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  #1  
Old 11-13-2016, 08:22 PM
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Default 2017 - Hero (Zero Turn Go Kart)

This kart will run on dual 36V 500W DC motors.

NO steering wheel, handle bars or rudder of any kind.

Individual (left & right) hand controls for steering, acceleration & braking.

Chancer is worried that the battery's for this cart are gonna be heavy.

So lets try to mitigate that by putting them right behind but, really close to our imaginary rear axle.

I'm thinkin, the rear wheels should be right next to the seat with the battery's in a row right behind the seat.

...to kinda off set / balance the weight of the driver

So, lets start with the battery box.

I am gonna use the HF Universal Solar 12V 35 Amp Hour battery like I used on El Dingo.

They are 5 1/8" x 7 5/8"

If we run (3) sideways, we will need a 15 1/2" wide by 7 5/8" long battery box probably ~3 1/2" deep with ~1" tabs for mounting.

Attached Images
File Type: jpg SAM_1961.jpg (132.9 KB, 10 views)
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File Type: jpg SAM_1979.jpg (269.9 KB, 9 views)
File Type: jpg SAM_1986.jpg (255.0 KB, 8 views)
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Last edited by Functional Artist; 11-15-2016 at 08:55 PM. Reason: add video
  #2  
Old 11-13-2016, 08:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Functional Artist View Post
Chancer is worried that the battery's for this cart are gonna be heavy.
He's not wrong; 20lb per battery x6=120lbs, that's around the weight of some small karts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Functional Artist View Post
So lets try to mitigate that by putting them right behind but, really close to our imaginary rear axle.
No, that much weight you want between the axles; I realise there's little to no steering geometry involved but, you do want the front wheels on the ground, don't you?

My advice is run the batteries along the side rails...
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  #3  
Old 11-13-2016, 09:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OzFab View Post
He's not wrong; 20lb per battery x6=120lbs, that's around the weight of some small karts



No, that much weight you want between the axles; I realise there's little to no steering geometry involved but, you do want the front wheels on the ground, don't you?

My advice is run the batteries along the side rails...
The plan for this kart is to run both motors/controllers off (1) 36V battery pack.

Doing so will reduce overall run time but, your right 120 lbs is too much, heck 60 lbs of bat pack is still a lot for a small kart.

Do I want the front wheels on the ground? Hmmmmm.

Answer: Maybe &/or sometimes

Isn't that the GOAL of half of the guys on this forum.

Running the batteries along the side rails has been done.

Kinda Led Sledish, I'm goin more for light & nimble

I'm thinkin of settin it up kinda like I did on Desteny's Kart, just move the rear wheels forward to assist steering.
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File Type: jpg SAM_0568.jpg (345.4 KB, 15 views)
  #4  
Old 11-13-2016, 08:53 PM
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You'll be fine. I was commenting cause you said another Build idea was too heavy.
I found them equally heavy thats all
Hey is that the HF Break? I have it too.
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Old 11-13-2016, 10:00 PM
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Originally Posted by chancer View Post
You'll be fine. I was commenting cause you said another Build idea was too heavy.
I found them equally heavy thats all
Hey is that the HF Break? I have it too.
Oh, Ya!

I was just addressing your concern in the build thread as a way to explain battery placement.

I figured the other idea (hydraulics) was too heavy for a kart cause' besides a motor it would need a couple of hydraulic pumps, control valves, hoses & even a reservoir for the fluid. (all really heavy)

Yup! HF is my friend!

Your friend! Everybody's friend!

No matter what RANDY says!

It's the artist NOT the brush.
  #6  
Old 11-13-2016, 11:12 PM
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Thas right!
"it is The Shotty Craftsman that blames his tools"~Poboy
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  #7  
Old 11-14-2016, 07:46 AM
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Default Hero

Now that we have the battery box, we can build off of that.

The bat pack we are using is like 60 lbs. - 70 lbs., so we want that well supported.

The battery box is designed to be mounted between the frame rails & rest on the 1" flanges.

The average driver would be ~ 150 lbs.

So, if the bat pack is right behind the rear axle & the driver just in front, I'm thinkin' the weights should help off set each other but, still be a bit heavier in the front.

Kinda like the wheel barrow concept.
  #8  
Old 11-14-2016, 09:34 AM
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Default Hero

To help keep build time & costs down I am gonna try & incorporate a lot of existing technology, part's & structure in this build.

Not redesigning the wheel here, just creatively modifying & re-purposing components.

I have a couple of mostly complete Chinese electric scooters I can use for this project. (both have wiring issues)

I am gonna try to use most of the actual frames.

They nicely hold the rear wheel, motor mount, motor, controller, small battery's (but, were not goin' that direction) & could be used for arm rests & mounts for the hand controls.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg SAM_1919.jpg (357.3 KB, 5 views)
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File Type: jpg SAM_1922.jpg (237.1 KB, 4 views)
File Type: jpg SAM_1958.jpg (482.4 KB, 10 views)
File Type: jpg SAM_1959.jpg (543.2 KB, 8 views)
  #9  
Old 11-15-2016, 09:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chancer View Post
Thas right!
"it is The Shotty Craftsman that blames his tools"~Poboy
How many craftsmen buy the cheapest tools available? They can't afford to.

