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Old 05-06-2018, 11:42 PM
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Default DNF - 2018 - Little Man 1.0

LITTLE MAN 1.0

Hello Everyone,

I became a member of DIY Go Karts in 2013 and I am finally getting around to following one of my dreams. I am building a go kart! Well, to be honest, I will have some help. My kids and I will be building LITTLE MAN 1.0.

To get the team excited, we went to the indoor go kart track yesterday and the two oldest got to drive. To get them motivated, I told them that to drive a kart again we needed to build one. Not surprisingly, they are all in! =)

Full Team:
===Designers:
----------Winterz
----------RosieVine
----------DrFfreeze
===Gophers:
----------10Man
----------MG42
----------littleT
===Racers:
----------Winterz
----------RosieVine
----------DrFfreeze
----------10Man
----------MG42
----------littleT

Here is some design criterial from my thoughts about a go kart in 2015 from my blog LINK. These map well to our family's first go kart, LITTLE MAN 1.0

1. Identify the Problem:

We need to build a vehicle that can safely and effectively explore the Boise National Forest.

2. Identify Criteria Constraints:
Safe
Seat belts
Effective brakes
Fire won't light passengers on fire
Rollover won't squish passengers
Good for beginning drivers (kids)
Not too fast (needs defined)

Inexpensive
Under $800

Fun
Good for experienced drivers (dad)
Want it fast enough (needs defined)
Seats 2 side by side

Able to go on all non-motorcycle trails
Width with all wheels/tracks is under 4'

Must be easy to fabricate at our home shop
Made of wood or some metal

Strong enough to pull a homemade trailer
We are just getting started. We bought a Predator 212cc engine and some 1" x 1/8" square tube last week. Winterz and I borrowed a welder and welded for the first time today. It was great! Our welds were horrible! We will have much more to come.

If this goes as planned, LITTLE MAN 1.0 will be a basic kart that we sprint to finish quickly with little to no modifications. The team will be able to drive most of Summer break and we can use what we learned to build the big kids a more capable machine. After that, it will be time for my cart! =)

All five of my kids will be very involved in this build. My two oldest will be posting on these forums.

Regards,
Drffreeze

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1] Tires (many), engine, sign (forgot "wrenches")

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2] Kart parts + new welding supplies

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3] The full team

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4] The full team ready for business

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5] The DIYGK 2018 sign with "wrenches"

Last edited by drffreeze; 05-09-2018 at 09:55 PM. Reason: Updating inline photos
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  #2  
Old 05-07-2018, 01:00 AM
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Nice!!!! I look forward to this one.

Just a word of warning on safety. If you do not have a roll cage, then safety belts are a NO NO. Safety belts are only used when you have a full roll cage. The theory is that with a cage you want to be kept inside so that you don't get crushed by the cage. Without a cage you want to be thrown free so that you don't get crushed by the kart if it rolls
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  #3  
Old 05-07-2018, 02:00 AM
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Speaking of safety, do I spy Harbor Freight wheels?Harbor Freight very very bad.

Also, wood very very bad.
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  #4  
Old 05-07-2018, 04:25 AM
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Listen carefully to both above!

Throw those HF dolly wheels away, as far as you can, do not look back..
(or give them back to horror fright if you can)
DO NOT mount them to a go kart;
especially not if you want your kids anywhere near it.

And as always: no cage -> no belt; no exceptions!
everything else is indeed a bad idea as well.

And I hear that.. you're thinking "oh those wheels will do for a few..."
NO THEY WILL NOT!

And now the missing warning sign:
A wooden kart is much MUCH more difficult to make than a steel kart..
and much more expensive in the end if done correctly.

A wooden kart with HF wheels and a belt is a death trap,
I can practically guarantee that your kids WILL get hurt eventually;

It's so far from being what we generally consider safe,
that you will likely get NO support whatsoever until you change your mind.
(tons of warnings yes.. help.. not much)

'sid
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  #5  
Old 05-07-2018, 05:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by itsid View Post
And as always: no cage -> no belt; no exceptions!
everything else is indeed a bad idea as well.
I will respond to all the posts later but I don't understand, "everything else is indeed a bad idea as well." comment.

