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Old 02-17-2020, 03:58 PM
thechrisbart thechrisbart is offline
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Default Small Engine Duty Cycles?

Without over explaining why, I am converting an electric shopping cart into a gas go kart for a Gambler 500 event . I have yet to acquire an engine but very open to anything in the 3-7hp range but the simpler the better (for trail repair reasons) however the most important thing to me is its longevity.
For those who don't know, the gambler is a two day offroad excursion. The terrain isn't difficult however it will require the kart to run several hours a day. I have limited experience in small engines and all of it is based on short-term high-performance so I have no clue how long one can run before turning into a gassy fireball!

TLDR; Does anyone have any experience in enduro go karting? Please educate my dumb THANK YOU!!

Some past projects me and buddies have done is a 45 mph kart with a pre '65 briggs 5horse, an '80s Wheel Horse wheelie machine, and JD 110 "tugboat" on land (used for moving cars around the yard).
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Old 02-17-2020, 06:29 PM
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What kind of modifications are allowed or is it relatively stock? Biggest issue I'd be worried about is oil consumption considering it'll be running at 100% the whole time.
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Old 02-17-2020, 07:23 PM
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It's a matter of finding the balance between power and reliability. If you want to throw enough money at it, you can have large amounts of both, but if you're building on a budget, you're better off starting with a good solid engine and doing some mild mods to liven it up a bit IMO.
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Old 02-17-2020, 08:20 PM
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welcome thechrisbart.
If it was me I would go with a Honda gx 200. actually I would not make a gas/electric shopping cart. but hey who am I to judge
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Old 02-17-2020, 10:00 PM
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unmodified (and governed) a true Honda gx200
can run nearly 24/7 for days at full speed and max load in a controlled environment no problem.
those are indestructible tanks compared to chinese replicas.

I'm quite certain you cannot destruct even a predator 212 in just a day of full power use
either (which is about the cheapest of them all) but two days... I'd only give it a 80% chance of survival tbh

the "offroad excursion" however has me worried;
that sounds liek the airfilter might clog up much quicker than anticipated.
rough terrain can trigger the oil alert/cutoff
and dirt and debris in the air cooling fan don't exactly help either under full loads
A spare air filter to change after day one, some fresh oil (just in case)
and a small can of compressed air (to clean the blower housing)
might come in handy to ease the pain for any engine.
A spare spark plug in case the air filter fails maybe...

Be carefull with modifications..
if you have to expect dusty roads.. you rather not use a high flow air filter to improve breathing for example.
a wet foam filter is key to a perfectly clean cumbustion chamber and carb internals

if you want reliability.. there's few that compares to the original Honda GX series tbh
and if you want more power
I'd rather pick an unmodified gx270 than a modified gx200 if reliability is what you're after.

'sid
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Old 02-17-2020, 10:11 PM
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Using a Donaldson type intake with a cyclonic prefilter and an oversized filter element could be very beneficial.
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Old 02-18-2020, 12:55 AM
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Awesome comments so far!! Thanks for your feedback, this is exactly the kind of stuff I need.

To answer some concerns: I don’t plan on modifying the engine further than maybe some dust protection. I’m not terribly concerned with powers either, with how light the finished kart is I could probably drag it out of any “tough spot” by hand. I will definitely be bringing some standard trail shtf materials (oil, filter, spark plug) however a can-of-air is something I hadn’t considered! Overall I don’t want to spend much time or money on this, it’s just a fun little project for me and my friends!
I’ll definitely research some Honda gx series since it seems to be favored. Also could someone explain more about the oil alert/cutoff that itsid mentioned? Any bypasses?
Thanks again and keep it coming!