I do buy some things from harbor freight. Heck I get a free tarp almost every week.

The larger wire machine, looks decent and the stick/tig inverter is nifty. Heard good things about their plasma cutters.

The ac flux cored machine has its place. I'm not such a jerk that I'll pick on innocent bystanders. However there are alot of pics posted on this forum that clearly demonstrate that the weldor responsible, if not the welder, should not weld on kart frame.

Function Artist.
I must say you make some cool stuff. I imagine you can take a torch and and the dreaded coat hangar wire and do an admirable job.
  #10  
Old 11-15-2016, 10:09 AM
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How many craftsmen buy the cheapest tools available? They can't afford to.

I do buy some things from harbor freight. Heck I get a free tarp almost every week.

The larger wire machine, looks decent and the stick/tig inverter is nifty. Heard good things about their plasma cutters.

The ac flux cored machine has its place. I'm not such a jerk that I'll pick on innocent bystanders. However there are alot of pics posted on this forum that clearly demonstrate that the weldor responsible, if not the welder, should not weld on kart frame.

Function Artist.
I must say you make some cool stuff. I imagine you can take a torch and and the dreaded coat hangar wire and do an admirable job.
Thank you, Thank you very much!

As for HF, There are many reasons to buy cheaper tools.

Affordability, Not sure if this will be a long term activity, or in my case...

My shop has been broken into & cleaned out several times.

Little , that's why there's green paint all over my tool boxes in some of my pics.

After I secured all doors & windows, the little started coming through the roof.

The whole place is alarmed now but, still leary.

As for the craftsmen, Lots of folks have their "fish stories", just gotta use common sense.

Practice makes perfect or at least well practiced.

That's what DIY is all about, tinkering around with stuff.

At least their trying! doing! creating! & sharing.

This place is like guys hangin' out in the garage tinkerin' & shootin the

Analyze, Advise maybe even needle a bit but, Please don't criticize!

You sound like a smart guy, some folks just have a hard way of showing it.

As for the torch idea: Ya, probably if I put my mind to it!

Last edited by Functional Artist; 11-15-2016 at 10:22 AM. Reason: add info
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  #11  
Old 11-15-2016, 08:52 PM
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Default Hero

Two main rules I always keep in mind when designing a kart are...

1. Must have a roll bar. ( I flipped a kart once. It was NOT fun!)

2. The seat bottom should not be higher than the rear axle. (to help keep center of gravity low)

So, next I'll make the roll bar.

Went to my local Home Depot to get some frame material for our kart.

Yup, regular old water pipe. (less than a buck a foot)

Got out the HF metal cutter & "pipe" bender.

I want it our roll bar to be ~30" tall with ~10" legs to attach to the lower frame rails.

So, I'll mark it at 10" then 32" (this will be the center/top of the roll bar) then another mark at 32" & finally the last mark after another 10" which equals 84" so before bending I'll cut the pipe @ 84"

After cutting, I did the first bend in the center.

Maxed out the bender to get the tightest bend possible.

Then set up to bend the legs.

Did slight inward kick, so the legs wouldn't angle out too much.

Each leg took ~40 full strokes.

Turned out pretty good!

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File Type: jpg SAM_2052.jpg (525.8 KB, 6 views)
  #12  
Old 11-16-2016, 08:48 AM
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Default Hero

Our frame is startin' to take shape.

I bent a piece of pipe last month to make a front roll cage section for El Dingo but, never got around to finishing it up.

It seems pretty close to the dimensions we need for the front section of our Hero kart so, I'll just roll with that.

I'm gonna set this frame up a little differently than I did on Desteny's kart.

The battery box set up will be about the same as on Desteny's kart but, on her's the frame had two 90 degree bends in the rear which left a space between the battery box & frame kinda like a rear bumper or even a handy grab bar & the front axle capped the ends.

Were doing it exactly opposite for this kart.

The 90 degree bends will be in the front & we'll cap off the rear with either a piece of pipe or square tube for the rear bumper.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg SAM_2010.jpg (393.1 KB, 4 views)
File Type: jpg SAM_2011.jpg (508.5 KB, 5 views)
File Type: jpg SAM_2009.jpg (432.4 KB, 5 views)
  #13  
Old 11-14-2016, 07:13 PM
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That reminds me....
Has anyone here ever tried to ride 2 scooters at once?
One foot on each. Not easy to do.
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Old 11-14-2016, 08:34 PM
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Originally Posted by chancer View Post
That reminds me....
Has anyone here ever tried to ride 2 scooters at once?
One foot on each. Not easy to do.
Not me!

Sounds like you might have some experience though.

Got pics?

...or scars?