Regards,
Eric
  #6  
Old 05-07-2018, 06:19 PM
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Lingual issue..

everything else
[remaining options: belt and no cage // cage and no belt]
is indeed a bad idea as well
[as bad of an idea as those terribly flimsy pain inducing harbour freight dolly wheels]

'sid
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  #7  
Old 05-07-2018, 09:13 PM
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Default hello Itsid

Hello Itsid,
Thanks for the help and advice. Also the roll cage, thanks for that tip, and that does make sense. If you have a protection shield around you, you would want to stay in but if you don't have a shield around you , you would want to get away from the danger Example: In modern day time a tank comes around and randomly wants to shoot at you. You are in a jeep and it and points it's barrel at you then you would want to get out fast. But if you were also in a tank you could stay and be pretty safe or safer. Thanks for the help!
Best Regards-
Winterz The War Freak
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  #8  
Old 05-07-2018, 10:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by landuse View Post
Nice!!!! I look forward to this one.
Sometimes I am amazed at the little things. Here you are in South Africa watching a family in North America build a go kart as a family. The internet is just too cool =)

Quote:
Originally Posted by landuse View Post
Just a word of warning on safety. If you do not have a roll cage, then safety belts are a NO NO...
When I made this go kart criteria back in 2015 I was unsure if I would have a full roll cage or not. I would agree 100%, roll cage = 5-point harnesss, no roll cage = no seat belt of any kind. =)

Regards,
Drffreeze

---------- Post added at 10:20 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:15 PM ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nosandwich View Post
Speaking of safety, do I spy Harbor Freight wheels?Harbor Freight very very bad.
I would presume the Harbor Freight wheels are only for dollies so they are not robust enough for any kind of speed. Would you care to elaborate on your specific concerns?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nosandwich View Post
Also, wood very very bad.
At the time I made this kart design criteria I had no access to a welder. I was unsure if I would make a wooden kart or wait until I got a welder. It looks like it took 3 years but I have access to a welder so it will be metal. =)

Regards,
Drffreeze
  #9  
Old 05-07-2018, 10:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drffreeze View Post
Sometimes I am amazed at the little things. Here you are in South Africa watching a family in North America build a go kart as a family. The internet is just too cool =)
Welcome to 2018

LOL just messing with you, can't wait to follow this build!
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  #10  
Old 05-07-2018, 10:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by itsid View Post
Listen carefully to both above!

Throw those HF dolly wheels away, as far as you can, do not look back..
(or give them back to horror fright if you can)
DO NOT mount them to a go kart;
especially not if you want your kids anywhere near it.
Yup, I am going to ask, why? I think I know your concerns but I would like to know the "why".

Quote:
Originally Posted by itsid View Post
And as always: no cage -> no belt; no exceptions!
everything else is indeed a bad idea as well.
Thanks for the "Lingual issue.." post. I agree.

Quote:
Originally Posted by itsid View Post
And I hear that.. you're thinking "oh those wheels will do for a few..."
NO THEY WILL NOT!
Again, I would love to know your concerns. I am not trying to be argumentative, I would just like to know your reasons.

Quote:
Originally Posted by itsid View Post
And now the missing warning sign:
A wooden kart is much MUCH more difficult to make than a steel kart..
and much more expensive in the end if done correctly.
I agree. It feels like it would be much much more challenging to build. I have wanted to build a go kart since I was ~15 and I am > 45 now. When I wrote this back in 2015 I didn't have access to a welder or any line of sight to getting one. I would either build a go kart out of wood or wait years until I got a welder. Looks like I waited years! =)


Quote:
Originally Posted by itsid View Post
A wooden kart with HF wheels and a belt is a death trap,
I can practically guarantee that your kids WILL get hurt eventually;

