Running a predator with no head gasket?

[tundrabeagle3]

I have a predator that wasn't starting until i put a little bit of oil in the spark plug hole. It started right right up until the plug got fouled with oil. According to the manual if it starts with oil in the cylinder it is a compression problem. The head gasket has been reused and is losing the black lining. I would like to know if its possible to run the predator with out a head gasket after doing whats in the thread below
VVVV


http://www.diygokarts.com/vb/showthread.php?t=7358

It looks like it was meant for flat heads but would it be possible to do on a clone? any body try it?

 

[landuse]

I am not too sure, but it doesn't sound like it would be a good idea

 

[devino246]

Your test indicates bad rings, not a bad headgasket.

 

[tundrabeagle3]

the engine is pretty new and the cylinder still looks new it says head gasket in the manual which would make sense since i have taken my head quite a few times off and reused the gasket

 

[devino246]

What manual is this? Go ahead and replace the head gasket, since you've had the head off.

 

[tundrabeagle3]

the predator manual, i don't have access to any predator gaskets

 

[Doc Sprocket]

I don't think it's the head gasket either. Rarely, if ever, will adding oil to the cylinder help with a bad head gasket.

 

[devino246]

the predator manual, i don't have access to any predator gaskets

Might as well throw that in the trash. adding oil directly will only increase compression two ways: 1) take up space in the combustion chamber and, being a liquid and thus incompressable, artificially increase compression, or 2) help the rings seal against the bore, allowing less of the a\f ratio to blow by the rings.

 

[Doc Sprocket]

I've got access to an old 1962 Fordson Super Dexta diesel tractor that's in such dire need of a rebuild, that if it sits for more than a couple months, we have to shoot oil in the cylinders. Compression is low enough that if the cylinders don't have a decent coat of oil, it won't start.

 

[tundrabeagle3]

It makes sense to me since the piston has oil on top it slings oil to the to the head area when pullstarting and seals the head gasket enough for it to start for a few seconds until the oil is burned away and loses its seal. I don't see how the rings could go bad in almost new engine

 

[Doc Sprocket]

Well, then I guess it comes down to this- change your head gasket.

When (if) that doesn't work, look into the rings. Personally, I don't see how the head gasket could go bad that fast either, eh?

 

[tundrabeagle3]

I am running a 14 cc honda head that has some small scratches . My spark plug hole is a little stripped but still holds the plug tight. My head gasket is still in one piece but it is loosing its black coating.

 

[FatCat]

Is it a metal gasket? If it is use permatex copper spray. Clean the gasket up(remove all black gunk you speak of) spray a thin even layer(enough to make it look like a copper gasket, dont get crazy) on one side, let it dry. Flip it over and do the other side. That'll seal it.

Can't find a replacement gasket?? Contact these guys for gaskets. They'll make any gasket you need for anything for a very fair price. He's making me a few head gaskets right now. I reccomend copper as it can be reused many times. Get the used copper gasket red hot with the torch and dip it in cold water. Think its called annealing. Makes the gasket soft again so it seals good.

http://www.coppergaskets.us/

With that said. To answer your question on can you run without a head gasket. I've never taken the time to really mess with an industrial or go kart style engine(I'm that wasteful American who buys new and gives the old ones away) but I assume they have a timing chain running up to the head like a 4 stroke atv. If so the answer is no. The chain will then be too long. Plus if it don't seal with a gasket there is no way you'll seal it dry provided the gasket
Being messed up wasn't causing the leak. The oil thing is a dead giveaway for rings not a head gasket. I suspect it needs rings or replaced.

 

[Doc Sprocket]

FatCat- No timing chain. It's an OHV engine, not an OHC. I think it could work, you'd just have to re-set valve lash, after verifying clearances.

 

[realfast89gt]

If the headgasket is intact, but just losing the outside coating i doubt it is leaking when properly tightened.

I would definately lean towards rings, have you pulled the piston and looked at them? The easiest way to determine this is simply put it all back together and do a dry compression test and then a wet compression test. If when adding oil for the wet test the compression is way higher, you know it is rings. Adding oil to the cylinder would not seal the headgasket enough to start it imo, i have never seen it do any good with a bad head gasket in an automoive engine.

 

[FatCat]

FatCat- No timing chain. It's an OHV engine, not an OHC. I think it could work, you'd just have to re-set valve lash, after verifying clearances.

Gotcha. Would bump compression a little for a small gain also. Definately have to check for clearance though.