I recently posted, but it was a big paragraph and I wanted to simplify. I bought a cu live axle that has stepped down ends. Unfortunately the stepped down ends are fully threaded, so the wheel is sitting on threads, obviously the axle and wheel spin as one, so it doesn't have to turn on the threads, but I was just wondering if we would have encounter play in the heel, or other issues, what they might be, and how to get around them. Also I’d like to know how dangerous it is as of right now (top speed is like 35mph). Thanks
Live axle
- Thread starter Barîb
- Start date
Karttekk
Well-known member
"I was just wondering if we would have encounter play in the heel"
Please elaborate. Do you mean play in the wheel? Try a sleeve that slips over the threads or call the vendor where you bought the axle.
Please elaborate. Do you mean play in the wheel? Try a sleeve that slips over the threads or call the vendor where you bought the axle.
Yes, play in the wheel is what I meant. What I guess I’m trying to is our axle ends are fully threaded with 5/8 inch OD to account for the wheel hub which runs a 5/8 axle through it. Unfortunately the axle end that wheel rests on, is fully threaded, basically meaning the wheel will be resting on the threads, this of course leaves no room for any kind of bushing, and while tape would make a temporary help, I’m looking for a more permanent, yet removable solution. This is once again only applicable if you all think it is an issue in the first place. Thanks
Denny
Canned Monster
It should last as long as no moisture gets in, no dirt or sand gets in and the nut is kept tight. The only sure fire fix is to get a different axle. Either the axle or the wheel will start to wear and then all will be lost.
madprofessor
"Loose Cannon Creations"
Got any extra axle? On my own 1" axle with 3/4" stepdown ends..............
I've got 1" straight-thru wheel hubs slid onto the ends of the 1" axle section, with the entire 3/4" stepdowns (2" long) sticking out beyond that. 1" locking collars keep the wheels from moving any further inward, which is where the outboard pillow block bearings are.
On the stepdowns, slid up against the wheels at the ends of the 1" section, there's a 3/4" ID washer that's about 1.5" OD, followed by a piece of common 1" water pipe I cut to act as a spacer, followed by an axle nut w/nylon insert. See attached picture taken during the very early part of this long-running build.
Note that I don't really even need to have a nut to hold the wheel on to begin with, another 1" locking collar would do the job fine. That's because the setscrews in the wheel hubs tightened down onto the 1/4" keystock in the axle keyway does most of the work already. I could have just cut the excess (the stepdown) off completely.
I would never trust just the tightness of an axle nut by itself to keep the wheel from spinning on the axle without any keystock. You have a keyway with a piece of keystock in those 5/8" threads, or does a wheel just free spin on there until you tighten the axle nut?
I've got 1" straight-thru wheel hubs slid onto the ends of the 1" axle section, with the entire 3/4" stepdowns (2" long) sticking out beyond that. 1" locking collars keep the wheels from moving any further inward, which is where the outboard pillow block bearings are.
On the stepdowns, slid up against the wheels at the ends of the 1" section, there's a 3/4" ID washer that's about 1.5" OD, followed by a piece of common 1" water pipe I cut to act as a spacer, followed by an axle nut w/nylon insert. See attached picture taken during the very early part of this long-running build.
Note that I don't really even need to have a nut to hold the wheel on to begin with, another 1" locking collar would do the job fine. That's because the setscrews in the wheel hubs tightened down onto the 1/4" keystock in the axle keyway does most of the work already. I could have just cut the excess (the stepdown) off completely.
I would never trust just the tightness of an axle nut by itself to keep the wheel from spinning on the axle without any keystock. You have a keyway with a piece of keystock in those 5/8" threads, or does a wheel just free spin on there until you tighten the axle nut?
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Bansil
Painter of gnomes....
Me confused some what.
I understand the step down is fully threaded, does it have a keyway?
You keep saying wheel, do you mean hub? And then wheel attaches to the hub?
Because if there is no keyway, even tightening down the hub will give the hub the chance to spin and ruin hub and shaft.
I understand the step down is fully threaded, does it have a keyway?
You keep saying wheel, do you mean hub? And then wheel attaches to the hub?
Because if there is no keyway, even tightening down the hub will give the hub the chance to spin and ruin hub and shaft.
madprofessor
"Loose Cannon Creations"
Understand what Bansil said there, Barib? If there's not a slot (keyway) (let's just say it's a 1/4" square slot) cut into one side of that threaded end of the shaft, and another slot (another 1/4" keyway) to match it cut into the wheel hub that sits on those threads, and a matching piece of 1/4" keystock (a steel stick that's square, not round) to slide into the slots when they're lined-up together, nothing will prevent the wheel hub from just spinning freely on the threaded shaft while the shaft is sitting still.
With the 1/4" piece of keystock resting equally deep into the matching lined-up keyways, the wheel has to turn with the axle when the axle turns. The wheel can't spin freely on the axle, the keystock keeps the two locked together.
If you don't have a piece of keystock there, the only way the axle is going to turn that wheel is if you torque down super duper tight on the axle nut with all of your might, and even then the wheel might slip and spin on the axle under heavy acceleration or braking.
With the 1/4" piece of keystock resting equally deep into the matching lined-up keyways, the wheel has to turn with the axle when the axle turns. The wheel can't spin freely on the axle, the keystock keeps the two locked together.
If you don't have a piece of keystock there, the only way the axle is going to turn that wheel is if you torque down super duper tight on the axle nut with all of your might, and even then the wheel might slip and spin on the axle under heavy acceleration or braking.