It's so far from being what we generally consider safe,
that you will likely get NO support whatsoever until you change your mind.
(tons of warnings yes.. help.. not much)
Just to be clear this was someplace to start but old, "Here is some design criterial from my thoughts about a go kart in 2015." I have access to a welder now so it will be out of metal! I just don't see how this first cart will have a roll cage so it won't have seat belts. The choice of tires is still under review. =)

Regards,
Drffreeze

---------- Post added at 10:39 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:33 PM ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Winterz View Post
Hello Itsid,
... Example: In modern day time a tank comes around and randomly wants to shoot at you. ...
Son, I don't think we have to worry about that! =p

Love,
Dad

PS. I had a "design" in high school for a small 2 man fast mini tank that looked kinda like a GI Joe Cobra H.I.S.S tank tracks with a much smaller body. It had no gun, only TOW missiles. I can't wait until our karts have tracks! I wonder where I would get cheap enough wheels to act as idlers? =)

---------- Post added at 10:44 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:39 PM ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Panhead5496 View Post
Welcome to 2018
I know, I know. I really get a kick out of the sharing of knowledge. My middle son who is in 1st-grade was thankful for chairs so that we didn't have to sit on the floor while eating at the dinner table when he said thanks. If you can be thankful for all of the little things it is quite easy to remain happy.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Panhead5496 View Post
LOL just messing with you, can't wait to follow this build!
No problem! I have a certain mirth that permeates my bones so all is good. We can't wait to work on it.

Speaking of which...
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  #11  
Old 05-07-2018, 10:53 PM
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LITTLE MAN 1.0

I received some tires I bought a week ago. They were originally for our first cart that would be much more aggressively designed. Since then we have changed plans to ~sprint to the finish line so the kids and drive it soon. Our first cart is now much more pedestrian in the design department.

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$100 for all 4 LINK

I wanted to get Winterz setup to learn Excel so he could begin our parts list and start the record keeping of our expenses. We didn't quite get to that after we practiced a bit more welding tonight.

Our goal is to have enough information of LITTLE MAN 1.0 that anyone can go and build it themselves.

Regards,
Drffreeze

Last edited by drffreeze; 05-09-2018 at 09:32 PM. Reason: Updating inline photos
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Old 05-07-2018, 11:02 PM
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LITTLE MAN 1.0

Winterz and I started welding yesterday! Grandpa came over to get us going. I will post more later but I will leave you with some ugly welds.

On the bright side, we could not possibly have more room for improvement!

So I blew a hole in this side, no one will notice once I fill it up!
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Hmm, I must have swung the slag hammer too hard? =p
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It was a 110V 100A stick welder with ~ 8-year-old electrodes on 1" 1/8" thick square tubing on a 15A circuit. I will be dropping a 20A circuit soon. I got new 6013 rods and they helped somewhat. My friend has a 240V 225A stick welder he will let me borrow next week.

Regards,
Drffreeze

Last edited by drffreeze; 05-09-2018 at 09:36 PM. Reason: Updating inline photos
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Old 05-08-2018, 06:47 AM
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If you are learning to weld... Stick will be a difficult ride...
Striking the arc, and maintaining a constant rod height amoungst a stable arc will be the difficult parts...
If I'm also seeing this correctly... Your machine is an AC only machine... Makes life really difficult as the process is designed for a different type of welding...

One of the better ideas is a fluxcore wire feed welder.. They're dc... Somewhat "decent" in they're abilities to lay a bead of course with the name brand wire you bought instead(HF FC mig wire is crap)... Overall generally easier to use...

The holes you are blowing will be the constant of use of that machine..
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Old 05-09-2018, 09:51 PM
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Hello mckutzy,

Yes, it is an AC only machine. What do you mean the stick welding "process is designed for a different type of welding"?

