I have 3 in total, which if I can figure out how to, I will post some pics of them. Anyway, I have worked around manufacturing shops for the past 8 or so years, and I thought it would be cool to build my own, rather than having a bought one. I was thinking to go with a 1x2 frame, with no suspension. I have a lot of light tubing on hand, as well as some heavy wall 1x2. I have a donor lawn tractor, which I was hoping to use some of the wheels and the gear box out of. I have several options for an engine, I have a BE 15 hp, a Honda 5 hp, a powerfist 6.5 hp (What I have on all my other karts), and a 6 hp Tecumseh powersport. I was thinking to use the t-bucket style, and mount the engine ahead of the passenger area, and have the gas tank above the rear axle. I haven't really attempted anything this large scale before, but I thought it would be cool to try. Any input would be great. I'm hoping to get it to do about 70 kmh (not mph, lol)

 

[landuse]

Welcome to the forum.

 

[Orange Krate]

I started building a t-bucket style go-kart out of a lawn tractor once. I chopped off the front end and dropped it by flipping the axles upside down. Then used 1/2"x2" tubing and made a "Z"ed frame that fir a wheel barrow for the body. It was a great theory but the turning radius was HORRIBLE! As a resut I never put power to the ground to finished it. I've still got it and will post some pics for you. I keep it around for set dressing

 

[OzFab]

Which one of those engines has a vertical shaft? All the builds of this type (front engined) use vertical shaft engines & a belt to either a gearbox or a diff setup

 

[Cbreiter]

All of my engines have a horizontal shaft, and the gearbox is set up with a horizontal shaft out the side. What my plan had been, was to run a chain down from the engine (from a centrifical clutch) to a keyed shaft, and have two sprockets on the shaft, to change the angle the chain runs, then I was hoping to hook a chain up to the gearbox, and cut the axles off fairly short, so I can mount the gearbox in about the middle of the Kart, maybe off to the one side, IDK. Then I was planing to have keyways machined into the stubs, and have a chain going to each rear wheel (on keyed shafts of course), and have a gear ratio difference, so the gearbox doesn't have to spin too fast for me to get my top end goal I'm going for. I hadn't thought too much about the steering yet, but I was planning to fabricate something. I wasn't planning to re-use the tractor steering.

 

[OzFab]

All of my engines have a horizontal shaft, and the gearbox is set up with a horizontal shaft out the side. What my plan had been, was to run a chain down from the engine (from a centrifical clutch) to a keyed shaft, and have two sprockets on the shaft, to change the angle the chain runs, then I was hoping to hook a chain up to the gearbox, and cut the axles off fairly short, so I can mount the gearbox in about the middle of the Kart, maybe off to the one side, IDK. Then I was planing to have keyways machined into the stubs, and have a chain going to each rear wheel (on keyed shafts of course), and have a gear ratio difference, so the gearbox doesn't have to spin too fast for me to get my top end goal I'm going for.

The reason for my point is that a chain off a horizontal shaft has "height" to it whereas, off a vertical shaft, it sits flat. On the other hand, a horizontal chain (as opposed to shaft) will tend to flex, causing alignment issues. Sounds like you have it all figured out though...

I hadn't thought too much about the steering yet, but I was planning to fabricate something. I wasn't planning to re-use the tractor steering.

Oh good 'coz, it's nowhere close to being suitable...

 

[Cbreiter]

Yeah, I'm pritty sure that the first sharp turn I made, would end me up with no steering, which, could be very scary. I think I can probably track down some small tie rod ends, and use them.
Any ideas you guys have are greatly appreciated, I have done quite a bit if wrenching on cars, but this is kinda different, lol.
I was thinking about getting a tach from a single cylinder motorcycle and installing that on it, but that comes after everything is driving. Will I have problems with the gearbox I have with using a centrifugal clutch on the engine? it is an old 3 speed out of a MF lawn tractor.

Oh, and here are some pictures of one of my current karts, and some I used to have.

Here is one I bought, and then sold because I didn't fit in it, lol

And here is a home made one I had, but sold this summer.

