Coleman CT200U-EX

[Rat]

The little Hisun 196cc runs great, but it has some wrinkles I want to iron out... the seach function proved useless.

For the time being it has been head swapped to a 27/25 Predator Hemi head on account of the exhaust valve dropping oil down the bore. I did this primarily to rule out bad rings without opening the case... which I ended up doing to 86 the nylon cam gear for a 212 cam after researching a few things.

So one thing I'm trying to work out is if I should just get the valve seals (cheapest option) and put the original small valve 14cc head back on... OR
Spring for an 18cc with 27/25 valves and and a flat top 68mm slug to make up the CR loss.

From what I can tell there's not enough chamber to have the valves reamed and reseated, and it's no doubt the most expensive option

The other thing bugging me is the governor. I don't really want to go all out in upgrades and remove the gov, but I can't get it to to rev higher without the governor snapping the rpm down fairly aggressively when it engages which basically leads to a surging behavior where it wants to go like hell and the gov delays it's agressive rejection notice.

Nothing is hanging up, except the bottom 5% of the throttle cable on release but that has no effect given its spring related.

I have half the mind to swap the Hisun with the Ducar 212 on my shifter bike build because the Ducar is just a scary potent engine for that frame build in particular

 

[Rat]

Wow... when I'm seeking specific inputs, I don't get any; when I don't really need it and am somewhere between venting and confirming theory everybody, their mama, and inbred cousin has something useless to say.

 

[ezcome-ezgo]

Impeach the Governor!

 

[Rat]

Impeach the Governor!

I would, and want to... but I also don't want to blow it up, or put the work into it to prevent it from doing so.

 

[Denny]

I agree, impeach! Just don’t do any other mods to it. Let the valve float be your guide!

 

[Rat]

I agree, impeach! Just don’t do any other mods to it. Let the valve float be your guide!

Ok easy enough, I already kinda do that with the Mule anyway... if that 617cc sounds like it's revving too high, I assume it is and back off. I haven't distinctly heard it sound like it's floating as of yet.

I'm honesty not highly worried about the flywheel flying apart, especially since the valve will float before that happens purely because they are stock 10.8 springs and don't have split keepers so probably more like 9.75.

So back to the cylinder head... cheapest option is replace the seals and toss the original head on, but the butt dyno says it has more power with the Hemi head.

Obviously the 20cc (22cc?) chamber is a gross compression sacrifice over the original 168-F 14cc chamber... but could the valve size and configuration really be flowing so much better as to lose compression but gain noticeable power?

 

[Denny]

Yes that is a possibility. Just look at modern car and truck heads. Combustion chamber shape and swirl will also play a role. If it was me if I was going to keep it I’d rebuild the head. If I was just going to move it along I’d try replacing the seal.

 

[Rat]

Yes that is a possibility. Just look at modern car and truck heads. Combustion chamber shape and swirl will also play a role. If it was me if I was going to keep it I’d rebuild the head.

Could then be a combination of the Hemi chamber and valve sizes then... if that's the case I wouldn't expect a common 18cc wedge to be much better than the 168-F on account of the same chamber shape with only larger valves, and not quite as good as the Hemi.

I'd leave the Hemi on it but the valve cover got dropped and leaks from one lower corner when hot... nobody seems to have stock unmolested Hemi valve covers. Ive checked all the resources I can think of and they are all aftermarket or molested by some f★cktard putting a fitting for a pulse pump into them and then putting a stupid price on them.

If I was just going to move it along I’d try replacing the seal.

There's no trying about that, it just uses a style of seal I don't already have. I've got plenty of seals for 208cc and up (all rubber and attach to the valve guide), but that 168-F uses the metal cap ones pinned to the spring seat by the spring.

I've decided Im keeping it, I just don't see much point in hot rodding out a 196.

If I can't move the 80cc Motovox that came with it, I'll just chop that up and make something else from it's carcass. Might be interesting to stick a CRF70 fork and swing arm on it (will require a steer tube graft)

 

[Rat]

@Denny
I'm now undecided, I accidentally found a Billet rod with 68mm FT piston while seeing if I could find an unmolested stock Hemi valve cover... which I found a couple for about the same price as the seals for the wedge shipped.

I really don't want to hotrod a 196 because it feels like such a waste, but at the same time all but the piston is a direct fit swap. The struggle is getting real... damned the expensive toys.

Oh well, At least I ain't gotta share my toys with any snot faced little booger eaters... so potential safety concerns are of no significant consequence.

 

[panchothedog]

With your beaming description of children I'm going to take a wild guess and say you might be single.

 

[Rat]

With your beaming description of children I'm going to take a wild guess and say you might be single.

Well guess again

 

[panchothedog]

O K, then I'll guess you don't have any children. You know, those snot faced little booger eaters.

 

[Rat]

O K, then I'll guess you don't have any children. You know, those snot faced little booger eaters.

Guess again. Worse actually, 2 teen girls that most likely will not be providing grandchildren based on... well that nobody's business

 

[Denny]

Teen girls are the worst! No wonder you’re crabby!!!

 

[panchothedog]

Hope that you are wrong on the prediction of no grandchildren. Grandkids are very special. Helps make up for everything that it took to raise their parents. Things can change. Good luck. FWIW it was you negative description of children that prompted my reply. Not trying to pry.

 

[Rat]

Teen girls are the worst! No wonder you’re crabby!!!

My mama told me " The best part of having a little boy, is that's only one d*ck you gotta keep an eye on... a little girl you gotta watch every one single one of them"

 

[Rat]

FWIW it was you negative description of children that prompted my reply.

Negative my a*s! At a certain age group it's dead on accurate! Sorry, Not sorry the truth offended you.

I refer to them as little outbreak monkeys too, because it only takes one head of lice, or one suspicious cough and half the school ends up sick or staying home, parents and teachers included.

You've clearly lost touch with reality, or misplaced your sense of of humor but it's factual regardless.


Just know if ever I have offended anyone, It ain't my problem and never will be. Move along you delicate little flower, just move along

 

[Rat]

Deleted gov, whipped up a straight pipe, all that's left is to plug the top of the case and toss oil in it.

 

[panchothedog]

Not delicate and certainly no offended. I have thick enough skin to roll with or shrug off most anything. What I am is a lot older, and with a little different perspective of things, that's all. We all change in some ways as we age. Other things not so much. 65 years ago when I was 10, I wanted a go kart and of course couldn't afford one. Maybe that's why I now own 4 and a mini bike. Still love them. Wife doesn't understand, but doesn't put up a fuss either.
FWIW, I have a couple of 196's as well as a couple of 212's. By the seat of the pants there isn't that much difference. 16 cc's on 200+. My point is I think you are going to like that Coleman when you get it sorted out.

 

[Rat]

By the seat of the pants there isn't that much difference. 16 cc's on 200+. My point is I think you are going to like that Coleman when you get it sorted out.

I already do lol. I'm not running the straight pipe just yet because Coleman made it a point to "tamper proof" the carb to no end. The main jet cannot be removed on account of being 1 way ramp cut, the A/F is set and ground off without anyway to get it in further or out for replacing, and same for the idle stop screw... only thing that can be swapped is the #44 plastic pilot jet plug.

I'm pretty sure the clutch springs are shot because the clutch stays engaged off throttle and is responsible for the lurching I thought was the governor. Being a 5/8" shaft I'd have to stick a 212 crank in it or swap the engine outright to use a TC in place of the jackshaft assembly