Harbor Freight has a Flux 125 Welder for ~$90 on sale. I just bought a 3.5 HP Harbor Freight cut-off $90. If I can't figure out stick welding with either the 110V or the larger 240V AND the HF Flux 125 Welder would work better it would be kinda silly not to pick it up.

If I continue with this hobby I foresee getting a nice 240V MIG welder with gas but I don't want to spend that kind of money until I prove to myself I will use it. Do you have any idea if the HF Flux 125 would work better than a stick?

I actually would be ecstatic if I was blowing holes in the metal often. I can't get an arc to start to save my life. I just keep sticking the rod to the metal and the amperage is 100%. That said I do need to add a 20A circuit. It looks like I have plenty of 14ga and 10ga but no 12ga. I will have to head to the store in the next day or two.

Thanks for your input!
Drffreeze
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Old 05-09-2018, 11:29 PM
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I used stick for all my builds...and I learned from scratch too. The stick should be OK for you, but like mckutzy says, other types would be easier. Stick was all I had, so I just went with it. I used 6013 rods.

I also blew a few holes through the metal the first few times. Check that your Amps aren't set too high on the machine....that also makes it burn hot
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Old 05-10-2018, 06:45 AM
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Another tip is that heat helps with welding, but heat also hurts because the metal will get too soft and that allows holes to occur. That means your rate or "pace" of welding will have to change as the metal gets hotter. That is something learned and not taught. It will be trial and error up front. Just when you think you have a rhythm and things are going well, the piece you are welding is getting hotter and hotter. Consider spot welding a few areas. let it cool. do one side. let is cool. do the other side. and so on. Maybe hopping around to different areas. Do not be tempted to use water to cool a weld that you plan to do more work on.

Welding is like painting. We all watch Bob Ross and are like, I too can paint happy trees!
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Old 05-10-2018, 06:55 AM
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Honestly the cheap wire machine will be much better for learning and you'll see much better results...
Mainly due to the power supply of the machine... It'll be DC...

They cheap out and don't put DC rectifiers in the AC machines as that would be another expense...

AC is meant for high penitration, for welding magnetized pieces, aluminum... Hence the hole blowing , from focused narrow band of heat causes the base to melt and quickly...

If you like the FC wire machine(and I'll bet you will, the family aswell)... You'll love the big 220 gas machine...

Now the cheap FC welders are cheap... Have to remember that... Also the duty cycle is short... So you have to wait a while in between welding bead segments... They don't have a fan(which adds to the short cycles).
You'll need a plug close to the welding machine... Or a good thick extension cord, and nothing or at least very minimal use( a low power light or the like) on that power circuit as the inrush typically will trip a more laden curcuit when you strike the arc...
These machines need a good source of clean uninterrupted power to get the most efficiency of them...
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Old 05-10-2018, 08:17 AM
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I am also self taught

I started off with a "stick" welder
...but the "sticking" drove me nuts (very, very frustrating)
...& a lot more clean up (of all of the "stuck" spots plus the actual weld itself)

I currently use (huh-huh I said currently)
...a HF 90 for all of my builds

I am NO professional welder but, I get "decent to good" results
...& they seem pretty strong too

I thought for sure, that when I layed this 6" bead, on 1/8" x 1/8" steel
...the breaker would trip
...or the over heat light would come on

But, she took it like a trooper

Also, mine seems to have a cooling fan

I hear it running whenever the welder is turned "on"
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Old 05-10-2018, 11:11 AM
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As a kid, I learned on a tombstone welder...6013... Alot of rod and mess... Then I got to use the wire machine... At first it was difficult to handle... But then I realised the potential... I have never gone back...
It does have its place and rightly so... It also establishes the fundamentals needed to learn welding... And understand it... If you have time...

I'd go fluxcore wire... Then you'll be able to really learn..and build..
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Old 05-10-2018, 09:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TT540 View Post
Welding is like painting. We all watch Bob Ross and are like, I too can paint happy trees!
If welding is like painting, I am doomed! =)

Regards,
Drffreeze
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