We wanna see this!
  #15  
Old 11-14-2016, 09:01 PM
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Default Hero

Did some "very rough sketch" conceptual drawings for our Hero kart.

Speaking of heroe's, I was thinking that if this concept works out it could be useful to help our veterans with leg issues to rejoin the fun.

...and handicapped kids too. that would never be able to control a standard kart.

I think that would be very Kool!

First pic, I think the axle is too far back & the frame seems too long for our steering concept.

Second pic, is closer to where we are going with this. (doesn't show battery pack behind seat)
Attached Images
File Type: jpg SAM_1950.jpg (167.8 KB, 4 views)
File Type: jpg SAM_1951.jpg (156.0 KB, 4 views)
  #16  
Old 11-15-2016, 08:43 AM
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Default Hero

If our battery box is 15 1/2" that will be the inside dimensions of the rear section of our frame.

A nice snug fit will provide the support needed for our battery pack.

As for wheelbase, Desteny's kart has a 43" wb which seems kinda long for this type of steering concept.

The scooter frame's were using have a 33 1/2" wb which seems kinda short.

I'm thinkin' maybe a 36" or 38" wb?

The width in the rear is, hmmmmm.

Bat box is 15 1/2", plus two frame rails @ 7/8" & the scooter frames are 3 1/2" from edge to center of the wheel.

So... 15 1/2" + 1 3/4" (7/8" x 2) + 7" ( 3 1/2" x 2) = 24 1/4"

So... if the width (track) is 24 1/4" & length (wheelbase) is 38"

I 'm thinkin' that would be a ~2:3 ratio or ~1/3 longer than wide.

To double check, (to see if on paper works in the real world) I sat down between the scooter frames with a tape measure.

Still seems kinda short.

40" looks a little better.

Ya, lets roll with that.
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File Type: jpg SAM_1958.jpg (482.4 KB, 4 views)
  #17  
Old 11-19-2016, 09:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chancer View Post
That reminds me....
Has anyone here ever tried to ride 2 scooters at once?
One foot on each. Not easy to do.
Kid stuff...
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  #18  
Old 11-19-2016, 11:51 AM
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I used the cut off wheel to remove the tabs off of the sides of the scooter & ground off the welds off using a rough wheel on the grinder, before clamping the main frame & the scooters together.

* I finally changed the wheel on the grinder.
Sure got my monies worth out of the old one.
Even had to scrape out debris to fit new wheel on.

After double & triple checkin' everything from (height all (4) corners), levelness & clearance (ground, wheels etc.), I marked the welding points & took it all apart to clean up the welding points.

After using a sanding disc on the grinder, I cleaned everything up & re assembled the main frame & scooters & then tac welded it together.

I doubled checked everything again then welded it up good.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg SAM_2146.jpg (440.0 KB, 4 views)
File Type: jpg SAM_2140.jpg (232.7 KB, 4 views)
File Type: jpg SAM_2150.jpg (244.1 KB, 3 views)
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File Type: jpg SAM_2144.jpg (455.7 KB, 3 views)

Last edited by Functional Artist; 11-19-2016 at 04:06 PM. Reason: add video
  #19  
Old 11-19-2016, 01:00 PM
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Default Hero

I want the driver to sit pretty much between the rear wheels, to aid our steering concept.

To accomplish this, we need to attach the roll bar/seat back, as far back as possible.

So, We'll start at the battery box.

The frame rails support the sides of our battery box, the rear bumper is the rear & we'll use a piece of small angle across the front.

I primed the battery box & frame area where it mounts to seal it up, because once I weld in the front brace, the battery box will be locked in.

After welding in the front battery brace, I clamped the roll bar into place, making sure there was clearance to remove the batteries.

Then, I welded it in place also.

Attached Images
File Type: jpg SAM_2151.jpg (430.0 KB, 6 views)
File Type: jpg SAM_2156.jpg (307.2 KB, 4 views)
File Type: jpg SAM_2157.jpg (364.9 KB, 3 views)
File Type: jpg SAM_2167.jpg (289.3 KB, 4 views)
File Type: jpg SAM_2169.jpg (327.0 KB, 4 views)

Last edited by Functional Artist; 11-19-2016 at 04:37 PM. Reason: add video
  #20  
Old 11-19-2016, 01:42 PM
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She's kinda, starting to look like a go kart!

I cut off the seat towers & cleaned up the rear arm rest support area.

That will clear the way to help figure the configuration, placement & mounting of our upper frame section.

Our upper frame section will accomplish several tasks.

First, it will begin at & be part of our arm rest.

...then, extend up to where the casters will mount,

...then curve (@~ a 90 degree angle) to go across the front where it will also be the foot rest (since we won't have any foot pedals)

...then curve again where the other caster will mount & finally go back to the other arm rest.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg SAM_2176.jpg (545.5 KB, 3 views)
File Type: jpg SAM_2159.jpg (286.5 KB, 3 views)
File Type: jpg SAM_2188.jpg (454.0 KB, 5 views)
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