Much thanks for the help, unfortunately I did not have the step down keyed. I don’t have any machining tools at home, but maybe a machine shop can put one in. Unfortunately I made the newbie mistake of getting harbor freight yard truck wheels. These have bearings in them, of course, which will really make life difficult. I hate to say it but I might need to order a new axle, what do y’all think? I‘d really, really, really prefer not to. Alternatively I could try to fit in these axle flanges (in the picture below). Thanks for the constant replies. I could secure this with a lock collar, or maybe tap in some set screws.
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Just thinking about this now, my neighbor suggested a few days ago that I could potentially drill a small hole through the step down part of the axle, and a corresponding one in the hub of the wheel, in that hole I could run a skinny bolt or cotter pin right through it. Any thoughts?
madprofessor
"Loose Cannon Creations"
Read your original post where you described the axle as a custom 50" long. You said that the 40" long center section is 1" OD that's keyed the full length of itself (40"), and that 5" of each end is stepped down to 5/8" that's threaded the full 5" length on each.
I've never seen a stepdown from 1" that was any size other than 3/4", but you say it's a custom axle, so I must believe it's the 5/8" you stated. Note the size of the stepdown hub in the link you just posted, 1" stepped down to 3/4", pretty standard. That would slide onto a 1" shaft partway, then the stepdown in it would bump up against the larger 1" and stop. You would then tighten a 3/4" axle nut to the hub and you're done.
That would still work for you with your 5/8" ends because of the keyway in the 1" portion, it would lock the axle and hub together. That's the part that's supposed to take all the force, the small end doesn't really matter.
Your concerns are the wheel bearings of the Harbor Freight wheels riding on the threads, if that's an acceptable fit or not, and the lack of a keyway in the threaded 5/8" section of each end of the axle.
Return the wheels to Harbor Freight, get your money back. You can't use any wheel with bearings in it, the wheel has to lock to the shaft, a bearing would make it spin.
Get the hubs you listed above if that's what you want, they will go onto your axle. You'll need a 5/8" ID washer that has a larger OD than 1" to go on next, a common washer would work. Then just run a 5/8" axle nut tight to the washer, and that part's done. Note that axles have fine thread on them, not common coarse threads, and an "axle nut" is just a nut with that fine thread and a nylon insert that keeps it from vibrating loose.
You'll then need to get wheels (rims) that fit a 4-lugs on a 4" bolt circle, known as 4 x 4 (see your listing above). Get tires for the wheels (rims) and you're done.
I've never seen a stepdown from 1" that was any size other than 3/4", but you say it's a custom axle, so I must believe it's the 5/8" you stated. Note the size of the stepdown hub in the link you just posted, 1" stepped down to 3/4", pretty standard. That would slide onto a 1" shaft partway, then the stepdown in it would bump up against the larger 1" and stop. You would then tighten a 3/4" axle nut to the hub and you're done.
That would still work for you with your 5/8" ends because of the keyway in the 1" portion, it would lock the axle and hub together. That's the part that's supposed to take all the force, the small end doesn't really matter.
Your concerns are the wheel bearings of the Harbor Freight wheels riding on the threads, if that's an acceptable fit or not, and the lack of a keyway in the threaded 5/8" section of each end of the axle.
Return the wheels to Harbor Freight, get your money back. You can't use any wheel with bearings in it, the wheel has to lock to the shaft, a bearing would make it spin.
Get the hubs you listed above if that's what you want, they will go onto your axle. You'll need a 5/8" ID washer that has a larger OD than 1" to go on next, a common washer would work. Then just run a 5/8" axle nut tight to the washer, and that part's done. Note that axles have fine thread on them, not common coarse threads, and an "axle nut" is just a nut with that fine thread and a nylon insert that keeps it from vibrating loose.
You'll then need to get wheels (rims) that fit a 4-lugs on a 4" bolt circle, known as 4 x 4 (see your listing above). Get tires for the wheels (rims) and you're done.
madprofessor
"Loose Cannon Creations"
HEY BARIB!!! Wait up a minute! Just noticed that ridiculous price on the (1) single wheel hub listed above, that's crazy!
Go to BMIKarts.com and type "4 x 4 hubs" in the search bar. Right there on the first row you'll see a 1" - 3/4" stepdown hub for $23.95 each, that's $47.90 for a pair plus a little shipping.
That $38.99 for a single hub ($77.98 for a pair) is crazy even with free Amazon shipping.
Go to BMIKarts.com and type "4 x 4 hubs" in the search bar. Right there on the first row you'll see a 1" - 3/4" stepdown hub for $23.95 each, that's $47.90 for a pair plus a little shipping.
That $38.99 for a single hub ($77.98 for a pair) is crazy even with free Amazon shipping.
Was just wondering if any of you would know about oil changes in a predator 212cc. Im only asking about inherent dangers in oil changes (it sounds dumb I know) but I heard that metal such as lead and arsenic can be contained in used motor oil. The other day I opened up the crankcase on my predator 79 cc, and the oil spilled all over my hands. Anything to be worried about? Thanks, I know it’s a dumb question.
madprofessor
"Loose Cannon Creations"
I've gotten my hands too gunked up with grease and oil and caked dirt for even Orange GoJo degreaser to handle. In that guy's shop there's always this bin that's kept full of dirty motor oil. We'd sometimes just go to it first to wash with to get off enough gunk from hands and arms for GoJo to finish the job. I'm only partially dain bramaged, and it ain't frum dat. Don't worry, be happy.
Bansil
Painter of gnomes....
I guess so....fixed it for you
you know for the childrenzzens n folks