 

[Cbreiter]

Yeah, I have a feeling that steering is adequate for less than 20 kmh. I really appreciate any input that anyone has. I have done a lot if automotive repair, but this is my first major fabrication attempt (hopefully it all works out). I have been thinking I may be better to build something smaller to begin with, just so I can see how everything will work out. What are your guys thoughts on it? Oh, and I posted an album today of past and present rides (go karts)

 

[OzFab]

I have done quite a bit if wrenching on cars, but this is kinda different, lol.

Meh, same concepts only smaller. My background is in automotive too (mechanical & panel beating) & I've always had a strong interest in fabrication & sheet metal work but, didn't like the hours

Will I have problems with the gearbox I have with using a centrifugal clutch on the engine? it is an old 3 speed out of a MF lawn tractor.

That depends on the input on the gearbox; post some pics...

I have been thinking I may be better to build something smaller to begin with, just so I can see how everything will work out. What are your guys thoughts on it?

Some people, including myself, did a "practice run" by building a kart for their kids & ironed out the bugs along the way. That way, when you get to building yours, you're familiar with the common dos & don'ts & end up winning a build off

 

[Cbreiter]

Well, I don't have any kids, but in the album I posted, the two with the slicks are used for kids activities, though doe to the do's and dont's of this forum, I can't say what the activities are run for (it starts with C, and ends in in H, and rhymes with lurch). But I do have a friend who is really into hot rods, but loves go-karts, and was trying to convince me that he should take one of mine to go back and forth to classes at the university. I managed to convince him that this may be dangerous (possibly for him and others, lol), and probably very illegal. I will take some pictures of the gearbox tomorrow (in daylight). Maybe I can build my friend a kart first though, I'm sure he will put it to good use, though the longevity of it is to be questioned. Then I can figure it all out, and make the next one better, after I have had some practice. Btw, does anyone know an easy way to attach rear wheels to the drive axle, without welding them solid? maybe something I haven't thought of? They currently are a flange bearing style.

 

[Cbreiter]

Also, what size, and wall tubing do you recommend for a frame? I have lots of tubing from bike frames, aswell some from those portable garages.

 

[OzFab]

the two with the slicks are used for kids activities, though due to the do's and dont's of this forum, I can't say what the activities are run for (it starts with C, and ends in in H, and rhymes with lurch).

You can say the word church, you can even tell us you're involve with one, just don't go into too much detail...

We don't have a problem with anyone being religeous but, with all due respect, we just don't want to hear your views & opinions on the subject

Maybe I can build my friend a kart first though, I'm sure he will put it to good use, though the longevity of it is to be questioned. Then I can figure it all out, and make the next one better, after I have had some practice.

Great idea! Talk to him, he may even pay for it

Btw, does anyone know an easy way to attach rear wheels to the drive axle, without welding them solid? maybe something I haven't thought of? They currently are a flange bearing style.

Never, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever weld anythingto an axle!

There are many ways to attach wheels (& other parts) to an axle, NONE of which involve welding but, it depends on what type of axle & what wheels as to which method is used.

Also, what size, and wall tubing do you recommend for a frame? I have lots of tubing from bike frames, aswell some from those portable garages.

For a small kart, 1" thin wall tube (round or square makes no difference) is usually sufficient

 

[Cbreiter]

Thanks for the clarification in the rules. The tubing I have is about 1" to 2.5", I have various sizes, so, that should be adequate, assuming I don't put a monster engine on it. Now for the question on how to spin the wheels, without welding them to the axle. I have flange bearing style wheels, now on the blue corvette kart (pictured above) it has wheels with flange bearings aswell, but the one side has a elongated tube in the one side of the wheel with a plate (with a hole in it) welded to it, which the sprocket and brake attach to. I could do something like this, but my biggest issue is trying to get it straight. My other two karts have a 1 1/4" shaft for the axle, which it is easy to put a drive to because they have wheels that have a keyway in them. I have contemplated about getting a piece of thick walled pipe (with a 3/4" centre) lathed down so it would fit inside the wheel (with a larger ring on it to but up to the edge of the wheel), with the flange bearings removed, and then broaching it so that it would have a keyway. Then once this was all finished, welding it to the wheel, so then I have a keyed wheel. Is there an easier way?

Oh, and here are some pictures of the gearbox I have. also of the tractor it will eventually come out of.

 

[OzFab]

So, the gearbox is actually a transaxle (gearbox & diff/axle in a single unit); that's a pretty chunky piece of hardware to have in the midsection of a kart; why not simply use it as the rear axle?