---------- Post added at 01:55 AM ---------- Previous post was at 01:49 AM ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Karts of Kaos View Post
welcome thechrisbart.
If it was me I would go with a Honda gx 200. actually I would not make a gas/electric shopping cart. but hey who am I to judge
Also this made me laugh! The gambler 500 is a whats the strangest motor vehicle I can beat to death in two days kind of race. I promise Im not kooky enough to build this for no reason

Id encourage yall to look up this event. Ridiculous, hilarious builds and they always clean up the trails they use as they go along! Really good group of people.
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Old 02-18-2020, 01:29 AM
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Engines have a low oil sensor on them. This means when you turn tight corners the oil gets sloshed to the one side of the engine, causing the low oil sensor to cut the engine. You will have to unplug this for it not to happen. You can then use the wising for a kill switch
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Old 02-18-2020, 02:59 AM
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Great event! so you plan to use a 6.5hp engine to power a shopping cart for the 500 miles on highways and trails? I definitely want to see videos of this adventure. My friends just got done doing the Lemons rally a few weeks ago, good luck and have fun
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Old 02-18-2020, 09:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by landuse View Post
Engines have a low oil sensor on them. This means when you turn tight corners the oil gets sloshed to the one side of the engine, causing the low oil sensor to cut the engine. You will have to unplug this for it not to happen. You can then use the wising for a kill switch
Ahh, I get it! So as long as Im keeping an eye on the actual oil level, I should be able to delete the switch no problem right?

---------- Post added at 10:20 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:14 AM ----------

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Great event! so you plan to use a 6.5hp engine to power a shopping cart for the 500 miles on highways and trails? I definitely want to see videos of this adventure. My friends just got done doing the Lemons rally a few weeks ago, good luck and have fun
That would be amazing but the 500 comes from the fact they encourage you to keep the build under $500. I think the milage is probably 100-200 miles.
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Old 02-18-2020, 10:30 AM
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These motors for the most dont leak or burn oil.. It a "Honda" not a Harley....
If it is leaking.. you forgot to shut off the gas.. the crank case is full of gas/oil...
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Old 02-18-2020, 10:44 AM
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In stock form, with all gaskets, bolts tightened to spec, and oil fill/drains tight, Predators don't consume/leak oil. Just check the level before you ride and you should be GTG.
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Old 02-18-2020, 02:00 PM
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500 hours for a predator
1500 hours for a Honda

Most failures I have seen in a 1 hour endurance race include the following:

1) not putting loctite on ALL bolts
2) using #35 chain and losing the chain. #420 chain has had no failures and is not finicky line #35 chain.
3) gearing for “speed” which results in
a) burnt up centrifugal clutch
b) shredded torque converter belts
4) engine too powerful for torque converter or centrifugal clutch causing failure, often combined with item #3
5) Gas cap comes off

Notice none of the failures had anything to do with an engine (except for gas cap, which is a Coleman mini bike problem).
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Old 02-18-2020, 06:03 PM
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Awesome responses!! That list has become my checklist lol.
So fortune struck and a guy in town well selling a nearly brand new 212 predator for $40 because it “just didn’t run”. Looked it up and down and noticed a loose wire. Brought it home, connected the wire, and started right up!
Any other off-road tips or tricks??
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Old 02-18-2020, 07:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thechrisbart View Post
Ahh, I get it! So as long as Im keeping an eye on the actual oil level, I should be able to delete the switch no problem right?

---------- Post added at 10:20 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:14 AM ----------



That would be amazing but the 500 comes from the fact they encourage you to keep the build under $500. I think the milage is probably 100-200 miles.
Oh, I thought this was the Oregon race that Jesse r.i.p. sad, did in 2018.
Sorry for hyjack
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Old 02-18-2020, 07:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bansil View Post
Oh, I thought this was the Oregon race that Jesse r.i.p. sad, did in 2018.
Sorry for hyjack
That is sad.
It might be Im not sure, each host does it differently. This one is in Alabama but Oregon is the original location.
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Old 02-24-2020, 12:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thechrisbart View Post
Ahh, I get it! So as long as Im keeping an eye on the actual oil level, I should be able to delete the switch no problem right?
Correct!
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