Wheels with bearings & flanges are usually for single drive or dead axle setups (the axle is part of the frame & the rear wheels spin on it). If you can figure a safe way to turn a bearing wheel into a fixed wheel, go for it.

There are many keyed hubs available, depending on the type of rims you have; post some pics of your rims so we have a visual of what you're trying to do (I can't quite picture it)

 

[Cbreiter]

The reason I wanted to put it in the centre of the cart, is so that then the shifter would be in the right place to easily shift the cart. Maybe I should abandon the idea of a transmission in it, and do something different, not sure what though. I do have a transmission from a VW rabbit, but something tells me that would be major overkill, not to mention that it weighs about 80 lbs, without any oil in it, or axles on it. I want to try to make the kart as light as possible. Something that can roast the tires (or lift the front tires), and still go a good speed, and not be real top heavy. Maybe if I went with the 15 hp I have, and went with about a 50 tooth or so rear gear, that might do it for me? I was also hoping to use the wheels off the lawn tractor on the t-bucket. I'm not wanting to build a race cart, just something fun to cruse in, and lay down some power (kinda like a hot rod).

Here is a picture of the wheels I have.

Here is idea I had for a kart, but I wanted to get your guys opinion on it. It's for a posi track/locking rear axle, but with having both wheels freewheel during declaration (to make turning easier). Let me know what you think.

 

[Cbreiter]

Maybe if you guys can suggest a set of wheels, and hubs for me, that would be best. I do use Ebay some, but keep in mind that I am in Canada, so they have to be able to be shipped here. Also one other consideration, is that I can get up to a 1" keyed shaft easily, but 1 1/4" is not so readily available. Thanks so much!

 

[OzFab]

Calling Doc Sprocket...

If that pics is identical to the wheels you have, rethink them; the bearings in those wheels are flimsy, low speed chinese bearings. However, if yours have been sitting in some guys attic for a few years, they may be ok.

1" is more common than 1 1/4" so, finding appropriate wheels shouldn't be too difficult; lawn tractors are a good source, check your local junkyards

 

[Cbreiter]

Those are the wheels I have, straight from Princess Auto. I have had good luck replacing them with bearings from napa in the past, and using those ones (that I took out) on the wheeler cart, or wheel barrows. But anyway, I think I may have found some (wheels that fit a keyed shaft) on an old snow blower I have, I think it has 4 or 5 inch wheels (with chains, lol). The reason I am scavenging as much as I can for this kart is that I am basicly building it out of things that I have, and not spending too much on it. I found a set of bicycle disc brake assemblies on ebay for about 25 bucks, so I was thinking to put two of them on this cart. We have nailed down that we are building one with a live rear axle, and I have a honda GC 160 engine to put on it. I have a #35 Hilliard clutch to put on it, and I have wheels fro the front. I'm figuring out a steering shaft as of yet, but this is ment to be a learning process, I'm sure I can probably recycle those bearings on the steering shaft without too much issue. What can we do to the engine to make it put out a little extra oomf? it already has no governer, and I have a header flange for it (had a whole wack of them laser cut at work, cause all the honda, and clone seem to use this flange). I think it may need rejetting, as currently it will shoot flames about 2" out the exhaust at full throttle, lol. Would swapping out the filter help at all (maybe with a high volume foam one)? I was also thinking of maybe doing a porting job on it. I have a friend who does it on car heads, who I'm sure could help me with it (probably for almost free). Sorry for being so all over the place, but it's kinda my process. On my next kart I will be looking to spend more money (seeing as how I'm not giving it away, to a collage student). Also I have been seeing some go karts with the fuel tank under the steering column, do you need a fuel pump to run this setup? I appreciate all the help you have been so far.

 

[firemanjim]

For the tank to be below the carb, yes, you need a fuelpump. Its called a pulse pump and works off vacumm taken from intake.....
Hey can you tell me more about the last kart pictured? Is that built with a vw swing axle rear end and a 6.5hp kart engine? How well did that set up work?

 

[Oxymoron]

Cbreiter,

Love the kart idea! So much in fact, that I've had the same idea for awhile... but unfortunately haven't taken any action.

Hopefully when I see some progress on your build, it will nudge me into action. I have a scooter with a GY6 that will be a donor.

Look forward to watching your progress